64 team World Cup

[phil]

 

How does anyone feel about this prospect? I see FIFA is now ‘heavily weighing’ as to opposed to just ‘weighing’ (a few days ago) the possibility. On the face of it , it is mad, of course, and you wonder if the whole thing is becoming so inflated it’s in danger of bursting. But if the choice is between 48 and 64, then there are advantages to the latter. The most conspicuous is that we could go back to two through from each first round group, with games played simultaneously, and no need for a Phd in mathematics to work out all the 3rd place scenarios. I’d love to see that. As to European qualifying, I think the continent could easily contribute another half dozen teams at least, of respectable quality (Denmark, Greece, Hungary, Italy, both Irelands, Wales, and others). I could imagine European qualifying with 11 groups of 5, top two through from each. No play-offs. It would be an absolute doddle for France, Spain, England etc, but then it already is. That, and a couple more from Africa and the Americas and Asia wouldn’t make much difference to overall quality, which is already very diluted. Not sure there is a huge difference between FIFA rankings in the 40s and 70s/80s. After the first round, it would be the same as 2026.

[Robbo `81]

If you're going to have 48, then you might as well have 64 imo. Top 2 in each group qualify.

 

But with one proviso, I would like to see 2, or more, games played at same time, not necessarily from same group, during the 1st 2 group games for each team.

 

As others have said this World Cup seemed to take forever, and that was with 12 groups playing one game at a time, 16 groups would be even worse

[biffer]

If you do this, as I said on another thread, a big whack of the extra teams will go to Asia. It's nothing to do with a better structured tournament, representation of small countries or anything else. The only reason Infantino wants this is to get China into the World Cup Finals. 

A 64 team World Cup makes it virtually impossible for anyone other than the USA or Europe to host the tournament, mainly because of the requirement for 64 world class training facilities in one country / area. 

Of the extra spaces I reckon 6 or 7 would go to Asia, 3 or 4 to Africa, at most 2 to Uefa, one more to CONCACAF and CONMEBOL (would there be any point in South America even having a qualifying tournament anymore?) and then the remainder would be some utter horseshit of a global playoff tournament that some morons would wank themselves into a frenzy over. 

Europe should say no, fuck you, we're done with your shite. Withdraw from the World Cup and see how they get on for TV contracts and sponsorship when we're not there. 

 

[thelonehutch]

Go for it, it's great seeing countries and their fans getting to experience a world cup rather than just the usual suspects. 

[ThistleWhistle]

If they’re hell bent on doing it the whole thing would be better if they ran it as two separate tournaments.  Top dogs in the main 32 team tournament, top 2 through each group then last 16 usual format.  Would maintain the quality.

Diddy 32 in a World Shield ran exactly same time in same format but they get the shit ko times/ venues.

 

 

[Toepoke]

It's a neater format than 48 teams, but a lot of games to fit into the group stage.

Big strain on resources for the hosts though, it'll be some laugh hosting 64 squads in Saudi Arabia.

 

[bahookie]

9 hours ago, biffer said:

If you do this, as I said on another thread, a big whack of the extra teams will go to Asia. It's nothing to do with a better structured tournament, representation of small countries or anything else. The only reason Infantino wants this is to get China into the World Cup Finals. 

 

Fair comment, although I'd supplement that opinion with that it isn't just the vast sponsorship & tv revenue from China he is after. To a lesser extent it will be India also. Below is copied from: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_dependencies_by_population

Further there's a bunch of countries with huge populations who 'Infantilo' will see as a prospectively lucrative cash cows. Even countries with low current average disposable incomes, the sheer numbers of the population will be attractive targets to him for tv/sponsorship revenue. He will also view involving these "markets" in the world cup as an opportunity to stimulate long term interest in football there.
 

India	1,429,404,000	17.3%	1 Jul 2026	Official projection[4]	[b]
China	1,404,890,000	17.0%	31 Dec 2025	Official estimate[5]	[c]
United States	341,784,857	4.1%	1 Jul 2025	Official estimate[6]	[d]
Indonesia	288,315,089	3.5%	31 Dec 2025	National annual projection[7]
Pakistan	241,499,431	2.9%	1 Mar 2023	2023 census result[8]	[e]
Nigeria	223,800,000	2.7%	1 Jul 2023	Official projection[9]
Brazil	213,421,037	2.6%	1 Jul 2025	Official estimate[10]
Bangladesh	169,828,911	2.1%	14 Jun 2022	2022 census result[11]	[f]
Russia	146,028,325	1.8%	1 Jan 2025	Official estimate[13]	[g]
Mexico	131,150,866	1.6%	31 Mar 2026	National quarterly estimate[14]
Japan	122,850,000	1.5%	1 Jun 2026	Monthly national estimate[15]
Philippines	114,123,600	1.4%	1 Jul 2025	Official projection[16]
Democratic Republic of the Congo	112,832,000	1.4%	1 Jul 2025	UN projection[17]
Ethiopia	111,652,998	1.4%	1 Jul 2025	National annual projection[18]
Egypt	108,613,296	1.3%	1 Jan 2026	Official estimate[19]
Vietnam	102,300,000	1.2%	31 Dec 2025	Official estimate[20]

[phil]

Interesting comments. To clarify, I think 64 is awful, but just maybe slightly less awful than 48. And I agree that UEFA have got to start standing up to FIFA. European nations may only get one vote each in FIFA councils but they have considerably more clout commercially. If Infantino goes too far with his money drunk tinkering, the threat of a boycott would be devastating. The World Cup would be nothing without France, Spain, England, Portugal…

Use that power. If it goes to 64, the lion’s share of the extra 16 should be based on merit and thus European teams. 

As for hosts, it would definitely be limiting, but it seems very unlikely that a mid-sized nation will ever be considered again anyway.

Humorous related afterthought: instead of Shakira, Justin Bieber and BTS at the closing ceremony and their bland offerings, they should have got ABBA ‘Money, Money, Money’, what’s left of New Order ‘Getting away with it’ and Paul McCartney ‘Will you still love me when I’m 64?’. 

[bahookie]

"Humorous related afterthought: instead of Shakira, Justin Bieber and BTS at the closing ceremony and their bland offerings, they should have got ABBA ‘Money, Money, Money’, what’s left of New Order ‘Getting away with it’ and Paul McCartney ‘Will you still love me when I’m 64?’."

Always worth a listen.

Edited July 25 by bahookie

[biffer]

5 hours ago, bahookie said:

Fair comment, although I'd supplement that opinion with that it isn't just the vast sponsorship & tv revenue from China he is after. To a lesser extent it will be India also. Below is copied from: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_dependencies_by_population

Further there's a bunch of countries with huge populations who 'Infantilo' will see as a prospectively lucrative cash cows. Even countries with low current average disposable incomes, the sheer numbers of the population will be attractive targets to him for tv/sponsorship revenue. He will also view involving these "markets" in the world cup as an opportunity to stimulate long term interest in football there.
 

India	1,429,404,000	17.3%	1 Jul 2026	Official projection[4]	[b]
China	1,404,890,000	17.0%	31 Dec 2025	Official estimate[5]	[c]
United States	341,784,857	4.1%	1 Jul 2025	Official estimate[6]	[d]
Indonesia	288,315,089	3.5%	31 Dec 2025	National annual projection[7]
Pakistan	241,499,431	2.9%	1 Mar 2023	2023 census result[8]	[e]
Nigeria	223,800,000	2.7%	1 Jul 2023	Official projection[9]
Brazil	213,421,037	2.6%	1 Jul 2025	Official estimate[10]
Bangladesh	169,828,911	2.1%	14 Jun 2022	2022 census result[11]	[f]
Russia	146,028,325	1.8%	1 Jan 2025	Official estimate[13]	[g]
Mexico	131,150,866	1.6%	31 Mar 2026	National quarterly estimate[14]
Japan	122,850,000	1.5%	1 Jun 2026	Monthly national estimate[15]
Philippines	114,123,600	1.4%	1 Jul 2025	Official projection[16]
Democratic Republic of the Congo	112,832,000	1.4%	1 Jul 2025	UN projection[17]
Ethiopia	111,652,998	1.4%	1 Jul 2025	National annual projection[18]
Egypt	108,613,296	1.3%	1 Jan 2026	Official estimate[19]
Vietnam	102,300,000	1.2%	31 Dec 2025	Official estimate[20]

Yeah, and all the ones which don't get to the world cup are in asia. So guess where the extra spots will go. Despite the fact that most of the asuan teams were dross. 

[Toepoke]

China qualified in 2002 and I remember people saying at the time that they were going to be new force, but they exited goalless and pointless and never made it back.

FIFA could give Asia another half dozen places and China, India and Pakistan would still struggle to qualify.

[Toepoke]

Came across this clip last week, interesting seeing FIFA being criticised for diluting the competition and prioritising making money 44 years ago!

 

[biffer]

19 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

China qualified in 2002 and I remember people saying at the time that they were going to be new force, but they exited goalless and pointless and never made it back.

FIFA could give Asia another half dozen places and China, India and Pakistan would still struggle to qualify.

I know. Won't stop fifa trying though. 

[ceudmilefailte]

53 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

Came across this clip last week, interesting seeing FIFA being criticised for diluting the competition and prioritising making money 44 years ago!

 

Interesting stuff. 
Really should have stopped at 32 teams and 16 for Euros. 

[biffer]

However, only 109 teams entered qualifying for the 1982 World Cup, compared to 206 for 2026.

If you go back to 1966, given they like to talk about it so much, there were only 74 teams trying to get 16 places. 

[DoonTheSlope]

Ridiculous idea. It will certainly take away the feeling of achievement in qualifying when more and more teams are involved

All of this is just to try and shoehorn China and India into the tournament 

[Yosemite Sam]

1 hour ago, DoonTheSlope said:

Ridiculous idea. It will certainly take away the feeling of achievement in qualifying when more and more teams are involved

All of this is just to try and shoehorn China and India into the tournament 

It'll be just as hard for us to qualify, next to zero of those extra spots will be allocated to European teams

[Ally Bongo]

6 hours ago, Toepoke said:

Came across this clip last week, interesting seeing FIFA being criticised for diluting the competition and prioritising making money 44 years ago!

 

It was expanded to 32 teams from 24 at France 98 - 16 years later 

It was obvious why it had to go that way

It meant extra places for African, Asian and North American Associations 

The only way it could be reduced now is a reduction in the UEFA places as arguably the other associations have all caught up in standards 

That said - 64 teams is just booting the arse out of something that is already losing appeal 

[biffer]

12 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

It was expanded to 32 teams from 24 at France 98 - 16 years later 

It was obvious why it had to go that way

It meant extra places for African, Asian and North American Associations 

The only way it could be reduced now is a reduction in the UEFA places as arguably the other associations have all caught up in standards 

That said - 64 teams is just booting the arse out of something that is already losing appeal 

The other thing is that the distribution now is reasonably in line with standards (except for too many Asian spots). If its a xpanded again, and I'd prefer it wasn't, uefa needs at least sic or seven of the additional spots. 

[biffer]

I can also see something like 16 teams globally playing off for the last four spots if the expansion goes ahead. Mini tournaments in the March before the World Cup. 

[Toepoke]

4 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

The only way it could be reduced now is a reduction in the UEFA places as arguably the other associations have all caught up in standards 

Although 75% of the quarter finalists were UEFA teams. The African teams did really well, 9/10 getting out their groups, but most of their players are either European born or based.

 

[Ally Bongo]

16 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

Although 75% of the quarter finalists were UEFA teams. The African teams did really well, 9/10 getting out their groups, but most of their players are either European born or based.

 

True 

However all the UEFA play off qualifiers - Bosnia, Sweden. Turkey and the Czech Republic were utter shite and we were even worse 

There are the arguments for reducing the UEFA places if it ever came up 

[Toepoke]

I posted the numbers below on another thread recently and think it would be a reasonable spread of allocations for each confederation in a 64 team tournament...

 

UEFA 20 (+4)

Africa 15 (+5)

Asia 12 (+3)

CONCACAF 8 (+2)

South America 7 (+1)

Oceania 2 (+1)

 

 

[fringo]

2 hours ago, Toepoke said:

I posted the numbers below on another thread recently and think it would be a reasonable spread of allocations for each confederation in a 64 team tournament...

 

UEFA 20 (+4)

Africa 15 (+5)

Asia 12 (+3)

CONCACAF 8 (+2)

South America 7 (+1)

Oceania 2 (+1)

 

 

There's only 10 countries in south American area. It's already a disgrace they get 5 or 6 places.

[Malcolm]

please god no.  So boring.

i would rather go back to 1978 and have 16 than that.

at most 32 teams.  Eight sections of four.