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Whose our first choice right back?


Malcolm
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Has to be Patterson at the moment, think O'Donnell short term as back up but the quality coming through will soon push him out unfortunately,A lot may depend if players move if believed interest happens. 

Patterson and Ramsey are both connected with big moves to England by the looks I reckon Everton of the connected clubs might be the best chance of playing. Looking at West Ham they look well stocked for RBs(Coufal,Frederick's,Johnson and Ashby) Man U I think they would be back up.

Ashby I would not be surprised if he went on loan to a Champ side or Europe apparently Celtic enquired about a loan in the summer to get regular game time. 

Hickey I could see more as staying as back up to Robertson with Tierney staying CB. Doig also in there

Livramento if serious could really push due to a strong start in the prem. 

But does show some serious depth in the fullbacks coming through if they keep developing like they are. 

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On 10/10/2021 at 11:25 PM, slasher said:

The position is up for grabs as far as I am concerned. O'Donnell has done a lot right and very little wrong for us but I get he is somewhat  limited in an attacking sense. Patterson has potential but he's done nothing to nail down the position, in fact he was utter dug meat in the first half last night. Frankly if he can't nail down the position at club level he shouldn't be considered. There are other young RB's coming through, let's just see what happens. 

That is just nonsense. Would you say the same about Raheem Sterling who is no longer nailing down a starting position every week? Tavernier is a club captain and if he was Scottish we would be delighted to have him. Patterson will get the gig in time but right now if he's not playing all the time then there is less chance of him missing games for us through injury. It's SOD who will soon be phased out for Ramsay. If you want a nailed down starter, then maybe you would prefer Shaun Rooney?

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1 hour ago, Third Lanark said:

That is just nonsense. Would you say the same about Raheem Sterling who is no longer nailing down a starting position every week? Tavernier is a club captain and if he was Scottish we would be delighted to have him. Patterson will get the gig in time but right now if he's not playing all the time then there is less chance of him missing games for us through injury. It's SOD who will soon be phased out for Ramsay. If you want a nailed down starter, then maybe you would prefer Shaun Rooney?

To give Gerrard a bit of credit, most managers aren't going to bench their captain. Gerrard isn't going to play Patterson for Scotland's benefit, and why would he.

2 of our best players this millennium, Hutton and McFadden, went through spells of not playing much for their clubs, but excelled for Scotland. However, saying that, having Patterson as a bench warmer is not sustainable. He is coming up to a crucial stage in his development and needs game time. I'm happy to give him that for Scotland, but I'd be looking to loan him out in January to somewhere we know he'll play every week.

I'd still be tempted to play O'Donnell against Denmark, but he is very much in danger of being a back up to Patterson.

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6 minutes ago, daviebee said:

One thing's for sure after last night... it should never be Ryan Fraser.

I thought Fraser actually had a decent second half last night. A good few decent crosses and got himself into dangerous positions a couple of time. The less said about his first half the better.

I certainly wouldn’t fancy him as a wing back against better opposition.

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As others have said it's up for grabs. But with Paterson being younger - with gametime you'd fancy him to nail the spot sooner or later. 

It's a funny old game. I always valued O'Donnell for his attacking capabilities at Killie, compensating his defensive weaknesses at times. His attacking (and all around) abilities being highlighted beautifully at Wembley - not sure we'll see a better attacking right (wing)back performance for some time and Paterson has a way to go to get to those levels. Whereas the consensus on here seems to value SOD's defensive capabilities and minimises his attacking threat. It's a fashionable narrative, but don't think it represents reality. But each to their own. 

 

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8 minutes ago, Morrisandmoo said:

As others have said it's up for grabs. But with Paterson being younger - with gametime you'd fancy him to nail the spot sooner or later. 

It's a funny old game. I always valued O'Donnell for his attacking capabilities at Killie, compensating his defensive weaknesses at times. His attacking (and all around) abilities being highlighted beautifully at Wembley - not sure we'll see a better attacking right (wing)back performance for some time and Paterson has a way to go to get to those levels. Whereas the consensus on here seems to value SOD's defensive capabilities and minimises his attacking threat. It's a fashionable narrative, but don't think it represents reality. But each to their own. 

 

I’m sure O’Donnell has a few assists for Scotland over the last couple of years. The way some people go on you’d think he was like Leon Balogun playing as a RB at Rangers where he barely gets forward at all. 

I think Patterson is just a better player than O’Donnell in general and is definitely better at getting past players and can probably cross the ball better as well. 

Put it this way - as long as Patterson’s club career progresses he will be our number one RB/RWB very shortly (if he isn’t already) and he will be for the next few years. 

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1 minute ago, Texas Pete said:

I’m sure O’Donnell has a few assists for Scotland over the last couple of years. The way some people go on you’d think he was like Leon Balogun playing as a RB at Rangers where he barely gets forward at all. 

I think Patterson is just a better player than O’Donnell in general and is definitely better at getting past players and can probably cross the ball better as well. 

Put it this way - as long as Patterson’s club career progresses he will be our number one RB/RWB very shortly (if he isn’t already) and he will be for the next few years. 

He's unlucky not to be on 2 or 3 goals as well - some near misses. His strength is attacking! So very weird narrative around him being a more solid defensive option. I hate to think how bad Paterson is defensively if that wee actually true!

As you say Paterson either is already (at least on some days) or might become just a better player full stop. 

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21 minutes ago, Morrisandmoo said:

Is Ralston good enough to compete in the future? 

I haven't seen that much of him but thought we was excellent in the old firm not long ago. It was enough to get me excited about him being a good option for us. 

Ralston is pretty unlucky not to be capped. It sounds like a call up was attempted for the Denmark & Austria games but couldn’t happen which was a shame for him. 

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2 hours ago, Tartan blood said:

To give Gerrard a bit of credit, most managers aren't going to bench their captain. Gerrard isn't going to play Patterson for Scotland's benefit, and why would he.

2 of our best players this millennium, Hutton and McFadden, went through spells of not playing much for their clubs, but excelled for Scotland. However, saying that, having Patterson as a bench warmer is not sustainable. He is coming up to a crucial stage in his development and needs game time. I'm happy to give him that for Scotland, but I'd be looking to loan him out in January to somewhere we know he'll play every week.

I'd still be tempted to play O'Donnell against Denmark, but he is very much in danger of being a back up to Patterson.

Patterson is getting game time, and Gerrard has made it clear that this will continue. There is no chance at all he’ll go on loan. Why you’d want to play SOD against Denmark is beyond me.

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26 minutes ago, er yir macaroon said:

Patterson is getting game time, and Gerrard has made it clear that this will continue. There is no chance at all he’ll go on loan. Why you’d want to play SOD against Denmark is beyond me.

He said the same thing at the start of the season. I hope you're right, but I'll believe it when I see it. Tavernier is arguably Rangers best player, so I don't really blame him. Patterson starting 1 in 5 is not enough.

O'Donnell is vastly more experienced than Patterson. That's why. I do think Patterson will go on to be a better player than O'Donnell, but if Patterson doesn't start more than 1 game between now and November (very possible) then I'd expect Clarke to play O'Donnell.

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10 minutes ago, Tartan blood said:

He said the same thing at the start of the season. I hope you're right, but I'll believe it when I see it. Tavernier is arguably Rangers best player, so I don't really blame him. Patterson starting 1 in 5 is not enough.

O'Donnell is vastly more experienced than Patterson. That's why. I do think Patterson will go on to be a better player than O'Donnell, but if Patterson doesn't start more than 1 game between now and November (very possible) then I'd expect Clarke to play O'Donnell.

Considering Patterson has set up the winner in 2 of the last 4 games I’d fully expect him to start in the crucial must win next match. 

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15 minutes ago, ProudScot said:

Considering Patterson has set up the winner in 2 of the last 4 games I’d fully expect him to start in the crucial must win next match. 

Don't get me wrong, if it were my choice, I'd probably start Patterson as well. But, from Clarke's point of view, if he sees that Patterson has barely kicked a ball in a month and has 23 cap and 29 year old O'Donnell to turn to, I wouldn't blame him for swapping them.

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20 minutes ago, Tartan blood said:

Don't get me wrong, if it were my choice, I'd probably start Patterson as well. But, from Clarke's point of view, if he sees that Patterson has barely kicked a ball in a month and has 23 cap and 29 year old O'Donnell to turn to, I wouldn't blame him for swapping them.

I think given we got away with one last night, just barely, after picking the wrong team - he’s bound to start guys like Patterson, McGregor & Nisbet for the Moldova game.

Fraser, Christie & in hindsight McTominay all should give way for Patterson, Nisbet & McGregor.  

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5 hours ago, Third Lanark said:

That is just nonsense. Would you say the same about Raheem Sterling who is no longer nailing down a starting position every week? Tavernier is a club captain and if he was Scottish we would be delighted to have him. Patterson will get the gig in time but right now if he's not playing all the time then there is less chance of him missing games for us through injury. It's SOD who will soon be phased out for Ramsay. If you want a nailed down starter, then maybe you would prefer Shaun Rooney?

I didn't realise smoking crack on a Wednesday morning was a thing. 🙄

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2 hours ago, Tartan blood said:

He said the same thing at the start of the season. I hope you're right, but I'll believe it when I see it. Tavernier is arguably Rangers best player, so I don't really blame him. Patterson starting 1 in 5 is not enough.

O'Donnell is vastly more experienced than Patterson. That's why. I do think Patterson will go on to be a better player than O'Donnell, but if Patterson doesn't start more than 1 game between now and November (very possible) then I'd expect Clarke to play O'Donnell.

Patterson has played 4 games for Rangers this season and Tavernier has played 7. No problem there.

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2 hours ago, er yir macaroon said:

Patterson has played 4 games for Rangers this season and Tavernier has played 7. No problem there.

Against who? Regardless of the opposition, do you think 4 games by mid-October is enough?

To be honest, we do need to remember he's only 19. Most 19 year olds wouldn't be playing 40+ games a season for big teams anyway. But to be a nailed on starter for Scotland, he really needs to play more. We need to be patient. 

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If you had asked me the question of O'Donnell or Patterson before this double header I would probably just have edged for O'Donnell as the experience he has and he has never let us down. Patterson obviously looks the more dynamic option but his lack of experience worried me. 

However, these last two games have tipped it quite healthily in Patterson's favour. He could be blamed for the lead up to Israel's opener but he dug in and was excellent in the second half. There was just as much threat coming down the right as there was on the left supplied by Robertson and Tierney - that says lots. It shows he has great temperament and this was in front of 50, 000 fans in a must win game. It shows that in his case experience means nothing if he can cope in such circumstances. And then he produced a great cross for Dykes' golden goal V the Faroes.

Obviously, in an ideal world he'd be starting regularly for his club but sooner or later Gerrard's hand is going to be called. International football is a great shop window and Patterson was attracting interest before these two matches and he'll have enhanced his reputation after those two games. Gerrard will soon get an offer he can't refuse or find he must give Patterson more game time to keep Patterson content.

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48 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

If you had asked me the question of O'Donnell or Patterson before this double header I would probably just have edged for O'Donnell as the experience he has and he has never let us down. Patterson obviously looks the more dynamic option but his lack of experience worried me. 

However, these last two games have tipped it quite healthily in Patterson's favour. He could be blamed for the lead up to Israel's opener but he dug in and was excellent in the second half. There was just as much threat coming down the right as there was on the left supplied by Robertson and Tierney - that says lots. It shows he has great temperament and this was in front of 50, 000 fans in a must win game. It shows that in his case experience means nothing if he can cope in such circumstances. And then he produced a great cross for Dykes' golden goal V the Faroes.

Obviously, in an ideal world he'd be starting regularly for his club but sooner or later Gerrard's hand is going to be called. International football is a great shop window and Patterson was attracting interest before these two matches and he'll have enhanced his reputation after those two games. Gerrard will soon get an offer he can't refuse or find he must give Patterson more game time to keep Patterson content.

Or Patterson will become better than Tavernier. 

Calvin Ramsay is very promising too. His physical similarity to Patterson is remarkable. 

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15 hours ago, marinello said:

Most of our threats in 2 nd half came from Fraser whether via crosses or passes.

As for first half he was starved of any real service as most of our play went down the left side.

 

 

Agreed. Patterson did great when he came on, but that doesn't mean Fraser was rubbish. Fraser is far better further up the field. If he's getting decent game time for Newcastle between now and November, I'd start him up top with Adams. 

Patterson will, most likely, be our first choice rwb. However, as someone else mentioned, he's only played 4 games for Rangers. Compare that with Ramsay's 21 games. Obviously playing for Aberdeen is a different proposition to supplanting Tavernier, but Patterson might find he has stiff competition if Ramsay continues to soar.

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41 minutes ago, Tartan blood said:

Agreed. Patterson did great when he came on, but that doesn't mean Fraser was rubbish. Fraser is far better further up the field. If he's getting decent game time for Newcastle between now and November, I'd start him up top with Adams. 

Patterson will, most likely, be our first choice rwb. However, as someone else mentioned, he's only played 4 games for Rangers. Compare that with Ramsay's 21 games. Obviously playing for Aberdeen is a different proposition to supplanting Tavernier, but Patterson might find he has stiff competition if Ramsay continues to soar.

If Ramsay is as good as some people think he will be sitting on a bench somewhere in January. 

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54 minutes ago, Tartan blood said:

Agreed. Patterson did great when he came on, but that doesn't mean Fraser was rubbish. Fraser is far better further up the field. If he's getting decent game time for Newcastle between now and November, I'd start him up top with Adams. 

I’m not sure if Fraser will be getting much more game time at Newcastle now they have unlimited funds for transfers and wages….

He hasn’t really impressed or established himself there yet, only thing in his favour would be if the new manager at Newcastle (whoever that is) wants to have a look at what he’s got and everyone starts with a clean slate.

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