Refugee Crisis

[Mox]

I am sure most, if not all of us have seen the picture of the three old boy lying lifeless on a turkish beach today as he and his family unsuccessfully attempted to reach Europe.

It seems to me a complete outrage that Britains position is not to take on more refugees ( Although I don't believe we have taken that many anyway) but to focus on 'trying to resolve the conflict in Syria'.

Surely we must do more? The fact that Germany is taking on 800,000 is the symbol of a caring, understanding and thoughtful nation and one that puts Britain to shame. Is there anything the scottish government can do, independent of Westminster to take on any number of refugees?

In addition, the pre election immigration narrative by UKIP, Tories, the national press and even some Labour politicians has led to a situation where the government is frightened to take on refugees for fear of recriminations at the polls. Surely, the people of Britain are are not all heartless, or maybe we are populated by a majority of khunts? It would seem ever increasingly thats it's the latter.

[Toepoke]

Agreed, how many more people would've died in WW2 if we hadn't taken refugees in? How many more would we have taken knowing what happened?

Puts our recent political squabbles into perspective. These people must be fukkin desperate. Having to leave their homes with nothing, hard to imagine being in that position.

Edited September 2, 2015 by Toepoke

[rabmania]

Hear hear.

[Dalgety Bay TA]

It's a very difficult to see a realistic solution to this crisis IMO. By rights refugees are meant to claim asylum in the first EU country they land in. But there is no way Italy, Hungary or Greece especially can cope with the numbers involved. Hence the dispersal into the rest of Europe.

The other issue I see is given the huge numbers involved, where on earth do you put these numbers of people? Germany is a big country but surely even it doesn't have the infrastructure or facilities to take care of another 800,000 people just like that? So do they all end up in camps like the Calais situation, is that anyway to live? Ok it's probably far better than being under threat of death in their home countries but longer term you cant expect the numbers and especially families and small children to live in those conditions....in whatever country they end up in.

Notice I haven't actually answered your original question. That's because I truthfully don't know the answer. I just don't know how any country can handle the numbers involved here. Some are doing so and worrying about how to handle it all later, some, like UK, want to work out how to handle this before taking in refugees. I really don't know what's the best option. Morally I think we should but logistically it seems mental to look at the numbers involved.

Edited September 2, 2015 by Dalgety Bay TA

[Mox]

It's a very difficult to see a realistic solution to this crisis IMO. By rights refugees are meant to claim asylum in the first EU country they land in. But there is no way Italy, Hungary or Greece especially can cope with the numbers involved. Hence the dispersal into the rest of Europe.

The other issue I see is given the huge numbers involved, where on earth do you put these numbers of people? Germany is a big country but surely even it doesn't have the infrastructure or facilities to take care of another 800,000 people just like that? So do they all end up in camps like the Calais situation, is that anyway to live? Ok it's probably far better than being under threat of death in their home countries but longer term you cant expect the numbers and especially families and small children to live in those conditions....in whatever country they end up in.

Notice I haven't actually answered your original question. That's because I truthfully don't know the answer. I just don't know how any country can handle the numbers involved here. Some are doing so and worrying about how to handle it all later, some, like UK, want to work out how to handle this before taking in refugees. I really don't know what's the best option. Morally I think we should but logistically it seems mental to look at the numbers involved.

Whilst Germany's stance should be applauded, they should not have to shoulder this problem all on their own and I agree it will have a huge impact on their infrastructure and possibly create tensions within communities given the huge numbers rising. Europe is a big place and each country should take a reasonable amount and the fact that Britain has refused to take any refugees is shameful.

[Squirrelhumper]

Need to do more. Especially as we're highly responsible for the instability in these countries.

[Martin63]

Whilst Germany's stance should be applauded, they should not have to shoulder this problem all on their own and I agree it will have a huge impact on their infrastructure and possibly create tensions within communities given the huge numbers rising. Europe is a big place and each country should take a reasonable amount and the fact that Britain has refused to take any refugees is shameful.

A hard subject. Yes the UK should indeed do more - historically we have but the Tory government will see this as a vote loser, not a vote winner.

Germany's taking an admirable lead but we cannot ignore the fact that along with Italy and Japan they have one of the most rapidly aging populations in the world. So in the longer term migrants will benefit them and cities like Berlin still have a smaller population now than they did pre 1939.

[Dalgety Bay TA]

Whilst Germany's stance should be applauded, they should not have to shoulder this problem all on their own and I agree it will have a huge impact on their infrastructure and possibly create tensions within communities given the huge numbers rising. Europe is a big place and each country should take a reasonable amount and the fact that Britain has refused to take any refugees is shameful.

I do find Cameron's suggest that we should help "stabilise" these countries almost laughable if it wasn't so ironic. These people are fleeing these countries due to the ripple effect of revolution spreading through the area on the back of US/UK toppling Sadam and destabilising the region. Yes thee were some pretty horrific dictators in that part of the world but now the entire area is just one huge war zone and people fleeing it. For our part in putting those wheels in motion we should be shipping them in.

[Toepoke]

cities like Berlin still have a smaller population now than they did pre 1939.

Scotland's had the same population for a century. Plenty of space here...

Edited September 2, 2015 by Toepoke

[ShedTA]

Need to do more. Especially as we're highly responsible for the instability in these countries.

Exactly. Cameron talking about fixing the problems in Syria but actually doing f*ck all about it.

[iainmac1]

David Cameron says the way to stop the refugee crisis, and in turn children washing up on beaches, is to bring peace to their countries.

I think you'll find Dave that the UK bringing 'peace' to oil rich nations is partly the reason it's happening in the first place.

Edited September 2, 2015 by iainmac1

[Ally Bongo]

From The Sun

[TartanDave]

Be nice if we could show some form of support on Monday night at hampden. A banner? Collection boxes or something? In the grand scheme of things it wouldn't make a lot of difference I know.

[Kirk]

Need to do more. Especially as we're highly responsible for the instability in these countries.

Correct.

Cameron is a scumbag.

The EU needs to come together and take an even share of refugees. More than happy for them to come to Scotland.

The amount of horrible racist things I've seen on fb though is very unsettling.

[Auchinyell Sox Change]

Be nice if we could show some form of support on Monday night at hampden. A banner? Collection boxes or something? In the grand scheme of things it wouldn't make a lot of difference I know.

Throw some inflatable boats on the pitch

[Hertsscot]

The biggest condemnation of the Tories under Thatcher was they just didn't seem to care. The likes of Cameron are IDS are her spiritual heirs, if you're poor, if you're vulnerable, home or abroad, they don't appear to give a damn.

[EddardStark]

David Cameron's position on this issue makes me ashamed to call myself British.

Edited September 3, 2015 by EddardStark

[Bristolhibby]

Throw some inflatable boats on the pitch

Feckin poor mate. Have a word.

J

[Dillinger]

Need to do more. Especially as we're highly responsible for the instability in these countries.

Spot on.

There seems to be a lot of groups popping up who are going to send donations to Calais to help. I suspect the British people will do more than the British government.

If anyone wants added to the Ayrshire group, let me know.

[Ally Bongo]

Feckin poor mate. Have a word.

J

Doubt he will

He has previous on the same topic

[brant grebner]

Why should the TA have one united opinion on this?

This is the biggest issue facing the West in our lifetime.

There's no right and wrong answer here.

On one hand, my heart goes out to all of these people doing whatever they can to make a better future for themselves and I wish them both the best fortune and no ill will.

On the other hand, rather than "genuine asylum seekers" they're predominantly economic migrants determined to hit a top Scanders country or the UK.

And they're Muslim to boot.

Within them there's a nominal number of Wahhabi nut jobs.

7/7 apart, at least England has Mo Farah out of that mob.

At best, we've got Islam Feruz with his fake jock accent and unless he scores 20 plus goals this season, we should be limiting the mozzers here at every opportunity

And before some poofy know-nothing PC ####wit starts saying "that's anti-Islamic", firstly I've got a lot of Muslim family.

I grew up in the Middle East and was educated in a (Sunni) Muslim school.

I've been in more mosques than I have cathedrals and I have no more of an issue with Islam per se than I do with any other Abrahamic form of delusion.

The problem is Wahhabism not Sunnism - it's the most backward intolerant version of Islam going and it's spreading like a virus throughout the Muslim world. But we'll let them in and ignore them to assuage our privilege.

[hunchy]

To an extent this is a no win situation for the government ( no matter if it was Tory, labour or whoever). If they had put boots on the ground in siria they would still have got the blame for the refugees from there and because they didn't put boots on the ground they are to blame for the refugees.

I do think the UK could take more refugees in but one problem is they in the main seem to go to the same area thus stretching the resources in those areas if there was some way to spread them out more then you wouldn't get the same tensions rising in areas. Down here in the Peterborough area and around the fens there has been a massive influx of non UK people which is very much stretching infrastructure but yet there are areas such as most of Scotland who could cope with more people no problem. As an example of how hard it is here there is one school in Peterborough that has to try and deal with roughly 90 different languages with English being a second language to them.

I don't think there is any easy solution and it is not black and white like some are trying to make out but there has to be more done

[Alibi]

Be nice if we could show some form of support on Monday night at hampden. A banner? Collection boxes or something? In the grand scheme of things it wouldn't make a lot of difference I know.

I saw something on twitter about German fans at league games displaying banners which read "Refugees Welcome".

[wellyman]

The problem starts with the way the Americans have made the whole region unstable from Libya across to Iraq and Syria. They as usual have gone in got what they want and then fecked off, leaving the various countries in a state of civil war. The Uk and some other European countries were involved but on a much smaller scale but it is Europe who now have the refugee problem.

A lot of the refugee's are men aged between late teens and into there 40's , that mainly shows that they are ex-soldiers or people from one armed group or another that have ended up on the wrong or losing side, basically a case of "feck u Ahmed i am out of here" and lets get to Europe. Not only that but within that group there will a number of terrorists who in the future will do there various acts across Europe.

As for the real refugees, i am sure if you asked them they would prefer to be in there own homes in there own countries but due to the interference and western policies our governments have now got to stand-up and be counted and accommodate these people until the day they can return home.

There is no easy solution to this but we cannot standby and say "its feck all to do with us" and turn our backs on them, especially when we were the main cause in the first place.

[Toepoke]

David Cameron's position on this issue makes me ashamed to call myself British.

Even the UKIP guy on GMS there was giving him pelters!