Wales and the two Irelands

[kiltedlegs]

1 minute ago, ThistleWhistle said:

Was flicking in the car last night and heard on TalkSport that it was the first time since playing ROI in 2000 we'd come back to win a game.  Wasn't sure if that was just away from home or simply the first time in 20 years we'd come from behind but it's still pretty crap either way.  

Sick. 

So whenever we've lost the first goal, best possible result was a draw.... For this whole century!!! 

[Toepoke]

11 minutes ago, ThistleWhistle said:

Was flicking in the car last night and heard on TalkSport that it was the first time since playing ROI in 2000 we'd come back to win a game.  Wasn't sure if that was just away from home or simply the first time in 20 years we'd come from behind but it's still pretty crap either way.  

Astonishing stat. Struggling to recall a come from behind home victory since the 90s though (v Estonia at Tynecastle).

They do say the first goal in international games is crucial...

 

[kiltedlegs]

20 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

Astonishing stat. Struggling to recall a come from behind home victory since the 90s though (v Estonia at Tynecastle).

They do say the first goal in international games is crucial...

 

kacked my breeks when Beralus scored in 4 mins back in 2005.

[Kirk]

40 minutes ago, ThistleWhistle said:

Was flicking in the car last night and heard on TalkSport that it was the first time since playing ROI in 2000 we'd come back to win a game.  Wasn't sure if that was just away from home or simply the first time in 20 years we'd come from behind but it's still pretty crap either way.  

Must be away, were we not down 1-0 to Liechtenstein when we came back and won in the 97th min?

[ParisInAKilt]

7 minutes ago, Kirk said:

Must be away, were we not down 1-0 to Liechtenstein when we came back and won in the 97th min?

Yeah, Faddy’s last cap as well. 

 

[Toepoke]

10 minutes ago, Kirk said:

Must be away, were we not down 1-0 to Liechtenstein when we came back and won in the 97th min?

Right enough, forgot that one

 

[Kirk]

4 minutes ago, ParisInAKilt said:

Yeah, Faddy’s last cap as well. 

 

Had a feeling it was mccmanus too haha.

The relief in the stadium

[kiltedlegs]

Haha great moment.   But embarrassing 

[ceudmilefailte]

1 hour ago, ThistleWhistle said:

Was flicking in the car last night and heard on TalkSport that it was the first time since playing ROI in 2000 we'd come back to win a game.  Wasn't sure if that was just away from home or simply the first time in 20 years we'd come from behind but it's still pretty crap either way.  

Think we were 1-0 down at Hampden 5 years ago against Gibraltar, so must be just away. Gutless nation if there hasn't been more than one.

[kiltedlegs]

30 minutes ago, ceudmilefailte said:

Think we were 1-0 down at Hampden 5 years ago against Gibraltar, so must be just away. Gutless nation if there hasn't been more than one.

Gibraltar equalised but didn't take the lead. 

[gkm_vancouver]

Wales and NI have both been at a major tourney since 98; ROI have been in 3. Scotland are the second biggest nation in the UK and a bigger pool of players to draw from so have been severely under-performing in the same period. Managers have a big part in the success but as has been mentioned many a time the SFA must take a large part of the blame also. 

[ErsatzThistle]

7 hours ago, ThistleWhistle said:

Was flicking in the car last night and heard on TalkSport that it was the first time since playing ROI in 2000 we'd come back to win a game.  Wasn't sure if that was just away from home or simply the first time in 20 years we'd come from behind but it's still pretty crap either way.  

They haven't done their research. Lazy really.

Liechtenstein at home in 2010, 1-0 down and we somehow managed to undeservedly squeeze a 97th minute winner out of it.

We went 1-0 down to Wales in Dublin during the Nations Cup in 2011 but won the match 3-1.

There was a friendly vs Australia at Easter Road in 2012 where we went 1-0 down and came back to win 3-1.

In fact we went 1-0 down to Kazakhstan just last year at home. Final score again was 3-1.

[kiltedlegs]

35 minutes ago, ErsatzThistle said:

They haven't done their research. Lazy really.

Liechtenstein at home in 2010, 1-0 down and we somehow managed to undeservedly squeeze a 97th minute winner out of it.

We went 1-0 down to Wales in Dublin during the Nations Cup in 2011 but won the match 3-1.

There was a friendly vs Australia at Easter Road in 2012 where we went 1-0 down and came back to win 3-1.

In fact we went 1-0 down to Kazakhstan just last year at home. Final score again was 3-1.

Away

[ErsatzThistle]

22 minutes ago, kiltedlegs said:

Away

Wales in Dublin ?

[kiltedlegs]

34 minutes ago, ErsatzThistle said:

Wales in Dublin ?

Starting gear for a car

[McTeeko]

3 hours ago, ErsatzThistle said:

Wales in Dublin ?

Will be classed as neutral. Think the point on radio was ‘away’ games, hence the Dublin 2020 game they went by.

Edited September 9, 2020 by McTeeko

[Clyde1998]

On 9/7/2020 at 4:19 PM, PASTA Mick said:

I do also wonder whether we suffer from having a stronger league than Wale, N Ireland and Rep of Ireland.  Our league is strong enough that we are happy to pick players from it, but probably not strong enough to fully prepare players for international football.  I don't know for sure but I guess the vast majority of players for the two Irish teams and Wales are selected from English clubs sides.  Does this have an impact? 

I think the standard of league is a serious problem for us, as it allows players to reach a good standard of football at at young age, stay in their comfort zone, and stagnate. Irish and Northern Irish players almost exclusively move to England, while Welsh players have the ability to play in the English system at Cardiff and Swansea. They're also playing against a higher standard of opponent on a more regular basis in England; in Scotland you get 6-10 games per season against high enough standard teams (possibly more depending on the progress in Europe for players at Celtic/Rangers) - in England, you're getting 38+.

Northern Ireland had one NI based player in their last squad (five Scotland-based; one Italian), Ireland had only one not based in England (Shane Duffy, who's on loan at Celtic now), Wales had one Spanish, one German and one Belgian-based player, with the rest being English league players (only two each from Cardiff and Swansea). In general, they've got players playing in higher standard matches on a more regular basis than our players.

The problem is that with Rangers and Celtic and the history of the Scottish league, it's hard whether it's better to start positioning the Scottish league as a feeder league to the better leagues or as a destination for established players. I'd hazard a guess the league may actually be better for acting as a feeder league, as it would make clubs more focused on youth development and improving the quality of players coming through the league system.

[PASTA Mick]

8 hours ago, Clyde1998 said:

I think the standard of league is a serious problem for us, as it allows players to reach a good standard of football at at young age, stay in their comfort zone, and stagnate. Irish and Northern Irish players almost exclusively move to England, while Welsh players have the ability to play in the English system at Cardiff and Swansea. They're also playing against a higher standard of opponent on a more regular basis in England; in Scotland you get 6-10 games per season against high enough standard teams (possibly more depending on the progress in Europe for players at Celtic/Rangers) - in England, you're getting 38+.

Northern Ireland had one NI based player in their last squad (five Scotland-based; one Italian), Ireland had only one not based in England (Shane Duffy, who's on loan at Celtic now), Wales had one Spanish, one German and one Belgian-based player, with the rest being English league players (only two each from Cardiff and Swansea). In general, they've got players playing in higher standard matches on a more regular basis than our players.

The problem is that with Rangers and Celtic and the history of the Scottish league, it's hard whether it's better to start positioning the Scottish league as a feeder league to the better leagues or as a destination for established players. I'd hazard a guess the league may actually be better for acting as a feeder league, as it would make clubs more focused on youth development and improving the quality of players coming through the league system.

This is the tricky thing.  I don't think that anyone would want the Scottish league to be weakened.  The ideal situation would be that the standard improves but it's very hard to see how that would happen without any serious outside investment.  I do wonder why we haven't seen any mega-rich people come in for a club like Aberdeen, Hearts or Hibs.  It wouldn't take that much for them to be able to compete for trophies.

I think the Scottish league is being looked at a lot more closely now by teams across Europe.  The success of Robertson, van Dijk, Dembele, McGinn and (I guess) Gilmour is making teams realise that there are some good players in the league.  There is also a really high number of youth players being picked up.  It would suggest that the performance schools are working.  

I'm trying not to get too excited because Scotland have a habit of letting you down, but I think we could be at the start of a pretty exciting few years for Scotland.  The way our young players are being picked up is very similar to what happened to Belgium before all their players broke through.  I think in 5 years or so, we could be in a great place.  

[er yir macaroon]

On 9/7/2020 at 4:19 PM, PASTA Mick said:

I do also wonder whether we suffer from having a stronger league than Wale, N Ireland and Rep of Ireland.  Our league is strong enough that we are happy to pick players from it, but probably not strong enough to fully prepare players for international football.  I don't know for sure but I guess the vast majority of players for the two Irish teams and Wales are selected from English clubs sides.  Does this have an impact? 

This could be relevant.

[er yir macaroon]

16 minutes ago, PASTA Mick said:

This is the tricky thing.  I don't think that anyone would want the Scottish league to be weakened.  The ideal situation would be that the standard improves but it's very hard to see how that would happen without any serious outside investment.  I do wonder why we haven't seen any mega-rich people come in for a club like Aberdeen, Hearts or Hibs.  It wouldn't take that much for them to be able to compete for trophies.

I think the Scottish league is being looked at a lot more closely now by teams across Europe.  The success of Robertson, van Dijk, Dembele, McGinn and (I guess) Gilmour is making teams realise that there are some good players in the league.  There is also a really high number of youth players being picked up.  It would suggest that the performance schools are working.  

I'm trying not to get too excited because Scotland have a habit of letting you down, but I think we could be at the start of a pretty exciting few years for Scotland.  The way our young players are being picked up is very similar to what happened to Belgium before all their players broke through.  I think in 5 years or so, we could be in a great place.  

This is certainly glass half full thinking. I’m of a similar view but, mainly due to genetics, I don’t think we’ll get close to the Belgian level. I think tournaments could be more common place for us, though.

On the Old Firm point, it’s a strange irony that most fans of every team in Scotland want them out, including Old Firm ones. I’m certain it would benefit the national team in the long run, as the remaining teams would realistically aspire to Europa league progress and the cash that goes with it.

[Diamond Scot]

The best thing that could happen for the national team is for the Old Firm to be allowed to join the English setup. 

[ceudmilefailte]

31 minutes ago, Diamond Scot said:

The best thing that could happen for the national team is for the Old Firm to be allowed to join the English setup. 

Wouldn't do any harm as far as I can see as long as the performance schools are kept in place. Probably see the old firm harvesting the schools. But I doubt if Gerrard and Lennon would be in their jobs very long to do the youngsters any harm.

On second thoughts you are just creating a couple of mid table EPL teams and extracting a lot of the money the OF generate for the rest of Scottish football. Celtic and Rangers would have a lot more money but I doubt if any of it would be spent in Scotland developing players. Better of letting Dundee UTD getting a full ground 2-4 times a season and hoping they can find a player or two.

[Diamond Scot]

I go the opposite way. Old Firm would fill their teams with foreign players. Especially initially. However over time any Scottish players bought or developed would need to be to a much higher standard. They would also be able to sell on players for way more than they can currently.

I think the rest of the league would get increased attendences from true competition. There could probably be a handful of league winners with in first 10/15 years.

 

[daviebee]

2 hours ago, Diamond Scot said:

I go the opposite way. Old Firm would fill their teams with foreign players. Especially initially. However over time any Scottish players bought or developed would need to be to a much higher standard. They would also be able to sell on players for way more than they can currently.

I think the rest of the league would get increased attendences from true competition. There could probably be a handful of league winners with in first 10/15 years.

 

And what would all the clubs do to try and become league winners? Buy foreigners and English journeymen most likely.