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Indyref 2 (2)


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4 hours ago, TDYER63 said:

Though it pains me to say it , I do agree with Malcolm on what is needed to get the Yes vote over the line 🙂

We do not have enough centre-centre right people backing independence, we just haven’t. Far right of centre is not a government i would want anywhere near an independent Scotland, in the same way Malcolm does not want far left, but we do need more people in that political spectrum. Good news is I don’t think there are many far right in Scotland to win over, but there is definitely more centre/ centre right than some would care to admit. 

I feel the SNP fall short on people with strong business acumen. I think we need more talent and not only that people with the ability to convince others that we do. Even within the wider movement, not just the SNP. Inexperienced activists can only do so much, I am not going to convince Mr Tunnocks Teacake with my laymans knowledge and songs of purple heather on  yonder hills. 

We need more people to believe in what Scotland fundamentally has going for it. I know not everyone understands, or is the least bit interested, in politics and finance, but surely business people must see the valuable natural assets Scotland has. Too many people are happy with their own comfortable lifestyle to rock the boat in any shape or form. We need more business people onboard to convince people its worth the risk. 

Kind of like this then.

https://bylines.scot/economics/nicola-sturgeon-rallies-her-business-troops-in-glasgow/

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18 minutes ago, aaid said:

Yes exactly like that. But there needs to be more.  Business for Scotland have done a great job, I am glad they seem to be getting included more in SG strategy and in turn, hopefully more recognition generally . 

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Time to sack sturgeon

The SNP sack them all. The Tories should shut down Holyrood. Sack every one of them. And their advisors.

Bring back Alex Salmond to save Independence to stand up for women's rights. To bring in his own men to govern the country that's been captured by Sturgeon's sick perverted cabal. 

Sturgeon out. Protests at Bute House on Wednesday justified. 

Edited by Tartan_Tonna
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Education. In Sturgeon's woke Pariah Kingdom of Guilead.

Children are expelled for being gender traitors. 

Disgusting. 

Sturgeon out. The Murrells out. Patrick Harvie. Maggie Chapman. Rape enablers. 

The beasts of Bute House.

Nicola Sturgeon. Resign. 

Edited by Tartan_Tonna
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18 minutes ago, Och Aye said:

And incredibly managing to pull further ahead with that title. Hopefully his head will explode soon, it can't be far away tbh.

In all my time in this board I have honestly not seen anything like it. Is it an actual person? 😂 It must be on the verge of getting the boot. 

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46 minutes ago, Tartan_Tonna said:

 

 

Education. In Sturgeon's woke Pariah Kingdom of Guilead.

Children are expelled for being gender traitors. 

Disgusting. 

Sturgeon out. The Murrells out. Patrick Harvie. Maggie Chapman. Rape enablers. 

The beasts of Bute House.

Nicola Sturgeon. Resign. 


The pupil makes his point persistently but very well and calmly.  That guy will go far and is clearly right.

 It’s not for the Scottish government to tell people what’s an acceptable view.  interestingly the teacher made a point of saying he was enforcing national policy and not necessarily his own view.
 

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On 1/22/2023 at 5:09 PM, aaid said:

The criticism of the current process is that it is both lengthy and dehumanising, in particular having to receive a diagnosis that there is something “wrong” with you, that you have some sort of mental illness.

Right, so now people with mental illness shouldn't be diagnosed.  Think where that would lead logically.  Hundreds of folk with mental illness wandering the streets without receiving any treatment or help.  All because "feelz".

A lot of the gender extremists seem to have a penchant for violence.  Do you believe that's OK and nobody should raise any concerns about that?

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3 minutes ago, Alibi said:

Right, so now people with mental illness shouldn't be diagnosed.  Think where that would lead logically.  Hundreds of folk with mental illness wandering the streets without receiving any treatment or help.  All because "feelz".

A lot of the gender extremists seem to have a penchant for violence.  Do you believe that's OK and nobody should raise any concerns about that?

Do you think trans people are mentally ill?  That is certainly an extremely outdated position. 

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What's the stats on violence?

I know as a statistical sub-set trans people suffer violence and sexual violence at rates way disproportionally to the mean, as twice as likely to be a victime of crime. ONS(England Wales)

It's hard to find information of the perpetrators as opposed to the victims.

If we're going to cite science etc, then let's do it properly, fairly , empirically and in all cases.

 

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18 minutes ago, Alibi said:

Right, so now people with mental illness shouldn't be diagnosed.  Think where that would lead logically.  Hundreds of folk with mental illness wandering the streets without receiving any treatment or help.  All because "feelz".

A lot of the gender extremists seem to have a penchant for violence.  Do you believe that's OK and nobody should raise any concerns about that?

More of a medical condition, with potential for comorbidity mental health issues, depression and anxiety etc. 

The more I learn about this the more you have to sympathise with trans people (not extreme activists) and the need for immediate healthcare. 

Hopefully the SNP are doing this. 

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20 minutes ago, aaid said:

Do you think trans people are mentally ill?  That is certainly an extremely outdated position. 

I'm not a psychiatrist so not really my field, but what is gender dysphoria?  Call it a condition, or whatever you want to call it.  I think people should be given whatever help they need to deal with their life.  I don't think just ignoring it is the best way to go.  Quite why this has become a cause celebre around the world is a mystery, as is why Sturgeon is so obsessed by it (and let's not forget those craven MSPs applauding some rather weird people in the public gallery - what's that all about?)  Maybe ask Cole-Hamilton about that - he comes across as very creepy.

My main concern here is the damage that is being done to the indy movement.  I'm sure it is not a coincidence that this issue is being weaponised in Scotland much more than anywhere else.  My other concern is for the vast bulk of trans people who probably cringe when they see some of these violent aggressive "trans activists".  They deserve better.

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Just now, Alibi said:

 

My main concern here is the damage that is being done to the indy movement.  I'm sure it is not a coincidence that this issue is being weaponised in Scotland much more than anywhere else.

Unionists need no reason to cause damage to independence.

I said it earlier (a few pages back) and I will say it again. Denmark is highly ranked amongst the happiest countries in the world with low crime rate. And what a surprise they passed a Trans Gender bill in 2010.

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2 hours ago, Alibi said:

I'm not a psychiatrist so not really my field, but what is gender dysphoria?  Call it a condition, or whatever you want to call it.  I think people should be given whatever help they need to deal with their life.  I don't think just ignoring it is the best way to go.  Quite why this has become a cause celebre around the world is a mystery, as is why Sturgeon is so obsessed by it (and let's not forget those craven MSPs applauding some rather weird people in the public gallery - what's that all about?)  Maybe ask Cole-Hamilton about that - he comes across as very creepy.

My main concern here is the damage that is being done to the indy movement.  I'm sure it is not a coincidence that this issue is being weaponised in Scotland much more than anywhere else.  My other concern is for the vast bulk of trans people who probably cringe when they see some of these violent aggressive "trans activists".  They deserve better.

Until fairly recently there were plenty of people who used to describe homosexuality in the terms you are using.  

Thankfully, as a society, we are now starting to look at the 1%, 2%, 5% or 10% of the population who are attracted to the same sex, both sexes, process information differently or whatever as not having anything wrong with then and needing treatment, but - for want of a better phrase - simply being wired differently from the norm.

As for activists being violent, there seems to be a lot of name calling and treats being made - both viable and unviable - but there is - as far as I can see - very little in the way of *actual* violence.

That's not to say that name calling and making threats is acceptable, but there's also a load of faux outrage going around here.  One of the placards at the weekend that people are losing their shit about said something like "I'm going to eat Terfs", do people really believe that is a threat this is going to be actioned, I mean cannibalism, really?

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23 hours ago, PapofGlencoe said:

Sheer brain rot this, isn't it.  

A relative nobody is allegedly a wrong 'un.  This proves Sturgeon's "regime" has been "captured" and is a "cabal" of "peadophiles".  We have now been "told" the "dark secrets" of the "grooming".  We're only missing "satan worshippers" to complete the conspiracy.  He's turned into the Wing-Anon Shamon.

Has anyone listened to the podcast on the BBC sounds about the capitol riots?  Give it a listen, the language is strikingly similar.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's the kind of hysterical, OTT nonsense that he used to regularly and forensically tear to shreds when it was spewed out by one of Scotland's MSM hacks.

The question is, why is he now the one spewing out the nonsense? 🤔

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2 minutes ago, scotlad said:

It's the kind of hysterical, OTT nonsense that he used to regularly and forensically tear to shreds when it was spewed out by one of Scotland's MSM hacks.

The question is, why is he now the one spewing out the nonsense? 🤔

You can see that, I can see that, the strange thing is why do his acolytes that hang on his every word not see it?

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33 minutes ago, aaid said:

You can see that, I can see that, the strange thing is why do his acolytes that hang on his every word not see it?

people looking for easy answers to complex questions.  

they'll be shouting "Lock her up" to Sturgeon next.  mark my words.

46 minutes ago, aaid said:

Until fairly recently there were plenty of people who used to describe homosexuality in the terms you are using.  

Thankfully, as a society, we are now starting to look at the 1%, 2%, 5% or 10% of the population who are attracted to the same sex, both sexes, process information differently or whatever as not having anything wrong with then and needing treatment, but - for want of a better phrase - simply being wired differently from the norm.

As for activists being violent, there seems to be a lot of name calling and treats being made - both viable and unviable - but there is - as far as I can see - very little in the way of *actual* violence.

That's not to say that name calling and making threats is acceptable, but there's also a load of faux outrage going around here.  One of the placards at the weekend that people are losing their shit about said something like "I'm going to eat Terfs", do people really believe that is a threat this is going to be actioned, I mean cannibalism, really?

it seems to me this is all started from a false premise and we can't go back.  It's taken us organically and with political leadership a long time to degender everything from jobs, to law, to toys but now there's a push to gender identities.  People should live their lives in whatever conforming,  non-conforming or middle ground even if it breaks norms but not laws.  Not for anyone else to say one way or the other.  If anything it shows them as intellectually honest to live free.

What's a delusion is to literally believe you are "born in the wrong body" and literally are the other sex.  To me, that's a separate issue to the above and surely a delusion, if not a disorder?  but it's being conflated. 

you'd think we could get to a compromise people can live like a stereotypical women or whatever they want in 99.9% of the time but they know they can't access women sport or demand menopause treatment eh?  both debate extremes are too far gone, they see good and evil rather than people.  It's really poor.   

In fact i'm not even sure i believe all the above, it's just brain rot.  Seems to me there's a move away from gender stereotypes which is fine and dandy by me and will happen whether i like it or not.

I saw the article you quoted earlier and thought it set the scene really well.      

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4 minutes ago, PapofGlencoe said:

 

What's a delusion is to literally believe you are "born in the wrong body" and literally are the other sex.  To me, that's a separate issue to the above and surely a delusion, if not a disorder?  but it's being conflated. 

  

Trans people are deluded - FFS.

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The SNP should count their blessings the Scottish public are awake to the self ID rapists charter blocked by the UK government. 

Wait till they catch wind of the billion per annum Prince Charles will be raking in, along with China, from the ScotWind auction. 

While Scotland gets 60 million in tax receipts. 

She's sold out our renewables energy future. 

She set up Alex salmond and surrendered Scotland to violent leftist extremists. 

The sturgeon out demo now is the Independence supporters holding Nicola to account. 

Edited by Tartan_Tonna
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1 hour ago, aaid said:

Until fairly recently there were plenty of people who used to describe homosexuality in the terms you are using.  

Thankfully, as a society, we are now starting to look at the 1%, 2%, 5% or 10% of the population who are attracted to the same sex, both sexes, process information differently or whatever as not having anything wrong with then and needing treatment, but - for want of a better phrase - simply being wired differently from the norm.

As for activists being violent, there seems to be a lot of name calling and treats being made - both viable and unviable - but there is - as far as I can see - very little in the way of *actual* violence.

That's not to say that name calling and making threats is acceptable, but there's also a load of faux outrage going around here.  One of the placards at the weekend that people are losing their shit about said something like "I'm going to eat Terfs", do people really believe that is a threat this is going to be actioned, I mean cannibalism, really?



I have to say I do agree with you about the fact that these placards and posturing with axes are all very infantile but not with genuine intent.

the problem of course is that where do you draw the line and decide what hate speech and oppression is acceptable?  If a bunch of rangers fans were posing with axes with comments saying they were going to chop up some catholics, how do you think that would go down?

 

 

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The SNP have sold out Scotland's renewables energy future.

Sturgeon the Tartan Tory. In her reverse auction with a maximum price cap. 

Sturgeon out. She's a disgrace. 

No state owned national renewables energy company. No supply chain jobs. No public stake in our energy future. 

She gives it away for a quick buck. 25 years of foreign multinational corporations controlling Scotland's energy resources. And the Crown Estate. 

She is destroying independence before its even been delivered. 

I despise her. The royal family thanks her for Scotland's billions. 

She should be jailed. And the key thrown away. She makes me sick more than any other politician in history. Evil pervades her soul. Scotland's biggest bunny boiler. 

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15 minutes ago, aaid said:

Trans people are deluded - FFS.

I think you're a bit too keen to "win" arguments at times.  that's really poor to take it out of context like that.  if you read my whole point about conflating, i'm making a distinction.

I far from think people that feel out of sync with their stereotypical sex are deluded.  Think harder.  Really poor.  

 

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1 hour ago, aaid said:

You can see that, I can see that, the strange thing is why do his acolytes that hang on his every word not see it?

Fuck knows 😂

He is a good writer and his blog posts are often entertaining, even if you don't always agree with them, but why this almost personality cult has formed around him I do not know.

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