Scottish players in action 20/21

[Taylor1996]

5 minutes ago, ProudScot said:

Graeme Shinnie is miles off the squad.

Fleck & McLean both play that role for us when they play & McTominay will be in there you’d expect in the next round of matches. 

I'm not too sure he's that far off. Saw him recently against Huddersfield. He ran the midfield.

Fleck is a box to box midfielder and McLean is an attacking midfielder. I wouldnt really say either was a natural defensive midfielder. 

Yes, McLean plays in a double-pivot, but usually with Oliver Skipp babysitting him. (Only 20 years old, but Skipp looks like a player... too bad he's English...)

At Sheffield United, I'd say that Norwood is the more defensive midfielder of their three.

Neither McLean or Fleck would be trusted to play as a lone anchorman for their club. 

[Super_Scotlandfan]

38 minutes ago, Tartan blood said:

 

However, Clarke today did allude to the concern we all have that he will be loyal to the players that got us there. He is probably just keeping his cards close to his chest, but it could mean players like Turnbull and Gauld might miss out.

Yeah I did find that a little concerning. 

Obviously he needs to strike a balance  between loyalty and including in-form players.  

But we all need to remember that our form isn’t THAT good and that the ‘players that got us here’ were also guys that played under Alex McLeish in the previous nations league. 

Steve Clarke’s record for qualifying for the Euros was a 0-0 home draw against Israel, barely creating an open play chance and a good performance against Serbia (but still a draw). We then followed that up with losses against Slovakia and Israel. 

There’s no need to be loyal to players that played poorly/adequately in these games particularly if their club form isn’t special.  

 

 

[syecosse]

Marshall off injured looks like a back injury. 

[Super_Scotlandfan]

5 minutes ago, syecosse said:

Marshall off injured looks like a back injury. 

Hope it’s not too bad. And also hope that his injury contributed to him letting this go in...

https://streamable.com/7wtji4

 

[Taylor1996]

7 minutes ago, Super_Scotlandfan said:

Hope it’s not too bad. And also hope that his injury contributed to him letting this go in...

https://streamable.com/7wtji4

 

Yeah. I'm watching it. Hopefully the injury isn't too bad.

Shinnie has been the best midfielder on show in the first half. Solid in the challenge and I can't remember him losing possession. 

[Super_Scotlandfan]

9 minutes ago, Taylor1996 said:

Yeah. I'm watching it. Hopefully the injury isn't too bad.

Shinnie has been the best midfielder on show in the first half. Solid in the challenge and I can't remember him losing possession. 

Good player but not good enough for our squad without a few injuries. Same as Fulton and Bannan. 

[noctonjock]

McKenna not playing for Forest tonight( injured ) and a clean sheet so far . They haven't conceded many lately so a struggle to get back in the starting line up 

[ProudScot]

37 minutes ago, Super_Scotlandfan said:

Yeah I did find that a little concerning. 

Obviously he needs to strike a balance  between loyalty and including in-form players.  

But we all need to remember that our form isn’t THAT good and that the ‘players that got us here’ were also guys that played under Alex McLeish in the previous nations league. 

Steve Clarke’s record for qualifying for the Euros was a 0-0 home draw against Israel, barely creating an open play chance and a good performance against Serbia (but still a draw). We then followed that up with losses against Slovakia and Israel. 

There’s no need to be loyal to players that played poorly/adequately in these games particularly if their club form isn’t special.  

 

 

That’s nail on the head. 

Players like McBurnie, O’Donnell and even Gallagher have been playing poorly, not playing or playing for a team doing terrible all season.

Gallagher will of course be in based on his previous exploits & so too probably O’Donnell but to have the like of McBurnie in when his performances have been woeful for the national team anyway & he has done zero of note in months since then, would be silly and a waste of a place. 

[Taylor1996]

10 minutes ago, Super_Scotlandfan said:

Good player but not good enough for our squad without a few injuries. Same as Fulton and Bannan. 

And of course he gets subbed off.  (despite 97% success rate)

Take all of our midfielders. Only Jack is defensive. If he gets injured then it will throw off the balance. 

[ceudmilefailte]

38 minutes ago, ProudScot said:

McBurnie in when his performances have been woeful for the national team anyway & he has done zero of note in months since then, would be silly and a waste of a place. 

Luckily Dykes,Shankland,Griffiths and Paterson are on fire.

Naismith scored tonight though.

[Blantyre_Braveheart]

13 hours ago, mccaughey85 said:

Maybe this kid could get a few games before the euros and then push for the squad. 

Would probably have to put in some stellar performances to be considered tbf.

Obviously we dont have much talent at rb but taking an untested 19 year old to the euros is a big decision for Clarke. 

Personally regardless of ban or not, I'd take Patterson to the EURO's (Gilmour aswell).

Not over O'Donnell but for Palmer. Palmer is approaching 30 and is below average and will most likely be nowhere our squad again after the EURO's. Patterson on the other hand is our most promising RB (followed by Ashby at West Ham). Neither Patterson or Palmer is likely to get any minutes at the EURO's but for our long term future taking Patterson would be better. It would give him the experience of being there and gets him integrated into the set up early. We have a nasty habit of waiting far too long to call up younger players. Our squads end up with little international experience despite alot being in their mid/late 20s.

I'd take Billy Gilmour over a Kenny McLean for the exact same reason. These players are the future. Having squad fillers in their late 20s over giving squad experience to more promising players is something we need to avoid going forward.

[ProudScot]

10 hours ago, ceudmilefailte said:

Luckily Dykes,Shankland,Griffiths and Paterson are on fire.

Naismith scored tonight though.

All the players listed are far superior players to McBurnie, or are more effective at what they do - Paterson being an example of a big lump who runs around but actually scores (something McBurnie can’t do).

[Tartan blood]

7 hours ago, Blantyre_Braveheart said:

Personally regardless of ban or not, I'd take Patterson to the EURO's (Gilmour aswell).

Not over O'Donnell but for Palmer. Palmer is approaching 30 and is below average and will most likely be nowhere our squad again after the EURO's. Patterson on the other hand is our most promising RB (followed by Ashby at West Ham). Neither Patterson or Palmer is likely to get any minutes at the EURO's but for our long term future taking Patterson would be better. It would give him the experience of being there and gets him integrated into the set up early. We have a nasty habit of waiting far too long to call up younger players. Our squads end up with little international experience despite alot being in their mid/late 20s.

I'd take Billy Gilmour over a Kenny McLean for the exact same reason. These players are the future. Having squad fillers in their late 20s over giving squad experience to more promising players is something we need to avoid going forward.

I agree with this sentiment in general. Sometimes you can just tell when a player is going to be a success e.g Robertson, D.Fletcher, Faddy etc. And, yes, any player that fits in that bracket should be included in most squads, for experience at the very least.

HOWEVER, I think you are underestimating how small a 23 man squad is. There might be room for 1 wildcard at most. But Clarke will not be choosing any player he has no intention of playing (with the exception of the 3rd goalkeeper). As good a prospect as N.Patterson is, he is quite far down in the pecking order. In terms of youngsters, Gilmour, Turnbull and Hickey will all be ahead of him. As will Gauld, Hendry, Hanley, Fleck etc etc. 

I do agree that I'd leave Palmer at home, but I wouldn't be replacing him with another RB. Jack, Tierney, Armstrong and maybe Burke could all do a job there if O'Donnell can't play every game. Versatility will be vital in the squad. There shouldn't be any squad fillers, regardless of age.

[er yir macaroon]

8 hours ago, Blantyre_Braveheart said:

Personally regardless of ban or not, I'd take Patterson to the EURO's (Gilmour aswell).

Not over O'Donnell but for Palmer. Palmer is approaching 30 and is below average and will most likely be nowhere our squad again after the EURO's. Patterson on the other hand is our most promising RB (followed by Ashby at West Ham). Neither Patterson or Palmer is likely to get any minutes at the EURO's but for our long term future taking Patterson would be better. It would give him the experience of being there and gets him integrated into the set up early. We have a nasty habit of waiting far too long to call up younger players. Our squads end up with little international experience despite alot being in their mid/late 20s.

I'd take Billy Gilmour over a Kenny McLean for the exact same reason. These players are the future. Having squad fillers in their late 20s over giving squad experience to more promising players is something we need to avoid going forward.

There will be no squad fillers at the Euros. 

[mccaughey85]

A larger squad than 23 might allow Patterson to get in.

What the lad really needs is to get a solid run of games for the remainder of the season then clarke might be tempted to take him instead of palmer. 

Let's just hope his punishment isn't too severe. 

[bazmidd]

This Covid breach is potentially a very costly mistake for Patterson, because if he hadn't done that, he would be in Rangers first team for the foreseeable while Taverner is injured. If he played well he would have been well in Clarke's thoughts as he is perfect for the wingback role and we only have O'Donnell or Palmer there for now, Patterson already looks as good if not better than them at 19. If Patterson had got in the Rangers team and played well he might have got a chance, but no way will the SFA call a player in with a Covid breach hanging over him

[ProudScot]

53 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said:

A larger squad than 23 might allow Patterson to get in.

What the lad really needs is to get a solid run of games for the remainder of the season then clarke might be tempted to take him instead of palmer. 

Let's just hope his punishment isn't too severe. 

Given Celtic not being punished for Dubai and what’s just happened with the referees - how can there be any punishment!? 

[mccaughey85]

1 minute ago, ProudScot said:

Given Celtic not being punished for Dubai and what’s just happened with the referees - how can there be any punishment!? 

I thought dubai was given the ok by the government, although celtic should really of pulled the plug on it themselves. 

 

[scotlad]

3 hours ago, ProudScot said:

All the players listed are far superior players to McBurnie, or are more effective at what they do - Paterson being an example of a big lump who runs around but actually scores (something McBurnie can’t do).

Lawrence Shankland isn't "far superior" to Oli McBurnie, behave yourself!

[ProudScot]

55 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said:

I thought dubai was given the ok by the government, although celtic should really of pulled the plug on it themselves. 

 

The trip itself isn’t the issue it’s the lack of social distancing which was publicly photographed & subsequent covid cases - all of which went unpunished 

[ProudScot]

5 minutes ago, scotlad said:

Lawrence Shankland isn't "far superior" to Oli McBurnie, behave yourself!

He’s a much better player 

[mccaughey85]

1 minute ago, ProudScot said:

The trip itself isn’t the issue it’s the lack of social distancing which was publicly photographed & subsequent covid cases - all of which went unpunished 

Yeh sounds like they maybe got off lightly although two wrongs don't make a right. I am not really that bothered about these covid rules and strict adherence to them so I either way I hope they are lenient on Patterson. 

[scotlad]

17 minutes ago, ProudScot said:

He’s a much better player 

A much better player at what, the Xbox? Poker? The trombone??

Because if he was a much better football player he wouldn't still be kicking around the SPFL with fecking Dundee United - and considering he's a striker, it's safe to say he would probably have scored more than 7 goals all season too. 

[ProudScot]

22 minutes ago, scotlad said:

A much better player at what, the Xbox? Poker? The trombone??

Because if he was a much better football player he wouldn't still be kicking around the SPFL with fecking Dundee United - and considering he's a striker, it's safe to say he would probably have scored more than 7 goals all season too. 

In even his 10 minute cameos in our previous internationals he showed he was a superior player to McBurnie. 

unsure if you didn’t watch these games or haven’t seen Sheffield United for the past year or so? 

He’s been very poor or worse in all these games. 

[theabsentee]

10 hours ago, bazmidd said:

This Covid breach is potentially a very costly mistake for Patterson, because if he hadn't done that, he would be in Rangers first team for the foreseeable while Taverner is injured. If he played well he would have been well in Clarke's thoughts as he is perfect for the wingback role and we only have O'Donnell or Palmer there for now, Patterson already looks as good if not better than them at 19. If Patterson had got in the Rangers team and played well he might have got a chance, but no way will the SFA call a player in with a Covid breach hanging over him

The reality sadly.