SWMM82

How long have the performance schools and Project Brave been in existence? We’ve got to give it time before we reap the benefits! Jack Harper wasn’t even developed in this country!😝

Yeah I saw that, other ones to look out for are Dean Campbell and Ethan Ross at Aberdeen, Nathan Paterson and Mebude (fae Govan) and McPake at Rangers, Anthony McDonald at Hearts, just to name a few....... all either 16/17 years old. We’ve also developed Dembele but it’s still up in the air who he will end up playing international football for if he fulfils his potential.

BUT they need to get the opportunities to play....... Hearts stopped the Celtic unbeaten run, playing a 16 year old from the start.... and he was one of the best players on the park!

One of the main problems for a number of years now has been first team opportunities. How many of the squad that made the UEFA U19 championships final in 2006 went onto play at any decent level....... Dorrans and Steven Fletcher maybe?? And look at the current SPL the now....... one of our problem areas is up front for example...... list the teams and tell me who plays up front for them? I think only Brophy, shaw and obv griffiths get games! And Shaw is nowhere near good enough!

Forrest had a decent first half, caused them problems down the right, but faded badly in the second half like most of the team. I would give him another chance against a lesser quality team, where he will see more of the ball in forward areas. Him and Fraser should both play in my opinion.

This. No need to put an even more negative spin on things. I would put it more down to quality football players with better touch and awareness making the game look easier. Pogba is a prime example of this.

It wasn’t exactly a full strength Scottish team either to be fair

The commentators aren’t half the prophets of doom eh.... Not that we give them much to be positive about

I didn’t no, but it’s the younger age groups I was referring to. From what I’ve seen of the likes of Cadden, Campbell, Mallan etc. I don’t think they are ever going to be full international quality. It’s no coincidence that probably our best player in the u21s is Billy Gilmour at 17 years old. Lewis Ferguson has just turned 19 and starting for Aberdeen. Hornby again is only 18 and could still play at u19 level. Ryan Porteous is arguably our best defender in that squad, and he is still only 19 and starting for Hibs. Maybe I am overly optimistic, but much better signs in my opinion.

Haha you are indeed very pessimistic, and I don’t blame you in the current climate. But, the players we are producing at age group level now, don’t only compete and get results against some of the top nations, we also play possession football against them. And even at 16/17/18 years old some of these boys are getting first team exposure, Cochrane at Hearts is injured at the moment, but Levein has already said he’s the best midfielder at the club.

This has been happening though, we are already seeing a difference at age group level with technically better players coming through. This is particularly evident at U17/U18 level. It’s not all doom and gloom, and while am not saying we are going to churn them out like Belgium have recently, we will be a much more competitive national team in the next 5-10 years.

For me the players should be going out there to right some of the wrongs from Thursday night and at the very least put in a performance with a bit of heart and pride for the jersey. But I fear that might be too much to ask of modern pampered footballers.

This 100%! Think about the players 20+ years who never got capped, but would’ve probably done anything to represent our country.

They should’ve at least given him the opportunity to show his credentials instead of publicly ruling him out before the match.

I mentioned this in another thread, but the whole situation with Malky Mackay, ruling him out before he had even taken the full team once, was another example of bad misjudgement. We actually looked refreshingly good in a lot of aspects of that game, and it was a very young positive squad.

I agree with that sentiment to an extent. I didn’t grudge McDonald starting against Albania. But when it was clear replacing him with Armstrong had a positive affect on the team and performance in the second half, he should’ve opted for Armstrong against Israel.

That was a straight change in personnel though, the system wasn’t altered at all, we needed an outlet and some pace going forward in the second half. I was at the Albania game, and as BLG said above, Armstrong made a huge difference in midfield, the ball was moving forwards quicker and there was some good link up play. You had none of that with McDonald in midfield. Armstrong is taking time to settle in at Southampton, as he did at Celtic, but there is no doubt he is a better player.

Am not saying we should get rid......yet! And am definitely not claiming he actually has an alcohol problem, am purely going by what some others have said. But things have quickly unravelled on and off the park, and it was clear to me the players weren’t happy on Thursday. That’s not only the fault of McLeish obviously, the players shoulder a massive part of the blame, but a manager needs to be proactive, recognise that a system isn’t working, and make changes accordingly. It was clear at half time there needed to be changes despite being ahead, but it never happened. That is entirely McLeish’s fault.

For me the problem runs a lot deeper than tactical and selection errors though......for me there is something really not right with McLeish himself..... you just have to listen to his post match interview. An alcohol problem has been mentioned.......i really hope that’s not the case though!

And though still not in the same league as Davie Cooper, even wee Faddy wasn’t the paciest. He had his good moments too........

They might not be the quickest when it comes to top speed, but that 5-10 yard burst of acceleration to get past a defender, Forrest and Fraser both have! Its the speed of thought which is the biggest issue with some of our players.

Ah so that’s why we almost beat England......we were playing with an extra man.....😜

I’ve alluded to this too. Also, even from a young age, we seem to have a major inferiority complex when it comes to international football. I remember reading an article in the paper last year in the run up to the Under 17 European Championships, which we had qualified unbeaten for...... Scot Gemmill was in charge at the time I believe, and the mentality going into the competition was that we would “cope”?? For me, that is the completely wrong attitude and mentality..... we are going into the championships, even at a young age, looking up to the Germany’s and England’s rather than believing we can go and beat them! Ultimately it was a last minute goal from France that put us out! But we were there on merit and need to start believing in ourselves from a young age that we can not only just live with the top tier nations, but also defeat them!

It’s a moot point, because we are stuck with McLeish, like it or not, but when Malky Mackay took charge for the friendly against the Dutch, I thought the team had a genuine freshness about it, young players playing with energy and dynamism, despite the defeat. It’s easy to say with the benefit of hindsight, but I would’ve stuck with Mackay. McLeish, as many have said, is a dinosaur, and the persistence to stick with players that have failed from qualification to qualification baffles me.

Game of two halves???!!!! Come oan Eck...... we were outplayed and pish from the start!!