Euro 2020/21 squad discussion/general chat.

[ErsatzThistle]

27 minutes ago, COLT NY said:

It should be the same to any English boys who qualify but haven't been too sure up until this point.

Absolutely right. 

It wouldn't surprise me if the SFA are soon contacted by the agents of one or two eligible players who may have turned us down in past. Now changing their tune and hoping to play in a tournament and increase their profile. Anyone up to that kind of game can feck right off !

[COLT NY]

I'm delighted that we can have a thread about who should make up a 23 man squad for the finals. It's been a long time since this was a thing. I'm sure things will change in the coming months, but this is what I would select if I had to do it today:

Goalkeepers: Marshall, Gordon, McLaughlin

Defenders: Robertson, Tierney, McKenna, Gallagher, O'Donnell, Cooper, Palmer 

Midfielders: McTominey, Jack, McGregor, Armstrong, McGinn, McLean, Forrest, Fraser, Fleck 

Forwards: Christie, Dykes, Griffiths, McBurnie

 

 

Edited November 13, 2020 by COLT NY

[Burj_Alba]

9 minutes ago, COLT NY said:

I'm delighted that we can have a thread about who should make up a 23 man squad for the finals. It's been a long time since this was a thing. I'm sure things will change in the coming months, but this is what I would select if I had to do it today:

Goalkeepers: Marshall, Gordon, McLaughlin ( up for grabs, depends if he is first choice at Ibrox))

Defenders: Robertson, Tierney, McKenna, Gallagher, O'Donnell, Cooper, Palmer ( hopefully somebody emerges to challenge him and Considine should be in there somewhere )

Midfielders: McTominey, Jack, McGregor, Armstrong, McGinn, McLean, Forrest, Fraser, Fleck Cannot disagree with any of that. Gilmour, Ferguson?

Forwards: Christie, Dykes, Griffiths, McBurnie He will be there as Clarke likes him but needs to prove himself, two matches against Slovakia and Israel might be his chance.

Burke will be there or thereabouts.

 

 

 

[er yir macaroon]

I don’t see too many changes for the finals.

I think Hornby and Gilmour have a chance to step up. Forrest will be back and maybe John Souttar. 

[ErsatzThistle]

I really want Billy Gilmour into our senior squad as soon as he's fully match fit again.

[borojock]

4 hours ago, COLT NY said:

You can add to that list Robert Snodgrass, James McArthur, Scott Brown, Alan McGregor and anyone else who decided they didn't fancy it in these past few years. I doubt we're missing any of them at this moment, but whether they'd have been in the team or not they missed the chance to be involved. Great to see the likes of Marshall and Gordon jumping around in the huddle after the game, those guys have been there for most of the 22 years and keep answering the call.

Im not suggesting we are missing any of them or would want them back 

But i thought at the time with Snoddy and Fletch its a strange one your retiring when were 2 games away from getting to a major tournament in 22 years - you would have surely hung on for another couple of years to try your luck 

Great thing is we have a really strong and close squad now - Interesting thing is its a 23 man squad so some squad regulars are going to sadly miss out 

I do wonder if COVID is still around at the same rate they will increase that number  

[ErsatzThistle]

13 minutes ago, borojock said:

Im not suggesting we are missing any of them or would want them back 

But i thought at the time with Snoddy and Fletch its a strange one your retiring when were 2 games away from getting to a major tournament in 22 years - you would have surely hung on for another couple of years to try your luck 

Great thing is we have a really strong and close squad now - Interesting thing is its a 23 man squad so some squad regulars are going to sadly miss out 

I do wonder if COVID is still around at the same rate they will increase that number  

Although not for these two upcoming games but for all next years games, Clarke will have young Scots players like Ryan Porteous, Tom McIntyre, Billy Gilmour, Lewis Ferguson, Ross McCrorie and Alan Campbell to consider. If Kevin Nisbet can keep scoring he'll get a chance too next year.

There's a video on the Scotland national team YouTube page where Clarke and his three backroom staff (Reid, Carver & Woods) all discuss the squad. Interestingly, Clarke and Woods strongly implied that if we had had friendly matches then both Robbie McCrorie and Ross Doohan would have been called up and given debuts. They did seem to be keen on getting new, younger goalkeepers involved.

[Tartan blood]

6 hours ago, Texas Pete said:

Anyone that tries this should be told in no uncertain terms to fuck off. 

Brown is past it and Snodgrass wouldn’t improve our squad. 

The only retired guy I can think of that may improve the squad is McGregor but I think Marshall has more than earned the right to be our number 1 so McGregor can bolt as well. 

My opinion is that absolutely everyone should be given the chance to play if they are willing. Clean slate. However, as you say, there is no one that I think would actually enhance the team. Scott Brown is apparently great to have in the dressing room, but that alone certainly isn't enough reason to bring him along. He is finally starting to show some decline at Celtic, and won't be any better by June.

In terms of getting a move, I was thinking of Mulgrew, who as far as I know never retired, he is just not getting a game. Would he improve us though?

But in all honesty, our squad is so strong in just about every position that I don't think I'd have any of our veterans back. 

[ErsatzThistle]

13 minutes ago, Tartan blood said:

My opinion is that absolutely everyone should be given the chance to play if they are willing. Clean slate. However, as you say, there is no one that I think would actually enhance the team. Scott Brown is apparently great to have in the dressing room, but that alone certainly isn't enough reason to bring him along. He is finally starting to show some decline at Celtic, and won't be any better by June.

In terms of getting a move, I was thinking of Mulgrew, who as far as I know never retired, he is just not getting a game. Would he improve us though?

But in all honesty, our squad is so strong in just about every position that I don't think I'd have any of our veterans back. 

Mulgrew seriously ?

He's is actually back playing again but for Fleetwood in League One. Cooper, McKenna, Considine, Hanlon, Porteous and McIntyre are deservedly ahead of him. 

In his final few caps for Scotland, he was dreadful and I think he knew himself that he'd had a good run and his time was now up.

[Tartan blood]

1 minute ago, ErsatzThistle said:

Mulgrew seriously ?

He's is actually back playing again but for Fleetwood in League One. Cooper, McKenna, Considine, Hanlon, Porteous and McIntyre are deservedly ahead of him. 

In his final few caps for Scotland, he was dreadful and I think he knew himself that he'd had a good run and his time was now up.

Ah okay, I didn't know he was back playing. 

I was just talking hypothetically. I'm not saying I want him back. We now have so many options at CB, LB and CM that there really isn't a spot for him in a 23 man squad, or even a 30 man squad.

I want the best players available to us. 1 year ago I'd have happily taken some of our retirees back. But now, I don't think any of them would even be selected. Barring maybe McGregor and Brown. (again, I'm not advocating they should be selected)

[Burj_Alba]

1 hour ago, ErsatzThistle said:

Although not for these two upcoming games but for all next years games, Clarke will have young Scots players like Ryan Porteous, Tom McIntyre, Billy Gilmour, Lewis Ferguson, Ross McCrorie and Alan Campbell to consider. If Kevin Nisbet can keep scoring he'll get a chance too next year.

There's a video on the Scotland national team YouTube page where Clarke and his three backroom staff (Reid, Carver & Woods) all discuss the squad. Interestingly, Clarke and Woods strongly implied that if we had had friendly matches then both Robbie McCrorie and Ross Doohan would have been called up and given debuts. They did seem to be keen on getting new, younger goalkeepers involved.

Think one of these young goalkeepers will challenge McLaughlin for the third goalie spot if McLaughlin is not getting regular game time at Ibrox. And they are playing well on loan at ross or Livi.

[Caledonian Craig]

5 hours ago, COLT NY said:

I'm delighted that we can have a thread about who should make up a 23 man squad for the finals. It's been a long time since this was a thing. I'm sure things will change in the coming months, but this is what I would select if I had to do it today:

Goalkeepers: Marshall, Gordon, McLaughlin

Defenders: Robertson, Tierney, McKenna, Gallagher, O'Donnell, Cooper, Palmer 

Midfielders: McTominey, Jack, McGregor, Armstrong, McGinn, McLean, Forrest, Fraser, Fleck 

Forwards: Christie, Dykes, Griffiths, McBurnie

 

 

I think this will be very close to the squad.. I don't see any glaring misses there. It depends on how Billy Gilmour fares. If he picks up where he left off for Chelsea then he comes into contention maybe in the place of Kenny McLean.

[shaggycoo]

53 minutes ago, Tartan blood said:

Ah okay, I didn't know he was back playing. 

I was just talking hypothetically. I'm not saying I want him back. We now have so many options at CB, LB and CM that there really isn't a spot for him in a 23 man squad, or even a 30 man squad.

I want the best players available to us. 1 year ago I'd have happily taken some of our retirees back. But now, I don't think any of them would even be selected. Barring maybe McGregor and Brown. (again, I'm not advocating they should be selected)

Nope, McGregor and Brown have had their day. Both have retired, came back and then retired again - let it go. 👍

[Caledonian Craig]

3 minutes ago, shaggycoo said:

Nope, McGregor and Brown have had their day. Both have retired, came back and then retired again - let it go. 👍

Spot on. No picking and choosing when they want to represent us.

[Tartan blood]

26 minutes ago, shaggycoo said:

Nope, McGregor and Brown have had their day. Both have retired, came back and then retired again - let it go. 👍

Agreed. We have better.

 

In fact, I think Clarke is really going to struggle to pick only 23 players. Our squad depth right now is incredible. We could  put out almost a full 11 of different players to last night and not look much weaker.

[Tartan Chris]

11 hours ago, Tartan blood said:

For the first time in this generation, we're going to have players climbing over each other to be involved. 

I predict some players looking for moves back to Scotland in January to improve their game time and be in with a chance. Clarke has shown he won't discriminate against teams or leagues.

I also wonder if anyone will "coincidentally" come out of retirement and make themselves available.

I doubt Clarke would consider any of Ritchie, Cairney, Matt Phillips, Bardsley, Snoddy (who was a good servant in fairness) Stephen Fletcher and others who've been culled in last 18 months. I don't think some of them got a fair chance considering their form for club sides but ultimately international teams move on in cycles and this is the squad to go forward with.

Worth noting Fleck, Forrest, Ryan Fraser and Gilmour all weren't available and two of those would certainly be in the final 23 if fit so there's more decent options available beyond last night's squad. Perhaps Grant Hanley aswell but I don't rate him that highly and McKenna and Cooper on bench is decent cover for what was a poverty position just 6 months back.

Worry for me is with the brutal schedule losing one of the key players to injury just before the tournament. Robbo is only one of Liverpool backline not to get serious injury so far this season so that's a concern.

Edited November 13, 2020 by Tartan Chris

[Malcolm]

11 minutes ago, Tartan Chris said:

I doubt Clarke would consider any of Ritchie, Cairney, Matt Phillips, Bardsley, Snoddy (who was a good servant in fairness) Stephen Fletcher and others who've been culled in last 18 months. I don't think some of them got a fair chance considering their form for club sides but ultimately international teams move on in cycles and this is the squad to go forward with.

Worth noting Fleck, Forrest, Ryan Fraser and Gilmour all weren't available and two of those would certainly be in the final 23 if fit so there's more decent options available beyond last night's squad. Perhaps Grant Hanley aswell but I don't rate him that highly and McKenna and Cooper on bench is decent cover for what was a poverty position just 6 months back.

Worry for me is with the brutal schedule losing one of the key players to injury just before the tournament. Robbo is only one of Liverpool backline not to get serious injury so far this season so that's a concern.

I think Forrests place in the squad is at risk simply as we don’t play with wingers. If it’s a choice between Forrest and Gilmour I would have the latter.

[Taylor1996]

2 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

I think Forrests place in the squad is at risk simply as we don’t play with wingers. If it’s a choice between Forrest and Gilmour I would have the latter.

Fraser is technically a winger, he's doing quite well.

Both Fraser and Forrest are better when they have freedom to drift into the middle. None are really old fashioned wingers who fly past full-backs and cross it into the box.

I'd trust Forrest up front with Dykes.

The main thing to take away from this is that we do have options. Which is fantastic.

[er yir macaroon]

50 minutes ago, Taylor1996 said:

Fraser is technically a winger, he's doing quite well.

Both Fraser and Forrest are better when they have freedom to drift into the middle. None are really old fashioned wingers who fly past full-backs and cross it into the box.

I'd trust Forrest up front with Dykes.

The main thing to take away from this is that we do have options. Which is fantastic.

Forrest, Fraser and Christie will all be in the squad, and they’ll be competing for one position. Albeit this seems impossible. 

Edited November 13, 2020 by er yir macaroon

[Tartan blood]

1 hour ago, Tartan Chris said:

I doubt Clarke would consider any of Ritchie, Cairney, Matt Phillips, Bardsley, Snoddy (who was a good servant in fairness) Stephen Fletcher and others who've been culled in last 18 months. I don't think some of them got a fair chance considering their form for club sides but ultimately international teams move on in cycles and this is the squad to go forward with.

Worth noting Fleck, Forrest, Ryan Fraser and Gilmour all weren't available and two of those would certainly be in the final 23 if fit so there's more decent options available beyond last night's squad. Perhaps Grant Hanley aswell but I don't rate him that highly and McKenna and Cooper on bench is decent cover for what was a poverty position just 6 months back.

Worry for me is with the brutal schedule losing one of the key players to injury just before the tournament. Robbo is only one of Liverpool backline not to get serious injury so far this season so that's a concern.

Yeah, it wasn't so long ago that an international retirement was devastating news. Now it barely makes a headline. We are so strong with the squad we have, and getting stronger by the week.

Clarke is going to have a nightmare whittling a fully available squad down to just 23. And 6 months is an eternity in football. By June you could end up having David Turnbull, Mikey Johnstone and Forrest all tearing it up in Scotland. Gerrard might finally give some of the Rangers wonderkids a chance and surprise us all. If Hickey is still playing in Serie A every week, we can't ignore him either. Then it's quite realistic that some other younger players get decent transfers in January and force their way in e.g McRorie, Ferguson et al.

We're spoilt for choice now, and I think the choices will only continue to grow. As you say, heaven forbid we end up with an injury crisis.

[Taylor1996]

24 minutes ago, er yir macaroon said:

Forrest, Fraser and Christie will all be in the squad, and they’ll be competing for one position. Albeit this seems impossible. 

Hope so. The more choices we have, the better.

16 minutes ago, Tartan blood said:

Yeah, it wasn't so long ago that an international retirement was devastating news. Now it barely makes a headline. We are so strong with the squad we have, and getting stronger by the week.

Clarke is going to have a nightmare whittling a fully available squad down to just 23. And 6 months is an eternity in football. By June you could end up having David Turnbull, Mikey Johnstone and Forrest all tearing it up in Scotland. Gerrard might finally give some of the Rangers wonderkids a chance and surprise us all. If Hickey is still playing in Serie A every week, we can't ignore him either. Then it's quite realistic that some other younger players get decent transfers in January and force their way in e.g McRorie, Ferguson et al.

We're spoilt for choice now, and I think the choices will only continue to grow. As you say, heaven forbid we end up with an injury crisis.

Good post.

We do seem to have a few good kids knocking on the door.

It's a pity that Michael Johnstone is having a torrid time with injuries, though, as we need someone to finally replace McFadden.

I have hopes for Kennedy and Hepburn.

[Hercules Rockefeller]

Things could significantly change in the coming months, but if I had to guess the 23-man squad I reckon we'll go with this (with probable/possible choices in italics, absolute definites in bold):

 

Goalkeepers: Marshall, Gordon, McLaughlin

Defenders: Robertson, Tierney, McKenna, Gallagher, O'Donnell, Cooper, Palmer, McTominay

Midfielders: Jack, McGregor, Armstrong, McGinn, McLean, Forrest, Christie, Gilmour

Forwards: Fraser, Dykes, Griffiths, McBurnie

[Texas Pete]

6 hours ago, Tartan blood said:

My opinion is that absolutely everyone should be given the chance to play if they are willing. Clean slate. However, as you say, there is no one that I think would actually enhance the team. Scott Brown is apparently great to have in the dressing room, but that alone certainly isn't enough reason to bring him along. He is finally starting to show some decline at Celtic, and won't be any better by June.

In terms of getting a move, I was thinking of Mulgrew, who as far as I know never retired, he is just not getting a game. Would he improve us though?

But in all honesty, our squad is so strong in just about every position that I don't think I'd have any of our veterans back. 

You are entitled to your opinion but I would ask you why on Earth you would think it would be OK for someone who retired from international football to come back for a shot at glory at the expense of someone who helped get us there?

In my opinion, anyone who has retired before now can come back if they like (if Clarke thinks they would improve the squad) but only for qualifiers/Nations league games. The players that got us to Euro 2020 are the players that should represent us there (with the exception of anyone that breaks through between now and then like Gilmour and McCrorie etc.). 

[Caledonian Craig]

12 minutes ago, Texas Pete said:

You are entitled to your opinion but I would ask you why on Earth you would think it would be OK for someone who retired from international football to come back for a shot at glory at the expense of someone who helped get us there?

In my opinion, anyone who has retired before now can come back if they like (if Clarke thinks they would improve the squad) but only for qualifiers/Nations league games. The players that got us to Euro 2020 are the players that should represent us there (with the exception of anyone that breaks through between now and then like Gilmour and McCrorie etc.). 

Fully agree. Why would we want Broon? Yesterday's man and soon to be man of two and three days ago.

[bigfingers]

If Forrest is fit and firing he will be at the euros. Calling up players who have already retired and failed in previous campaigns is a horrible thought.