Scottish players in action 21/22

[Texas Pete]

Just now, mccaughey85 said:

Problem is there are dodgy slide tackles that could be considered dangerous in most games, letting the refs decide when it suits them is not a fair way. Seen many a dangerous tackle go unpunished in Scotland, it has to be consistent across the board or just ban slide tackling altogether. 

Don’t get me started on the standard of refereeing in Scotland. Absolutely shocking at times. I’m not a big fan of VAR but the likely introduction of it next season should help a bit with that. 

As far as the red card today goes the ref got it right in my opinion. If you go in with your studs showing like that at that pace you can end people’s careers. Slide tackles happen in every game but they are not all dangerous. 

[mccaughey85]

10 minutes ago, Texas Pete said:

Don’t get me started on the standard of refereeing in Scotland. Absolutely shocking at times. I’m not a big fan of VAR but the likely introduction of it next season should help a bit with that. 

As far as the red card today goes the ref got it right in my opinion. If you go in with your studs showing like that at that pace you can end people’s careers. Slide tackles happen in every game but they are not all dangerous. 

I would say most games have a slide tackle that could be deemed dangerous and reckless. Most of the time they go unpunished because the ref has an old school approach to hard tackling. The problem I have with the red is the consistency of these decisions. Imo it's impossible for every ref to have the same opinion on whether a tackle is dangerous or not which means that it will always come down to what the ref wants to do as opposed to what the rules decide. 

Would you like to get rid of slide tackling because thats the only way of ensuring a fairness in reffing standards when it comes to dangerous slide tackles?

 

[Texas Pete]

20 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said:

I would say most games have a slide tackle that could be deemed dangerous and reckless. Most of the time they go unpunished because the ref has an old school approach to hard tackling. The problem I have with the red is the consistency of these decisions. Imo it's impossible for every ref to have the same opinion on whether a tackle is dangerous or not which means that it will always come down to what the ref wants to do as opposed to what the rules decide. 

Would you like to get rid of slide tackling because thats the only way of ensuring a fairness in reffing standards when it comes to dangerous slide tackles?

 

How is it the only way? Surely investing in full time refs and training them properly to ensure a consistent approach would be a better idea? 

[mccaughey85]

8 minutes ago, Texas Pete said:

How is it the only way? Surely investing in full time refs and training them properly to ensure a consistent approach would be a better idea? 

It's impossible to train them to make the right decision when it's something thats so open to interpretation. Every ref will have his own opinion on whats reckless and dangerous no matter how much training is given. We know this because every week there are dangerous tackles that go unpunished in England and scotland.

The only fair way is to ban slide tackles or go back to how it was 10 years ago when a slide tackle was fair as long as you won the ball first and never went through the player to get to it. Its one or the other or else it will be just inconsistent and unfair reffing for the future. 

The rangers lads on here would be arguing the opposite point if it had been their player on the receiving end of a red due to that type of tackle. 

[vanderark14]

9 hours ago, Texas Pete said:

Don’t get me started on the standard of refereeing in Scotland. Absolutely shocking at times. I’m not a big fan of VAR but the likely introduction of it next season should help a bit with that. 

As far as the red card today goes the ref got it right in my opinion. If you go in with your studs showing like that at that pace you can end people’s careers. Slide tackles happen in every game but they are not all dangerous. 

The introduction of VAR in Scotland won't help, the make an arse of using it in the EPL........ if it was put in the hands of Scottish officials it would be laughable and there'd be constant controversy 

[er yir macaroon]

9 hours ago, mccaughey85 said:

So you would get rid of slide tackling? 

I would say at least a quarter of slide tackles could be deemed reckless and dangerous. A slide tackle by its very nature is nearly always going to have a dangerous aspect to it. It's a player lunging in to win the ball after running at pace most of the time making it uncontrollably hard for a player to make it completely safe. 

It seems that it's mostly the rangers fans on here that are claiming its a red. If it was a rangers player that had made that tackle and gotten a red they would be arguing the opposite. 

It wasn’t a slide tackle. His leading foot was knee high. He managed to clip the ball with the bottom of his calf but he was totally out of control. He let his team down. Give me some credit, if a Rangers player had done it he should have been sent off too. Porteous would do that in a Scotland top and that’s the problem here. 

[ProudScot]

Just seen the Porteous tackle.

Anyone defending that is having a laugh. Nowadays it’s a stonewall red.

 

[RDFH64]

12 hours ago, Texas Pete said:

Don’t get me started on the standard of refereeing in Scotland. Absolutely shocking at times. I’m not a big fan of VAR but the likely introduction of it next season should help a bit with that. 

As far as the red card today goes the ref got it right in my opinion. If you go in with your studs showing like that at that pace you can end people’s careers. Slide tackles happen in every game but they are not all dangerous. 

It all depends who is in the wee room deciding the VAR outcome, could be a lot of Bobby Maddens or Willie Collums  making the calls 😖

[aaid]

11 hours ago, mccaughey85 said:

It's impossible to train them to make the right decision when it's something thats so open to interpretation. Every ref will have his own opinion on whats reckless and dangerous no matter how much training is given. We know this because every week there are dangerous tackles that go unpunished in England and scotland.

 

It isn't open to interpretation though, at least not in way you are suggesting.  Referees don't just decide on a whim what constitutes serious foul play.  IFAB give guidance on a range of factors that referees should consider when making decisions, then different refereeing bodies/football associations will refine those, hence you see slightly differing interpretations of the laws in domestic and European games.

When people try to claim that certain incidents in different games or even in the same game are treated differently even though they are "identical", they rarely are identical.   For example, David Turnbull was booked yesterday for a tackle that was no worse than several others that his teammates had committed before.  He was unlucky that because his teammates had committed a number of fouls, the referee felt it was necessary to book someone to set down a marker, no-one really bats an eyelid at that.

Any day of the week and in any game though, that's a straight red for Porteous.

[Texas Pete]

56 minutes ago, RDFH64 said:

It all depends who is in the wee room deciding the VAR outcome, could be a lot of Bobby Maddens or Willie Collums  making the calls 😖

😂 Fair point. I think they’d be far better investing whatever money they are looking to use to introduce VAR I’m full time refs. 

[Texas Pete]

4 hours ago, vanderark14 said:

The introduction of VAR in Scotland won't help, the make an arse of using it in the EPL........ if it was put in the hands of Scottish officials it would be laughable and there'd be constant controversy 

Yeah good point. We’ll see for ourselves what happens fairly soon though as I think it’s definitely on the way. 

[Third Lanark]

15 hours ago, mccaughey85 said:

I think if he keeps this up clarke will have to pick him for the main squad. Theres no way we can refuse to pick a 19 year old playing in serie a every week. 

And who do we sacrifice to shoehorn him in? We don't want the Tierney/Robertson dilemma all over again.

[Third Lanark]

After watching Patterson yesterday, I hope he is unleashed against Israel; he could terrorise their left side.

[ProudScot]

28 minutes ago, Third Lanark said:

After watching Patterson yesterday, I hope he is unleashed against Israel; he could terrorise their left side.

Youd expect him to start vs Israel. Youd also expect Nisbet to start vs The Faroes IMO

[ProudScot]

Just seen Hickeys goal vs Lazio this weekend.

3-0 win for them, they are 6th and flying and hes getting forward and scoring goals as well as starting every week in Serie A.

For the reason Greg Taylor was included in the squad to have a second left back you’d think Hickey would be nailed on for that slot now. 

[mccaughey85]

7 hours ago, er yir macaroon said:

It wasn’t a slide tackle. His leading foot was knee high. He managed to clip the ball with the bottom of his calf but he was totally out of control. He let his team down. Give me some credit, if a Rangers player had done it he should have been sent off too. Porteous would do that in a Scotland top and that’s the problem here. 

Eh? It's a slide tackle, he literally slides in and wins the the ball with his foot connecting with the ball, albeit not very cleanly as it rolls over the ball and ends up connecting with his thighs. 

I think we will have to agree to disagree. My opinion is only that if thats a red card then loads of slide tackles will have to be clamped down on by refs. I don't like the idea of refs of deciding what's dangerous and whats not. It's something that is impossible to be consistent with and will ultimately lead to fans claiming corruption, bias etc.

If that exact same incident happened to rangers in the next old firm would rangers fans be claiming it was a red? I highly doubt they would be, they would be complaining about inconsistent decisions and whataboutery til the cows come home. 

For me the only option is either ban slide tackles or allow them no matter how dangerous some of them might be. Playing football is a sport that can result in injury, its part and parcel of the game and tackling and aggression is part of the game, if you don't want to risk getting injured don't play the game. 

 

[aaid]

18 hours ago, mccaughey85 said:

I think if he keeps this up clarke will have to pick him for the main squad. Theres no way we can refuse to pick a 19 year old playing in serie a every week. 

When the alternatives are a 27 year old and a 24 year old who are playing every week in the EPL you can.

[er yir macaroon]

14 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said:

Eh? It's a slide tackle, he literally slides in and wins the the ball with his foot connecting with the ball, albeit not very cleanly as it rolls over the ball and ends up connecting with his thighs. 

I think we will have to agree to disagree. My opinion is only that if thats a red card then loads of slide tackles will have to be clamped down on by refs. I don't like the idea of refs of deciding what's dangerous and whats not. It's something that is impossible to be consistent with and will ultimately lead to fans claiming corruption, bias etc.

If that exact same incident happened to rangers in the next old firm would rangers fans be claiming it was a red? I highly doubt they would be, they would be complaining about inconsistent decisions and whataboutery til the cows come home. 

For me the only option is either ban slide tackles or allow them no matter how dangerous some of them might be. Playing football is a sport that can result in injury, its part and parcel of the game and tackling and aggression is part of the game, if you don't want to risk getting injured don't play the game. 

 

Stonewall red, no nuance about it. If Porteous did that in a Scotland top you’d be raging. Can you imagine him staying on the park in an international after one of those? 

[er yir macaroon]

 

[mccaughey85]

5 hours ago, aaid said:

It isn't open to interpretation though, at least not in way you are suggesting.  Referees don't just decide on a whim what constitutes serious foul play.  IFAB give guidance on a range of factors that referees should consider when making decisions, then different refereeing bodies/football associations will refine those, hence you see slightly differing interpretations of the laws in domestic and European games.

When people try to claim that certain incidents in different games or even in the same game are treated differently even though they are "identical", they rarely are identical.   For example, David Turnbull was booked yesterday for a tackle that was no worse than several others that his teammates had committed before.  He was unlucky that because his teammates had committed a number of fouls, the referee felt it was necessary to book someone to set down a marker, no-one really bats an eyelid at that.

Any day of the week and in any game though, that's a straight red for Porteous.

Referees might not decide on a whim but every ref has their own opinion on what is dangerous and reckless and I believe that many refs wouldn't have given a red for that incident or even a foul. 

The modern game is changing and 10/15 years ago that porteous challenge isn't even getting debated. Now it's deemed a foul because of a refs opinion. If your happy for refs to be making decisions based on their opinions then fair enough. I don't want that, I would rather the rules be applied in fair and consistent way and not by a guys opinion.

As we can see on here ppl have different opinions on the legitimacy of the tackle but it seems like it's mostly rangers fans claiming its a red card. Surely that indicates that its a farce letting refs decide whats dangerous and whats not. 

 

 

 

[mccaughey85]

8 minutes ago, er yir macaroon said:

Stonewall red, no nuance about it. If Porteous did that in a Scotland top you’d be raging. Can you imagine him staying on the park in an international after one of those? 

I genuinely would be raging at the ref for sending him off if that was for Scotland? Same way I would for any  player we have who gets unfairly sent off for pretty much no reason. 

I reckon some international refs would send him off, some wouldn't and thats the problem here. Consistency with decisions. Can't have refs deciding what suits them.

[aaid]

13 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said:

As we can see on here ppl have different opinions on the legitimacy of the tackle but it seems like it's mostly rangers fans claiming its a red card. Surely that indicates that its a farce letting refs decide whats dangerous and whats not. 

Its actually fans of all clubs saying its a straight red with a few people claiming otherwise

[mccaughey85]

25 minutes ago, aaid said:

When the alternatives are a 27 year old and a 24 year old who are playing every week in the EPL you can.

Yeh tierney is played at centre back though, that means theres a left back spot available thats usually taken by Taylor.

Surely hickey is a better option long term than Taylor or even short term. 

[mccaughey85]

14 minutes ago, aaid said:

Its actually fans of all clubs saying its a straight red with a few people claiming otherwise

Is it? The general consensus of the message boards of hibs, aberdeen and celtic is that its an unfair decision and if any rangers defender made that challenge there would be no red card given. 

Perhaps a non rangers fan on here can tell me why its a red card or why refs should get to decide what slide tackles are fair and what ones are not. 

 

[aaid]

14 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said:

Is it? The general consensus of the message boards of hibs, aberdeen and celtic is that its an unfair decision and if any rangers defender made that challenge there would be no red card given. 

Perhaps a non rangers fan on here can tell me why its a red card or why refs should get to decide what slide tackles are fair and what ones are not.