News from the Camp

[Diamond Scot]

2 hours ago, Scot1 said:

I think this is something that we will improve upon with time.  Against teams where we can dominate possession and territory, you’ll be looking for our midfielders, Gilmour, McGregor to be having a go on occasion. 
I hope Gilmour gets his 1st goal for Scotland soon, he does take up some lovely positions around the edge of the 18 yard box. He’s been unlucky up to now.
Robbo too is now getting good opportunities, more often in games, now that he is becoming more familiar and comfortable with the “wing-back” role. I’m sure in time he’ll get more composed in front of goal, whether that’s having a shot or squaring a pass for an assist. I think as the squad becomes more experienced, we will start to see more goals from different areas of the team.

I think Gilmour will chip in with some goals over his Scotland career. I think he will probably start taking the shooting free kicks soon.

I doubt Robertson will though. He doesnt score for Liverpool and you can tell he isnt somebody who naturally feels comfortable or confident shooting. How many times recently has he had the ball on his left foot and either blasted it high or did a really tame side footed shot.

Patterson seems to have more of an eye for a goal. Not neccesarily based on his record but he just seems more able to seek out the positions and looks a more natural finisher.

McTom would get more if he played a box to box I think.

[Guest Scot1]

Ryan Porteous in for McTominay 

[Blantyre_Braveheart]

12 minutes ago, Scot1 said:

Ryan Porteous in for McTominay 

Strange call up. Hasn't been great, is extremely rash and has shown no signs of growing out of it.

[Guest Scot1]

12 minutes ago, Blantyre_Braveheart said:

Strange call up. Hasn't been great, is extremely rash and has shown no signs of growing out of it.

You’d hope the penny will drop with him sooner rather than later. He’s another young player who needs to move down to the English Championship to progress, in my opinion.

Edited November 14, 2021 by Scot1

[ProudScot]

2 hours ago, Blantyre_Braveheart said:

Strange call up. Hasn't been great, is extremely rash and has shown no signs of growing out of it.

Agreed.

Every time I’ve watched him his either been pish or done something bonkers. Bomb scare.

Much rather have seen Stephen Welsh called up if anyone. 

[DAVIDB46]

2 hours ago, Scot1 said:

Ryan Porteous in for McTominay 

Rather random call up 

[Guest Scot1]

2 minutes ago, DAVIDB46 said:

Rather random call up 

I’ve no problem with it, as long as he stays on the bench

[Blantyre_Braveheart]

3 hours ago, Scot1 said:

You’d hope the penny will drop with him sooner rather than later. He’s another young player who needs to move down to the English Championship to progress, in my opinion.

You would think but it's been about 3 years since he became a regular. Hopefully it gets to a point where he realises it's stopping him from getting that good money move. 

I mean there is a player there. He's quite quick, built and has good technique for a CB. Positionally he has to improve but that comes as you grow older.

[Guest Scot1]

9 hours ago, Blantyre_Braveheart said:

You would think but it's been about 3 years since he became a regular. Hopefully it gets to a point where he realises it's stopping him from getting that good money move. 

I mean there is a player there. He's quite quick, built and has good technique for a CB. Positionally he has to improve but that comes as you grow older.

I think it would do him wonders to get away from the goldfish bowl that is Scottish football and go where he can concentrate on improving his game. 

[Third Lanark]

11 hours ago, Scot1 said:

I’ve no problem with it, as long as he stays on the bench

😁🤣

[Third Lanark]

Thinking about Porteous, I admit to being a bit baffled why he was brought in as we already have Hendry and John Souttar as right-sided centre backs. I can only think that Clarke wants to have a look at him in training. In the past, when he needed emergency cover he brought in the ageing Considine or Paul McGinn. So maybe this is further evidence that he is actively looking to grow the squad - which is a good sign. Still have doubts about Porteous's decision-making though, and would fancy Welsh or somebody to eventually overtake him.

[Caledonian Craig]

6 minutes ago, Third Lanark said:

Thinking about Porteous, I admit to being a bit baffled why he was brought in as we already have Hendry and John Souttar as right-sided centre backs. I can only think that Clarke wants to have a look at him in training. In the past, when he needed emergency cover he brought in the ageing Considine or Paul McGinn. So maybe this is further evidence that he is actively looking to grow the squad - which is a good sign. Still have doubts about Porteous's decision-making though, and would fancy Welsh or somebody to eventually overtake him.

I think it is exactly that - to have a look at him in training. Remember the days of lots of friendlies with chance to blood or look at new players are a thing of the past so you need to take every opportunity that comes your way to look at other players.

[Guest Scot1]

Do you think Porteous could play defensive midfield?

Still a position I’m not convinced we have good enough options for yet.

[Third Lanark]

1 minute ago, Scot1 said:

Do you think Porteous could play defensive midfield?

Still a position I’m not convinced we have good enough options for yet.

God no. We have had enough of players playing out of position but there's no need to do so now I would think. Ryan Jack will eventually be back and the three at the back obviates the need for a specialist DM.

[Guest Scot1]

37 minutes ago, Third Lanark said:

God no. We have had enough of players playing out of position but there's no need to do so now I would think. Ryan Jack will eventually be back and the three at the back obviates the need for a specialist DM.

Not suggesting we throw him right in as CDM, but maybe that’s the best way forward for him. Not sure how far he can go as a centre half. 
At international level, I’d have Souttar in front of him, possibly Welsh, and there are younger centre backs coming through. Hendry is still relatively young. His National caps as a centre halve maybe very few. 
This may well be the case at club level, I’m not sure he has the physicality to play Centre Halve any higher than the English Championship 

Edited November 15, 2021 by Scot1

[Third Lanark]

2 minutes ago, Scot1 said:

Not suggesting we throw him right in as CDM, but maybe that’s the best way forward for him. Not sure how far he can go as a centre half. 
At international level, I’d have Souttar in front of him, possibly Welsh, and there are younger centre backs coming through. Hendry is still relatively young. His National caps as a centre halve maybe very few. 

Thoroughly deplore the idea of converting centre halves into midfield, albeit as defensive ones. I'm old enough to remember Jock Stein playing 2 - yes, 2 - centre halves  (McLeish and Roy Aitken) in a middle four with Strachan on the right and I forget who on the left. Needless to say, it was a complete failure, with absolutely zero creativity in the middle. That was  a rare occasion though when we were short of real midfielders at the time.

[Guest Scot1]

5 minutes ago, Third Lanark said:

Thoroughly deplore the idea of converting centre halves into midfield, albeit as defensive ones. I'm old enough to remember Jock Stein playing 2 - yes, 2 - centre halves  (McLeish and Roy Aitken) in a middle four with Strachan on the right and I forget who on the left. Needless to say, it was a complete failure, with absolutely zero creativity in the middle. That was  a rare occasion though when we were short of real midfielders at the time.

I can work, depends on the individual, he seems to have some good traits, he’s got decent pace, mobility, strong, comfortable on the ball (although prone to errors), likes  a tackle etc. Maybe I’m wrong?

Still think he needs to go south and improve himself as soon as possible. Maybe he will prove me wrong and turn out to be a quality centre halve?
 

[Third Lanark]

5 minutes ago, Scot1 said:

I can work, depends on the individual, he seems to have some good traits, he’s got decent pace, mobility, strong, comfortable on the ball (although prone to errors), likes  a tackle etc. Maybe I’m wrong?

Still think he needs to go south and improve himself as soon as possible. Maybe he will prove me wrong and turn out to be a quality centre halve?
 

Maybe but I can't think of any recent examples where that has worked out. All I know is if you stick Porteous in midfield right now he will be sent off by the first continental ref that sets eyes on him.

[Malcolm]

9 minutes ago, Third Lanark said:

Thoroughly deplore the idea of converting centre halves into midfield, albeit as defensive ones. I'm old enough to remember Jock Stein playing 2 - yes, 2 - centre halves  (McLeish and Roy Aitken) in a middle four with Strachan on the right and I forget who on the left. Needless to say, it was a complete failure, with absolutely zero creativity in the middle. That was  a rare occasion though when we were short of real midfielders at the time.

Stein often did this early in his scotland tenure.  heggarty, narey, atiken, etc shoe horned in at right back or central mid and sometimes a back 5 with centre half’s in midfield. It wasn’t uncommon to have five or six centre half’s on the pitch. I think it was an antidote to the ally McLeod era of attacking full backs, wingers in a 4-3-3.  Stein kind of evolved to a more rigid  4-4-2, with one defensive centre mid and souness, or against weaker teams souness and a creative player. with likes of strachan and bett narrow on either side. Wingers rarely got a game with the likes of davie Cooper a sub.

 

 

 

[Guest Scot1]

Didn’t realise that Stein played so defensively when he was the Scotland manager, especially considering the amount of quality creative, attacking players we had at the time.

[Third Lanark]

9 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

Stein often did this early in his scotland tenure.  heggarty, narey, atiken, etc shoe horned in at right back or central mid and sometimes a back 5 with centre half’s in midfield. It wasn’t uncommon to have five or six centre half’s on the pitch. I think it was an antidote to the ally McLeod era of attacking full backs, wingers in a 4-3-3.  Stein kind of evolved to a more rigid  4-4-2, with one defensive centre mid and souness, or against weaker teams souness and a creative player. with likes of strachan and bett narrow on either side. Wingers rarely got a game with the likes of davie Cooper a sub.

 

 

 

Thanks for that. For all we revered Stein I had to question some of his selection tactics. With the likes of Souness, Gemmill, Hartford, Bett and others we should never have needed to use so many centre halves. Aitken could certainly play DM but McLeish looked like a fish out of water. Part of the problem may have been that we had a surfeit of good CB partnerships: Hegarty, Narey; McLeish, Miller; Hansen too, competing. So bit like trying to shoehorn Tierney and Robertson in in a way.

[Guest Scot1]

Paul McStay would’ve been about this time as well, I think

[Third Lanark]

4 minutes ago, Scot1 said:

Paul McStay would’ve been about this time as well, I think

Exactly. McStay, Souness and Bett would have been not unlike our current midfield in fact. So all the more baffling to replace them with carthorses by comparison. McStay should have won more caps.

[Toepoke]

58 minutes ago, Third Lanark said:

McStay should have won more caps.

Injuries apart he was almost ever present for his entire career!

 

[Orraloon]

1 hour ago, Third Lanark said:

Exactly. McStay, Souness and Bett would have been not unlike our current midfield in fact. So all the more baffling to replace them with carthorses by comparison. McStay should have won more caps.

Carthorses. 🤣

I wish we had a few of them "carthorses" now. 🤣

Any one of Aitkin, Miller, McLeish Narey and even Hansen, who was never that great in a Scotland shirt, would walk straight into our team right now.