Indy Ref 2

[hampden_loon2878]

A bit gutted regarding the scotwind licensing yes theres a down payment of 700million however this seems tiny in the grand scheme of thing, why on earth did the SG pull the plug on a National energy company. Such an opportunity missed  

[scotlad]

48 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

A bit gutted regarding the scotwind licensing yes theres a down payment of 700million however this seems tiny in the grand scheme of thing, why on earth did the SG pull the plug on a National energy company. Such an opportunity missed  

I've just been reading about that. Very disappointing. Maybe I'm oversimplifying things but it seems like Scotland's wind energy potential is being sold off on the cheap.

[hampden_loon2878]

8 hours ago, scotlad said:

I've just been reading about that. Very disappointing. Maybe I'm oversimplifying things but it seems like Scotland's wind energy potential is being sold off on the cheap.

thats exactly whats happened, remember when we used to say Westminster sold out the oil industry? well thats exactly whats happened here, this really is a sickner. we cant blame westminster here, its our own.   it seems shetland are on the right track with it 

 

https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.shetnews.co.uk%2F2022%2F01%2F17%2Frelief-as-shetland-miss-out-on-major-offshore-wind-development%2F%3Ffbclid%3DIwAR38HhovpTqcIg2NpQaG-UyyiCVZvUGNtfNaOP5_bXUHkNO9NBYitHEJrxY&h=AT33QCH-8gJHEoWFz0shTDzvicBEnS5KeruHNyTicyk2qnXKrdMwl7UIDQFJOGlQwTzZ5MViB7TdW5ECu_Vcw-KfI8EK9Hi1YEsomPTRltBs6J3DGBU9Sd_ripAI2eY1zLY-&__tn__=%2CmH-R&c[0]=AT08udeRNqgGtMRZQe478dBzqQM6Wgif36DLfod3DNbdbcCQo05Ef_uCI90kCcqlhDBBzpXq3QNKfMZeRC0JkiF9mKZgNzBbhK9PKSkKjheCIulxg6DYbWO4kMukw3qfV8UDjC_6A7Og2c0aS6HHJcnV1iqVR1lLxpEfZWTid8ZZffyDjt0-KiZi2CKH7BChUMbD34TCAq97XQ

[vanderark14]

12 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

thats exactly whats happened, remember when we used to say Westminster sold out the oil industry? well thats exactly whats happened here, this really is a sickner. we cant blame westminster here, its our own.   it seems shetland are on the right track with it 

 

https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.shetnews.co.uk%2F2022%2F01%2F17%2Frelief-as-shetland-miss-out-on-major-offshore-wind-development%2F%3Ffbclid%3DIwAR38HhovpTqcIg2NpQaG-UyyiCVZvUGNtfNaOP5_bXUHkNO9NBYitHEJrxY&h=AT33QCH-8gJHEoWFz0shTDzvicBEnS5KeruHNyTicyk2qnXKrdMwl7UIDQFJOGlQwTzZ5MViB7TdW5ECu_Vcw-KfI8EK9Hi1YEsomPTRltBs6J3DGBU9Sd_ripAI2eY1zLY-&__tn__=%2CmH-R&c[0]=AT08udeRNqgGtMRZQe478dBzqQM6Wgif36DLfod3DNbdbcCQo05Ef_uCI90kCcqlhDBBzpXq3QNKfMZeRC0JkiF9mKZgNzBbhK9PKSkKjheCIulxg6DYbWO4kMukw3qfV8UDjC_6A7Og2c0aS6HHJcnV1iqVR1lLxpEfZWTid8ZZffyDjt0-KiZi2CKH7BChUMbD34TCAq97XQ

HL do you like fitba? Booze? A good meal? Running? Music? Knitting? Or anything? Just curious because I've never see you discuss anything except the SNP or Independence  

Edited January 18 by vanderark14

[hampden_loon2878]

1 minute ago, vanderark14 said:

HL do you like fitba? Booze? A good meal? Running? Music? Knitting? Or anything? Just curious because I've never see you discuss anything except the SNP or Independence  

aye go to all the scotland home games, occasional away games,, like to play football, golf and walk Munroe's,, thats what i do when i am not with the bairns or offshore

[vanderark14]

Just now, hampden_loon2878 said:

aye go to all the scotland home games, occasional away games,, like to play football, golf and walk Munroe's,, thats what i do when i am not with the bairns or offshore

Do you play for anyone in the North East?

I used to play for Crimond when they had a team. 

[Alibi]

9 hours ago, scotlad said:

I've just been reading about that. Very disappointing. Maybe I'm oversimplifying things but it seems like Scotland's wind energy potential is being sold off on the cheap.

Agreed.  I saw an analysis somewhere that suggested that the money being paid for these franchises would be recovered by the companies involved in 40 days of wind generation, although I think that excludes the actual cost of the infrastructure which will be substantial.  That's crazy.  This looks like de facto privatisation of our renewable resources.  It's almost as if Sturgeon is deliberately trying to sabotage the Scottish economy by going with this pathetic deal.  Maybe it needs a lot of private capital to implement this but surely there is some scope to have a public investment in these resources at least in part?  Rather than flog off the family jewels, maybe the government should take a leaf out of Norway's book as they seem to be exploiting their natural resources far better for the benefit of their population.

[hampden_loon2878]

1 hour ago, vanderark14 said:

Do you play for anyone in the North East?

I used to play for Crimond when they had a team. 

stop the armatures around 8 years ago, shift work away was bad for the belly haha, played for link up all through the youths and a brief spell at the juniors. I mostly played for st.combs and bilger in the armatures,, i miss the fitba on a Saturday then watching the scores come in after the game, its a summer league now so its not the same.. crimond started their team back up for a while and tried to get me to play for them but my fitness was rubbish at the time so decided against it.

[hampden_loon2878]

1 hour ago, Alibi said:

Agreed.  I saw an analysis somewhere that suggested that the money being paid for these franchises would be recovered by the companies involved in 40 days of wind generation, although I think that excludes the actual cost of the infrastructure which will be substantial.  That's crazy.  This looks like de facto privatisation of our renewable resources.  It's almost as if Sturgeon is deliberately trying to sabotage the Scottish economy by going with this pathetic deal.  Maybe it needs a lot of private capital to implement this but surely there is some scope to have a public investment in these resources at least in part?  Rather than flog off the family jewels, maybe the government should take a leaf out of Norway's book as they seem to be exploiting their natural resources far better for the benefit of their population.

it goes against everything the party ever stood for, i cant get my head around it

[aaid]

A few facts for the usual suspects.

1. Scotland is not yet an independent country and so the government cannot behave in the same way as governments in independent countries do, eg, Norway. 
2. Energy policy and taxation of energy, either producers or consumers is reserved to Westminster.
3. The SG has very limited borrowing powers to fund capital infrastructure investment, which I suspect wouldn’t come close to funding building these massive offshore wind farms.

With those facts in mind, how exactly do people suggesting that the SG would build a network publicly owned wind power farms?

The auction for these leases was carried out by the Crown Estates as the sea bed in territorial waters belongs to the Crown.  I’m not aware to what extent the SG had any input into this process or whether the CE commissioners were directed by the UKG.  Even if the SG had run the whole thing itself, the same basic facts apply as to what and how far they could go.

Fortunately, the revenues from the Crown Estates in Scotland was one of the things that was devolved and so the revenue from these leases goes to the SG rather than to the UKG.

The leases are only one source of revenue to the SG, and cost to the suppliers.   There’s obviously a much wider potential benefit to Scotland in the supply chain for both manufacture, servicing, operations and maintenance and it’s important that as much as possible as that is onshore, ie in Scotland, and generates revenue both directly and indirectly.

Once these are operational then there’s obviously an opportunity for ongoing revenues from taxation however under the current constitutional arrangements, these would flow to the Treasury and not to the Scottish Government.

Obviously “It’s Scotland’s Wind” will be a major topic in any forthcoming independence referendum and interested parties can put forwards their visions at that point.

However people who are criticising the SG for not doing something that they do not have the power to do need to take a reality check.

 

[hampden_loon2878]

1 hour ago, aaid said:

A few facts for the usual suspects.

1. Scotland is not yet an independent country and so the government cannot behave in the same way as governments in independent countries do, eg, Norway. 
2. Energy policy and taxation of energy, either producers or consumers is reserved to Westminster.
3. The SG has very limited borrowing powers to fund capital infrastructure investment, which I suspect wouldn’t come close to funding building these massive offshore wind farms.

With those facts in mind, how exactly do people suggesting that the SG would build a network publicly owned wind power farms?

The auction for these leases was carried out by the Crown Estates as the sea bed in territorial waters belongs to the Crown.  I’m not aware to what extent the SG had any input into this process or whether the CE commissioners were directed by the UKG.  Even if the SG had run the whole thing itself, the same basic facts apply as to what and how far they could go.

Fortunately, the revenues from the Crown Estates in Scotland was one of the things that was devolved and so the revenue from these leases goes to the SG rather than to the UKG.

The leases are only one source of revenue to the SG, and cost to the suppliers.   There’s obviously a much wider potential benefit to Scotland in the supply chain for both manufacture, servicing, operations and maintenance and it’s important that as much as possible as that is onshore, ie in Scotland, and generates revenue both directly and indirectly.

Once these are operational then there’s obviously an opportunity for ongoing revenues from taxation however under the current constitutional arrangements, these would flow to the Treasury and not to the Scottish Government.

Obviously “It’s Scotland’s Wind” will be a major topic in any forthcoming independence referendum and interested parties can put forwards their visions at that point.

However people who are criticising the SG for not doing something that they do not have the power to do need to take a reality check.

 

Aye you are right tbh its just a horrible situation of history repeating itself, are there any strings attached  to the windfarms with regards to retaining jobs within scotland or local economy? 

[aaid]

6 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

Aye you are right tbh its just a horrible situation of history repeating itself, are there any strings attached  to the windfarms with regards to retaining jobs within scotland or local economy? 

The obvious things to focus on are making sure that as much of the work as possible is done in Scotland and baking this into the economic case for Independence.   The obvious difference between now and the 1970s is that while we're not there yet, we're a lot lot closer and to many, even the opponents, Independence is a much more realistic prospect.

[hampden_loon2878]

looking at all the windfarm sites, it really does hit home how much the scottish/uk econemy relies on the northsea and north east. renewables, fish, agricultural and hydrocarbon rich, whilst never receiving the full benefits from it 

[Alibi]

5 hours ago, aaid said:

A few facts for the usual suspects.

1. Scotland is not yet an independent country and so the government cannot behave in the same way as governments in independent countries do, eg, Norway. 
2. Energy policy and taxation of energy, either producers or consumers is reserved to Westminster.
3. The SG has very limited borrowing powers to fund capital infrastructure investment, which I suspect wouldn’t come close to funding building these massive offshore wind farms.

With those facts in mind, how exactly do people suggesting that the SG would build a network publicly owned wind power farms?

The auction for these leases was carried out by the Crown Estates as the sea bed in territorial waters belongs to the Crown.  I’m not aware to what extent the SG had any input into this process or whether the CE commissioners were directed by the UKG.  Even if the SG had run the whole thing itself, the same basic facts apply as to what and how far they could go.

Fortunately, the revenues from the Crown Estates in Scotland was one of the things that was devolved and so the revenue from these leases goes to the SG rather than to the UKG.

The leases are only one source of revenue to the SG, and cost to the suppliers.   There’s obviously a much wider potential benefit to Scotland in the supply chain for both manufacture, servicing, operations and maintenance and it’s important that as much as possible as that is onshore, ie in Scotland, and generates revenue both directly and indirectly.

Once these are operational then there’s obviously an opportunity for ongoing revenues from taxation however under the current constitutional arrangements, these would flow to the Treasury and not to the Scottish Government.

Obviously “It’s Scotland’s Wind” will be a major topic in any forthcoming independence referendum and interested parties can put forwards their visions at that point.

However people who are criticising the SG for not doing something that they do not have the power to do need to take a reality check.

 

Thanks for that.  I'm maybe being over-critical of the SG in this then - however they don't seem to be making much fuss about being hamstrung.  I doubt Alex Salmond would have accepted this with as little fuss as NS seems to be doing.  she needs to grow a pair - maybe that explains the GRA proposals... 

[Orraloon]

48 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

looking at all the windfarm sites, it really does hit home how much the scottish/uk econemy relies on the northsea and north east. renewables, fish, agricultural and hydrocarbon rich, whilst never receiving the full benefits from it 

You could start up a new party? Independence for Teuchterland?

[scotlad]

2 hours ago, Alibi said:

Thanks for that.  I'm maybe being over-critical of the SG in this then - however they don't seem to be making much fuss about being hamstrung.  I doubt Alex Salmond would have accepted this with as little fuss as NS seems to be doing.  she needs to grow a pair - maybe that explains the GRA proposals... 

😂

[hampden_loon2878]

17 hours ago, Orraloon said:

You could start up a new party? Independence for Teuchterland?

nah as that would kill the Scottish independence debate dead as where would the finances come for a indy scotland

[scotlad]

I see the Brent crude price has hit the $90 a barrel mark for the first time since 2014.

Nae wonder Labour are pushing a windfall tax on oil and gas as a viable solution.

[hampden_loon2878]

12 hours ago, scotlad said:

I see the Brent crude price has hit the $90 a barrel mark for the first time since 2014.

Nae wonder Labour are pushing a windfall tax on oil and gas as a viable solution.

Things are falling into place for what should be a very strong case for independence, O&G receipts should sky rocket, renewables kicking off, Westminster in total free fall, the conditions could not better,, the snp need to now focus on independence, stop cowering to the woke infiltrators, distance themselves from the greens and do whats best for independence.

[scotlad]

7 hours ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

Things are falling into place for what should be a very strong case for independence, O&G receipts should sky rocket, renewables kicking off, Westminster in total free fall, the conditions could not better,, the snp need to now focus on independence, stop cowering to the woke infiltrators, distance themselves from the greens and do whats best for independence.

Aye, things are coming to a boil nicely. My concern is they'll pass this opportunity up though. 😕

[hampden_loon2878]

On 1/29/2022 at 2:53 PM, scotlad said:

Aye, things are coming to a boil nicely. My concern is they'll pass this opportunity up though. 😕

the best thing that could happen is that johnson remains in his post for at least another year,, all the conditions are lining up perfectly, my only fear is the current snp who lets face it, will be leading the campaign are so damaged in certain corners of the voting public will turn indy sympathetic voters away,,, the campaign needs to be more than the snp,brexit or the "climate emergency"

[hampden_loon2878]

UK domestic energy bills will jump 54% from April, households are already suffering a cost-of-living squeeze that’s only set to get worse.Sturgeons stance on the cambo field has not aged well has it? With that stance she has missed a huge opportunity to say a independent Scotland would be gas/energy sufficient. The platform work on supplies 7% of the uk gas needs, that would be around 70% of all of scotlands requirements.What a idiotic stance 

[aaid]

52 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

UK domestic energy bills will jump 54% from April, households are already suffering a cost-of-living squeeze that’s only set to get worse.Sturgeons stance on the cambo field has not aged well has it? With that stance she has missed a huge opportunity to say a independent Scotland would be gas/energy sufficient. The platform work on supplies 7% of the uk gas needs, that would be around 70% of all of scotlands requirements.What a idiotic stance 

Serious question - assuming the licenses were to be granted today, when would Cambo be fully onstream?

[Alibi]

1 hour ago, aaid said:

Serious question - assuming the licenses were to be granted today, when would Cambo be fully onstream?

A quick google suggests on stream about 2024.

[hampden_loon2878]

4 hours ago, aaid said:

Serious question - assuming the licenses were to be granted today, when would Cambo be fully onstream?

Would be a good couple of year, 2024 would be ambitious, i would say more like 2025/6 going full steam ahead