Vaccine Passports

[vanderark14]

8 minutes ago, phart said:

Sounds like you're doing everything you can. I saw a story somewhere about someone with a similiar problem will try and find it.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-58475922

I read about that lassie this morning. I haven't had to cancel anything yet but i do have plans to holiday at the end of the year.

At my GP surgery there are people in the same situation but they've had 1 vaccine in France or the US and 1 in England. 

I was originally told by nurses in Aberdeen I would only require the batch number and the GP could update the NHS app to show both vaccinations. No such luck

[phart]

All the talk of vaccines had me checking my vaccine card.

Since 3rd of december 2019, i've had Diptheria, tetanus, polio, Hepatitis A, Mumps, measles, rubella, yellow fever and covid vaccinations, and malaria prophylactics

None of them provide sterilising immunity.

[thplinth]

16 minutes ago, vanderark14 said:

Trying to speak to a GP in my area is like asking for an audience with the queen

Seems to be everywhere. 

I have discussed this with a few folk as I'd like to know why.

The hospitals have never been so busy that all the GPs were commandeered to work in them. Not even close really.

So where are the GPs and what are they doing? It is bizarre and very noticeable now as well.

The NHS also cancelled / postponed a huge number of non covid treatments and procedures on the back of the crises as well.

I do think they have used the pandemic to scale back the services on the NHS. It is the perfect excuse to get away with it.

[vanderark14]

6 minutes ago, thplinth said:

Seems to be everywhere. 

I have discussed this with a few folk as I'd like to know why.

The hospitals have never been so busy that all the GPs were commandeered to work in them. Not even close really.

So where are the GPs and what are they doing? It is bizarre and very noticeable now as well.

The NHS also cancelled / postponed a huge number of non covid treatments and procedures on the back of the crises as well.

I do think they have used the pandemic to scale back the services on the NHS. It is the perfect excuse to get away with it.

When I was in hospital in June I found the Doctors and nurses in the hospital to be outstanding but my GP surgery is beyond useless. When I need them to act I have to call the nurses at the hospital to call the surgery to shove a rocket up their arse.

 

[TDYER63]

I think the GP situation is different from one surgery to another. I needed to see my GP a few weeks ago and got an appointment within a few days which was fine as it was not urgent. It was supposed to be a telephone appointment but I got a call back from the receptionist to say that when the doctor reviewed her appointments she wanted to see me in person. I couldnt really ask for more than that. 
I do know of people who find it difficult to get an appointment though , and can imagine the frustration vanderark is experiencing. 

[jailender]

What is going to happen to the Scottish Passport plans now that England have apparently ditched the idea? Going to raise all manner of issues for people attending events in Scotland, if they are from outwith Scotland.

[aaid]

24 minutes ago, jailender said:

What is going to happen to the Scottish Passport plans now that England have apparently ditched the idea? Going to raise all manner of issues for people attending events in Scotland, if they are from outwith Scotland.

You can still get the vaccine passports if you live in England, it’s just that it won’t be enforced. 

[thplinth]

England have ditched it? Wow this is going to put Scottish venues at a huge competitive disadvantage versus ones in the rest of the UK. Another industry to be malkied then.

[Lamia]

2 hours ago, vanderark14 said:

Already done all of that mate. I went to the TECA in Aberdeen for the 2nd jab, I was a walk in as I was in the North East for a while. 

You can't possibly have done that, Squirrelhumper says this is impossible! 🙄

[Lamia]

3 hours ago, thplinth said:

 

Having a venue full of vaccinated people is going to achieve what exactly anyway. Vaccinated people are catching and spreading it too.

It reduces this so that is what it is going to achieve

Edited September 12, 2021 by Lamia

[Orraloon]

Sounds like Nicola has been outflanked on this one. She has allowed herself to be cajoled and encouraged (some might say coerced😉) into agreeing to do something she didn't really want to do. When she finally agrees to go along with the idea, within a couple of days of her announcement, the Tories turn round and say "we don't think it's a good idea any more" and pull the plug. This has got Gove's slimy mitts all over it. 

Now she has to decide whether to carry on with the plan, or admit that she got it wrong and follow Westminster's lead. I can imagine she will be fuming at these latest developments. She might just have to keep her mouth shut about it to save face though?

[scotlad]

31 minutes ago, Orraloon said:

Sounds like Nicola has been outflanked on this one. She has allowed herself to be cajoled and encouraged (some might say coerced😉) into agreeing to do something she didn't really want to do. When she finally agrees to go along with the idea, within a couple of days of her announcement, the Tories turn round and say "we don't think it's a good idea any more" and pull the plug. This has got Gove's slimy mitts all over it. 

Now she has to decide whether to carry on with the plan, or admit that she got it wrong and follow Westminster's lead. I can imagine she will be fuming at these latest developments. She might just have to keep her mouth shut about it to save face though?

That's a possibility. Another possibility is the Tories are getting twitchy because the polls are showing signs of narrowing so they've changed their tune to try and make themselves more popular.

Judging by how the Tories have handled this pandemic, if they think something is a bad idea it probably means it's actually a good one!

[TDYER63]

16 minutes ago, aaid said:

You can still get the vaccine passports if you live in England, it’s just that it won’t be enforced. 

From the BBC a short time ago : 
 

What if I've been jabbed in England, Wales or Northern Ireland?
 

‘’As things stand, people vaccinated outside Scotland won't qualify for entry to nightclubs or other venues.

The Scottish Government says it is working with England, Wales and Northern Ireland to work out a solution - as well as considering how it will work for overseas visitors.’’

 

Personally I dont see what the problem is with vaccine passports. There are, for example,  loads of restrictions around travel for unvaccinated people , this is just another restriction, its their choice not to have the vaccine and it costs nothing. What exactly are the significant risks from this vaccine that other vaccines don’t have ?  All I hear is mumbo jumbo conspiracy theories. Do the folk who refuse to be vaccinated refuse all the other vaccinations , and refuse vaccinations for their children if they have them ? 

 

 

[TDYER63]

4 minutes ago, scotlad said:

That's a possibility. Another possibility is the Tories are getting twitchy because the polls are showing signs of narrowing so they've changed their tune to try and make themselves more popular.

Judging by how the Tories have handled this pandemic, if they think something is a bad idea it probably means it's actually a good one!

That would not surprise me on the least. If the polls continue to slump they will be back tracking on the tax increases too. 

[Hertsscot]

19 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

From the BBC a short time ago : 
 

What if I've been jabbed in England, Wales or Northern Ireland?
 

‘’As things stand, people vaccinated outside Scotland won't qualify for entry to nightclubs or other venues.

The Scottish Government says it is working with England, Wales and Northern Ireland to work out a solution - as well as considering how it will work for overseas visitors.’’

Not really important in the grand scheme of things but I 'd appreciate it if that got sorted soon as I've got tickets to see Blondie at the SECC and still haven't given up hope of getting a ticket for the Israel game!

[aaid]

32 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

That would not surprise me on the least. If the polls continue to slump they will be back tracking on the tax increases too. 

Pathetic and more than a bit concerning that the UKG would put public health at risk for petty party political matters, whatever they are.

But that’s par for the course where this lot are concerned. 

[TDYER63]

13 minutes ago, Hertsscot said:

Not really important in the grand scheme of things but I 'd appreciate it if that got sorted soon as I've got tickets to see Blondie at the SECC and still haven't given up hope of getting a ticket for the Israel game!

I would like to think this is something that will be sorted quickly however vanderark’s experience doesnt fill me with a great deal of hope. You would think exceptions would be made for tickets purchased before the implementation, but that brings in another headache. When is the Blondie gig ? 

[scotlad]

38 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

That would not surprise me on the least. If the polls continue to slump they will be back tracking on the tax increases too. 

I'm surprised they haven't already.  Necessity is probably the only thing that's stopping them.

4 minutes ago, aaid said:

Pathetic and more than a bit concerning that the UKG would put public health at risk for petty party political matters, whatever they are.

But that’s par for the course where this lot are concerned. 

It is indeed. 🙄

[Morrisandmoo]

20 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

From the BBC a short time ago : 
 

What if I've been jabbed in England, Wales or Northern Ireland?
 

‘’As things stand, people vaccinated outside Scotland won't qualify for entry to nightclubs or other venues.

The Scottish Government says it is working with England, Wales and Northern Ireland to work out a solution - as well as considering how it will work for overseas visitors.’’

 

Personally I dont see what the problem is with vaccine passports. There are, for example,  loads of restrictions around travel for unvaccinated people , this is just another restriction, its their choice not to have the vaccine and it costs nothing. What exactly are the significant risks from this vaccine that other vaccines don’t have ?  All I hear is mumbo jumbo conspiracy theories. Do the folk who refuse to be vaccinated refuse all the other vaccinations , and refuse vaccinations for their children if they have them ? 

 

 

The problem is first of all is that the benefit (if we define this as reduced harm) is going to be marginal because we already have a very high % of the population vaccinated, with the remainder largely being young and healthy. This is in contrast to other countries like France when they introduced a similar scheme. We should be careful of any government measure which costs money, but is only capable of delivering a marginal benefit - because that money could be better invested in other measures with higher ROIs. For example, we could reduce waiting lists or improve cancer services. Whatever. So it's a risky investment straight away. 

In addition to being weak on potential benefits, the societal and moral costs are (in my opinion) very high. The archetypal person who remains unvaccinated will be young, vulnerable, black and poor. These are the very people who I want us to be actively trying to include in our society more - not excluding further. It's a high cost. One that I/we might be prepared to accept, with sufficient offsetting benefits (but see issue above re only marginal benefits being possible).

I don't agree with the justification that these people have a choice - therefore fuck them. Who are these people and what brings them to the irrational choice not to get vaccinated. Put yourself in their shoes. Is their choice anything more than expression of all of their experiences and environment? I don't want to go down the rabbit hole of free will, but I do always come back to Irvine Welsh's exploration of where choice ends and begins in Trainspotting or Fitzgerald's snobbish reminder that "a sense of the fundamental decencies is parceled out unequally at birth". Those cunts do a much better job at addressing this than me. Either way, I think the burden is still on us to prove that the harm we cause to non-conforming minorities, in the punitive measures we take against them, are proportionate. We can't just excuse ourselves from this assessment because they have a "choice" to conform. 

Anyway, getting back to the point - it is my opinion that it is a very shitey thing we are doing to some of the most vulnerable people in our society and alas it will do no fucking good (not really).

A bit dramatic. Sorry. 

[Morrisandmoo]

PS my objection doesn't extend to folk like ThePlinth, who ought to be intelligent enough to grasp the benefits of vaccination - but have gone tonto on conspiracy theories. He should be forced to get vaccinated and carry a passport just for winding everybody up on TAMB. 

[vanderark14]

1 hour ago, Lamia said:

You can't possibly have done that, Squirrelhumper says this is impossible! 🙄

I walked into the local vaccine centre in the North East but they never had moderna, only AZ and Pfizer. If they had moderna, the journey to Aberdeen to get moderna

There were two queues, one for walk ins and one for those with appointments. I walked passed the huge queue for those with appointments, there must've been around 100 people in that queue whilst there were about 5 people in the walk in queue. I was in an out in no time, even with my story to tell.

[Squirrelhumper]

2 hours ago, Lamia said:

You can't possibly have done that, Squirrelhumper says this is impossible! 🙄

I never said it was impossible. Comtime to make stuff up.

 

[Squirrelhumper]

2 hours ago, aaid said:

You can still get the vaccine passports if you live in England, it’s just that it won’t 

At least you'll be able to punt your Israel ticket. 

[aaid]

3 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said:

At least you'll be able to punt your Israel ticket. 

If I had one. 

[Lamia]

8 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said:

I never said it was impossible. Comtime to make stuff up.

 

😂

"You were told not to go to a drop in centre if you had an appointment via a blue letter."