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1 hour ago, Diamond Scot said:

As ive said previously I dont know the Adams situation but you are wrong as he clearly has a connection with Scotland or else he wouldnt be eligible to play for us. How strong that connection is neither you nor I know but just because he elected to play for England at youth level and declined earlier invites doesnt mean he wouldnt be proud to play for us.

Peoples choices change as they grow up and things in life move on. 

Alot of people like English teams when they were younger but as they mature they move away from that thinking.

Not speaking specifically about Adams but we cant just form opinions on people because they didnt want to play for us when they were still growing from boys to men.

Also, being somebodys second choice is in itself a negative. Would you turn down sex with a supermodel if her 1st choice wasnt available?

Of vourse we know his feeling towards platlying for Scotland - he has turned down multiple offers to reptesent us which says it all. He has lived his entire life and played his entire career in Englamd . His first tejection of Scotland came around three years ago and he has not changed his mind in the further times he has been asked. If you cannot see what those signs tells us then I am flabberghasted. 

He is English and will pursue his dream of trying to get into the England squad and good on him for it. The book should be closed now on this one.

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14 hours ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Of vourse we know his feeling towards platlying for Scotland - he has turned down multiple offers to reptesent us which says it all. He has lived his entire life and played his entire career in Englamd . His first tejection of Scotland came around three years ago and he has not changed his mind in the further times he has been asked. If you cannot see what those signs tells us then I am flabberghasted. 

He is English and will pursue his dream of trying to get into the England squad and good on him for it. The book should be closed now on this one.

What was said when we approached him? Who spoke to him? Was it to him directly or hia agent? Did he tell us a flat out no or anything else.

You dont know the answers to any of these questions. 

My feeling with regards to Adams are that he probably doesnt want to play for us but my point about eligible players is a general one.

Dykes took nearly a year to choose us and every interview he gives he never says he has always felt Scottish. It was clearly something that he weighed up against the country of his birth. He didnt join uo with squads whilst he considered his position.

I assume you dont think should be in the squad for the euros aswell?

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25 minutes ago, Diamond Scot said:

What was said when we approached him? Who spoke to him? Was it to him directly or hia agent? Did he tell us a flat out no or anything else.

You dont know the answers to any of these questions. 

My feeling with regards to Adams are that he probably doesnt want to play for us but my point about eligible players is a general one.

Dykes took nearly a year to choose us and every interview he gives he never says he has always felt Scottish. It was clearly something that he weighed up against the country of his birth. He didnt join uo with squads whilst he considered his position.

I assume you dont think should be in the squad for the euros aswell?

Dykes didn't just decide once we were going to a tournament that he would play for us. If Che Adams was to decide to play for us it would be just because of us going to a major tournament. I think thats unfair on the guys who earned us our spot in the euros.

If Adams wants to play for us let him wait til after the euros. Then we will see if he's really committed. 

I think it's pretty clear as well that Adams wanted to wait for his chance with England when we asked him otherwise he would of been in our squads for sure. So he must of gave a flat out no to us asking. Thats obvious. 

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13 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said:

Dykes didn't just decide once we were going to a tournament that he would play for us. If Che Adams was to decide to play for us it would be just because of us going to a major tournament. I think thats unfair on the guys who earned us our spot in the euros.

If Adams wants to play for us let him wait til after the euros. Then we will see if he's really committed. 

I think it's pretty clear as well that Adams wanted to wait for his chance with England when we asked him otherwise he would of been in our squads for sure. So he must of gave a flat out no to us asking. Thats obvious. 

So we are ok with players delaying accepting a call up when asked whilst they make their mind up but not if it coincides with a major championship. 

Surely using your logic a player should know straight away if they feel Scottish and therefore shouldnt need any time to decide. Surely by the time they are an adult they know what country they want to represent?

Dykes only agreed to play for us when we were in a playoff. Why didnt he have to wait until a fresh campaign?

He also played for Australia at schoolboy level (the country of his birth). So is it not clear that he felt Australian at that stage in his life?

Surely if a player is eligible for us, decides they want to committ to us (whatever the reason) and are better than the competition thats all that matters. 

Like others have said. What about Stuart McCall.

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1 minute ago, Diamond Scot said:

So we are ok with players delaying accepting a call up when asked whilst they make their mind up but not if it coincides with a major championship. 

Surely using your logic a player should know straight away if they feel Scottish and therefore shouldnt need any time to decide. Surely by the time they are an adult they know what country they want to represent?

Dykes only agreed to play for us when we were in a playoff. Why didnt he have to wait until a fresh campaign?

He also played for Australia at schoolboy level (the country of his birth). So is it not clear that he felt Australian at that stage in his life?

Surely if a player is eligible for us, decides they want to committ to us (whatever the reason) and are better than the competition thats all that matters. 

Like others have said. What about Stuart McCall.

If Adams had done what dykes had and declared himself available for the play off and nations league games I doubt anyone would have a problem with it. It's pretty clear that any parent/grandparent rule player like Adams deciding to switch to us is just doing it to play at a major tournament. Especially one who is 24 and has turned us down before. 

Dykes and mctominay both took a while to make their decision but it wasn't just done on the basis that there's an upcoming tournament and they want to play in it. They both came into a struggling side who hadn't made a tournament in 20 plus years and who had no guarantee of going to one soon. Even though we had the play offs most neutrals didn't think we would get past Norway or Serbia, infact I didn't think we would either. Dykes probably would of had more chance with Australia given the recent history and their relative easy path to a world Cup. 

Personally I ain't that keen on the grandparent rule and Adams clearly is English and wants to play for England. However I won't mind if after the euros he decides to play for us and is fully committed. Letting him play in this upcoming euros is a slap in the face to the guys who worked hard and were dedicated to getting us there despite their limitations. 

Have to admit though that it would be nice to have someone like Adams playing upfront in either of the striker positions as he does look like a good player and he's still only 24 so will have his best years ahead of him to improve. 

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11 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said:

If Adams had done what dykes had and declared himself available for the play off and nations league games I doubt anyone would have a problem with it. It's pretty clear that any parent/grandparent rule player like Adams deciding to switch to us is just doing it to play at a major tournament. Especially one who is 24 and has turned us down before. 

Dykes and mctominay both took a while to make their decision but it wasn't just done on the basis that there's an upcoming tournament and they want to play in it. They both came into a struggling side who hadn't made a tournament in 20 plus years and who had no guarantee of going to one soon. Even though we had the play offs most neutrals didn't think we would get past Norway or Serbia, infact I didn't think we would either. Dykes probably would of had more chance with Australia given the recent history and their relative easy path to a world Cup. 

Personally I ain't that keen on the grandparent rule and Adams clearly is English and wants to play for England. However I won't mind if after the euros he decides to play for us and is fully committed. Letting him play in this upcoming euros is a slap in the face to the guys who worked hard and were dedicated to getting us there despite their limitations. 

Have to admit though that it would be nice to have someone like Adams playing upfront in either of the striker positions as he does look like a good player and he's still only 24 so will have his best years ahead of him to improve. 

Mibee Stuart Armstrong had been bending his lugs. I wish the Celtic guys would do that to Karemoko.

We don't know who said what to whom and when.

I would rather have a striker who is scoring in the EPL, than one who can't score in spl ( shankland)

howeveras I've previously stated it's up to Stevie Clarke. 

I will support whoever he chooses.

 

Edited by Archiesdad
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42 minutes ago, Archiesdad said:

Mibee Stuart Armstrong had been bending his lugs. I wish the Celtic guys would do that to Karemoko.

We don't know who said what to whom and when.

I would rather have a striker who is scoring in the EPL, than one who can't score in spl ( shankland)

howeveras I've previously stated it's up to Stevie Clarke. 

I will support whoever he chooses.

 

It would be good to have Adams in the squad but he's 24 and if he wanted to play for us he would be already. He's been operating at championship and epl level for 4 and half years so it's clear that he would probably have made our squads if he wanted to but it's obvious he was holding out for England. That's fair enough and understandable. I think that after the euros if he's interested it would be good to have him involved as he looks class. Actions speak louder than words so who said what is irrelevant imo. 

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2 hours ago, Diamond Scot said:

What was said when we approached him? Who spoke to him? Was it to him directly or hia agent? Did he tell us a flat out no or anything else.

You dont know the answers to any of these questions. 

My feeling with regards to Adams are that he probably doesnt want to play for us but my point about eligible players is a general one.

Dykes took nearly a year to choose us and every interview he gives he never says he has always felt Scottish. It was clearly something that he weighed up against the country of his birth. He didnt join uo with squads whilst he considered his position.

I assume you dont think should be in the squad for the euros aswell?

At the end of the day when asked he said no otherwise he'd have been called up long ago. That says all we need to know.

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49 minutes ago, duncan II said:

I’m not actually sure he’s that good a player. Not anytime I’ve seen him. But I don’t tend to watch games featuring  him very much so maybe he’s another Maradona.

Tbh I have mostly only seen his highlights from motd but he is getting rave reviews from soton fans this season and lets be honest he's probably a step up from anything we have. 

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My understanding is that McLeish approached McTominay and he agreed ti play for Scotland although it seemed he was quite set on playing for us from the off. 

Dykes only really came onto the radar for Scotland in his last two seasons for Livi. I don't believe anyone from Scotland formally approached him but Australia did. He then publicly said he would have to make a hard decision but had already made it before any announcement. he moved to QPR and Clarke spoke to him before including him in the squad. He wasn't considered good enough to be part of the squad under McLeish or Clarke's early games. 

There is no comparison with these two and Che Adams.

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What fans always want from players representing Scotland is 100% commitment. Adams has been asked to commit to us on multiple occasions and turned them down. That equals 0% commitment. I am not sure how that is hard for people to equate here. I hold no malice to him - he was born in England, has represented England and has played his entire career in England. As Lloyd Grossman used to say: 'The clues are there.'

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