Coronavirus

[King Of Paisley]

6 hours ago, kumnio said:

Currently, theres been 247,107 deaths worldwide, with 28,446 in the UK. 

We have had 11.5% of all reported deaths, with 0.8% of the worlds population.

USA is rightly derided because of Trump, Republican Party, right wing nutters etc, but they have lost 68,268 people against our 28,446. With a population of 328.2 million against the UKs 66.6 million, our death rate is 2.1 what theirs is.

Scotland has had 1,571 deaths, with a population of 5.4 million. rUK has had 26,875 deaths, with a population of 61.2 million. So Scotlands death rate is still worse than Americas, but only 2/3rds of rUK.

Failings all round. Not that we can take the figures as gospel, or should expect a 'fair share' but our figures are shocking.

And one professor said that it would be a 'good result' if deaths in the U.K. were below 20,000........

[ParisInAKilt]

Think they’ll start lifting restrictions here over the next few weeks. 

[ThistleWhistle]

8 hours ago, kumnio said:

Currently, theres been 247,107 deaths worldwide, with 28,446 in the UK. 

We have had 11.5% of all reported deaths, with 0.8% of the worlds population.

USA is rightly derided because of Trump, Republican Party, right wing nutters etc, but they have lost 68,268 people against our 28,446. With a population of 328.2 million against the UKs 66.6 million, our death rate is 2.1 what theirs is.

Scotland has had 1,571 deaths, with a population of 5.4 million. rUK has had 26,875 deaths, with a population of 61.2 million. So Scotlands death rate is still worse than Americas, but only 2/3rds of rUK.

Failings all round. Not that we can take the figures as gospel, or should expect a 'fair share' but our figures are shocking.

And in pure 1984 fashion we will be absolutely bombarded in the run up to Friday with proclamations not to forget whilst simultaneously forgetting/ fudging the figures about care home deaths.   

[Ally Bongo]

[biffer]

Statistics on excess deaths in Europe - this website was set up sometime ago to give comparative  death rates in countries across Europe to help with monitoring of influenza and other potential diseases. 

https://www.euromomo.eu/graphs-and-maps/

What's stark is that the excess deaths in England in particular are substantially higher than the rest of the UK, and the rest of Europe, including Italy and Spain. 

This probably has multiple causes, so don't try and assign one single thing as a reason. That would be the thoughts of an idiot. 

[phart]

3 hours ago, biffer said:

Statistics on excess deaths in Europe - this website was set up sometime ago to give comparative  death rates in countries across Europe to help with monitoring of influenza and other potential diseases. 

https://www.euromomo.eu/graphs-and-maps/

What's stark is that the excess deaths in England in particular are substantially higher than the rest of the UK, and the rest of Europe, including Italy and Spain. 

This probably has multiple causes, so don't try and assign one single thing as a reason. That would be the thoughts of an idiot. 

I was reading a report or listening to a podcast (can't remember which) and they were mentioning it and saying it needs to be investigated to try and establish why it was happening as it was a significant amount.

[thplinth]

Looks like hydroxychloroquine can actually shield you from it as well as treat it. 

This is originally in Italian but using google translate...

Although there are still no Italian publications on the effectiveness of hydroxychloroquine as a "shielding" from the virus, among the directors of the infectious disease wards, the specialists, Primaries and general practitioners contacted during this research, many admitted - under a whisper - to use the drug as a "prophylaxis", that is, to prevent infection. Healthcare professionals who are in close contact with contagious patients take the drug in advance, precisely to decrease the probability of contracting the infection. For now, in support of this "prophylaxis" effect, there is a recent publication, involving 211 people. It was published on theInternational Journal of Antimicrobial Agents , the official body of the International Society of Antimicrobial Chemotherapy. Of 211 people exposed to Covid positive 19 and undergoing hydroxychloroquine prophylaxis, none were infected.

Finally, further confirmation of this hypothesis is the data collected in the register of the SIR (Italian rheumatology society). To assess the possible correlations between chronic patients and Covid19, SIR interrogated 1,200 rheumatologists throughout Italy to collect statistics on infections. Out of an audience of 65,000 chronic patients (Lupus and Rheumatoid Arthritis), who systematically take Plaquenil / hydroxychloroquine, only 20 patients tested positive for the virus. Nobody died, nobody is in intensive care, according to the data collected so far.

That is a big sample. 

https://www.iltempo.it/salute/2020/04/28/news/coronavirus-farmaci-efficaci-news-danni-cura-annalisa-chiusolo-artrite-terapia-idrossiclorochina-sars-cov2-1321227/

[Orraloon]

Needs more proper clinical studies.

It could be that the type of medic who is prepared to self medicate a prophylactic are also the type of people who pay attention to detail and are extra careful when anywhere near a COVID-19 patient?

It does look promising though.

[ThistleWhistle]

19 hours ago, biffer said:

Statistics on excess deaths in Europe - this website was set up sometime ago to give comparative  death rates in countries across Europe to help with monitoring of influenza and other potential diseases. 

https://www.euromomo.eu/graphs-and-maps/

What's stark is that the excess deaths in England in particular are substantially higher than the rest of the UK, and the rest of Europe, including Italy and Spain. 

This probably has multiple causes, so don't try and assign one single thing as a reason. That would be the thoughts of an idiot. 

Its interesting and absolutely frightening.  

Scotland's Z score for the over 65's is 17-18 and is slightly better than Wales.  Overall EU it would seem to put us about mid-table but the drop off of ours seems less  pronounced whereas Italy and Spain drop sharply.  

England's Z score for over 65's is 40(!), is the only one to drop then increase again which needs an explanation in itself, and Andrew Neil is even tweeting they're fudging the figures from care homes.  He's currently stating ONS have Corona deaths at 40,000+ in the UK already.  

There needs to be an investigation into what has happened in care homes after this because there would seem to be at least three general failures - it getting in to a controlled environment in the first place in so many homes; it being allowed to spread in that environment and; it looking like they're potentially not being taken to hospital when there is plenty capacity.  

[thplinth]

One thing I found interesting was someone questioning the normal flu deaths we get every year. These are often quoted to show that covid19 is being 'blown out of proportion' etc etc... Apparently these normal annual flu death numbers are just estimates and may not be accurate at all.

How many people have you ever heard of dying of regular flu? Has anyone ever known anyone who died of the regular flu?  

When reports about the novel coronavirus SARS-CoV-2 began circulating earlier this year and questions were being raised about how the illness it causes, COVID-19, compared to the flu, it occurred to me that, in four years of emergency medicine residency and over three and a half years as an attending physician, I had almost never seen anyone die of the flu. I could only remember one tragic pediatric case.

Based on the CDC numbers though, I should have seen many, many more. In 2018, over 46,000 Americans died from opioid overdoses. Over 36,500 died in traffic accidents. Nearly 40,000 died from gun violence. I see those deaths all the time. Was I alone in noticing this discrepancy?

I decided to call colleagues around the country who work in other emergency departments and in intensive care units to ask a simple question: how many patients could they remember dying from the flu? Most of the physicians I surveyed couldn’t remember a single one over their careers. Some said they recalled a few. All of them seemed to be having the same light bulb moment I had already experienced: For too long, we have blindly accepted a statistic that does not match our clinical experience.

The 25,000 to 69,000 numbers that Trump cited do not represent counted flu deaths per year; they are estimates that the CDC produces by multiplying the number of flu death counts reported by various coefficients produced through complicated algorithms. These coefficients are based on assumptions of how many cases, hospitalizations, and deaths they believe went unreported. In the last six flu seasons, the CDC’s reported number of actual confirmed flu deaths—that is, counting flu deaths the way we are currently counting deaths from the coronavirus—has ranged from 3,448 to 15,620, which far lower than the numbers commonly repeated by public officials and even public health experts.

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/comparing-covid-19-deaths-to-flu-deaths-is-like-comparing-apples-to-oranges/

[ThistleWhistle]

18 minutes ago, thplinth said:

One thing I found interesting was someone questioning the normal flu deaths we get every year. These are often quoted to show that covid19 is being 'blown out of proportion' etc etc... Apparently these normal annual flu death numbers are just estimates and may not be accurate at all.

How many people have you ever heard of dying of regular flu? Has anyone ever known anyone who died of the regular flu?  

When reports about the novel coronavirus SARS-CoV-2 began circulating earlier this year and questions were being raised about how the illness it causes, COVID-19, compared to the flu, it occurred to me that, in four years of emergency medicine residency and over three and a half years as an attending physician, I had almost never seen anyone die of the flu. I could only remember one tragic pediatric case.

Based on the CDC numbers though, I should have seen many, many more. In 2018, over 46,000 Americans died from opioid overdoses. Over 36,500 died in traffic accidents. Nearly 40,000 died from gun violence. I see those deaths all the time. Was I alone in noticing this discrepancy?

I decided to call colleagues around the country who work in other emergency departments and in intensive care units to ask a simple question: how many patients could they remember dying from the flu? Most of the physicians I surveyed couldn’t remember a single one over their careers. Some said they recalled a few. All of them seemed to be having the same light bulb moment I had already experienced: For too long, we have blindly accepted a statistic that does not match our clinical experience.

The 25,000 to 69,000 numbers that Trump cited do not represent counted flu deaths per year; they are estimates that the CDC produces by multiplying the number of flu death counts reported by various coefficients produced through complicated algorithms. These coefficients are based on assumptions of how many cases, hospitalizations, and deaths they believe went unreported. In the last six flu seasons, the CDC’s reported number of actual confirmed flu deaths—that is, counting flu deaths the way we are currently counting deaths from the coronavirus—has ranged from 3,448 to 15,620, which far lower than the numbers commonly repeated by public officials and even public health experts.

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/comparing-covid-19-deaths-to-flu-deaths-is-like-comparing-apples-to-oranges/

To do this, we have to compare counted deaths to counted deaths, not counted deaths to wildly inflated statistical estimates. If we compare, for instance, the number of people who died in the United States from COVID-19 in the second full week of April to the number of people who died from influenza during the worst week of the past seven flu seasons (as reported to the CDC), we find that the novel coronavirus killed between 9.5 and 44 times more people than seasonal flu. In other words, the coronavirus is not anything like the flu: It is much, much worse.

 

Hadn't appreciated it was up to 44 times more dangerous than flu!!  

[thplinth]

This was the guy I posted early on in the thread who turned out to be surprisingly close (especially considering so little was known at that point versus now). He is now questioning if the virus was lab modified. 

It apparently hinges on understanding the difference between a mutation (natural) and an insert (done by scientists). Basically he (or rather others he is quoting) are saying that this does not look likely to be a natural mutation and rather it is more likely to be an insert (done by a scientist for whatever possibly legitimate research reason). He does not say where it was done or how it got it out just that it does not look like a 'natural' mutation. He also points out that this type or research was pretty common.

It seems it is about judging the probabilities. So anyone who is saying this is for sure natural (or man made) at this point I would be very suspicious about.

The nitty-gritty biology is pretty hard to follow at times but you can still follow the gist of what he saying. No close relatives of this virus have a "Furin Cleaveage Site". This is the part that looks like it was inserted rather than the result of a natural mutation. It also seems to be the part that made this particular virus deadly as it gave the virus the ability to break into the cell it attached itself to (that is the cleaving part).

 

[thplinth]

One thing you can be absolutely sure of irrespective of whether this crisis was naturally occurring or man made in a laboratory is that they will not 'let it go to waste'.

[ThistleWhistle]

5 minutes ago, thplinth said:

One thing you can be absolutely sure of irrespective of whether this crisis was naturally occurring or man made in a laboratory is that they will not 'let it go to waste'.

A virus that relatively efficiently takes out the old, fat and vulnerable - one way of sorting out welfare state / aging population.   

[Ally Bongo]

The latest meltdown from the Union at any cost brigade is that the Scottish Government may introduce it's own Covid app 

Jack, Carlaw. Rees-Mogg and Jack McConnell pishing their knickers about it - along with their media friends

[Orraloon]

4 hours ago, ThistleWhistle said:

A virus that relatively efficiently takes out the old, fat and vulnerable - one way of sorting out welfare state / aging population.   

Don't forget the BAMEs. Could be a whiteman - yellowman collaboration?

 

[King Of Paisley]

3 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

The latest meltdown from the Union at any cost brigade is that the Scottish Government may introduce it's own Covid app 

Jack, Carlaw. Rees-Mogg and Jack McConnell pishing their knickers about it - along with their media friends

Don't know who is the more loathsome out of that quartet.

The 3 Tory cunts would be better at looking closer to home at their party's shocking handling of this crisis than indulging in yet another bout of SNPbaddery 

[exile]

21 minutes ago, King Of Paisley said:

Don't know who is the more loathsome out of that quartet.

The 3 Tory cunts would be better at looking closer to home at their party's shocking handling of this crisis than indulging in yet another bout of SNPbaddery 

Hey, what about Gove?  worth a shout in the loathsome stakes?

Edited May 5, 2020 by exile

[exile]

UK coronavirus death toll rises above 32,000 to highest in Europe

and 2nd highest in the world. Surely the Government and patriotic media can't hide that?

(Raab thinks it's cos we've got better statistics. What a thought. British death statistics, best in Europe!)

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/may/05/uk-coronavirus-death-toll-rises-above-32000-to-highest-in-europe

 

UK behind most European states in tackling coronavirus, says EU agency

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/may/04/uk-behind-most-european-states-in-tackling-coronavirus-says-agency

Edited May 5, 2020 by exile

[Lairdyfaeinverclyde]

Watched NS briefing today and some dick from ITV Borders (If it's the same guy) is always trying to stir shite. He asked NS if Scotland would follow England in relaxing the lockdown as advised by Mr Jack (wanker). Fair play to her she wouldn't bite and told the reporter that she wouldn't get in to party politics and would do what was best for Scotland with the advice she receives from experts. Quite rightly so. 

[King Of Paisley]

8 minutes ago, exile said:

Hey, what about Gove?  worth a shout in the loathsome stakes?

He wasn't in that list but aye your right. A slimy wanker. A face you'd never tire of punching 

[Lairdyfaeinverclyde]

Wanted for dereliction of duties and for being the biggest cunts in the history (maybe/probably) of the UK.

https://www.gov.uk/government/ministers

[Redz]

25 minutes ago, King Of Paisley said:

He wasn't in that list but aye your right. A slimy wanker. A face you'd never tire of punching 

An embarrassment to Aberdeen

There's something about his early life, deep rooted or otherwise, that appears to make him resent Scotland, and all things Scottish

That said, there's quite a lot self servient types in the City / Shire that, sadly, are about to get their arses handed to them

He wont give a f u c k though.....

 

[Lairdyfaeinverclyde]

I wonder if he will get the same treatment as Catherine Calderwood?

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/5565300/coronavirus-scientist-neil-ferguson-resigns-breaking-lockdown-rules/

 

 

[macy37]

I was laughed at when I said early in this shit storm that Boris has a strategy to get rid of folk to ease the burden on the country. He’s played a blinder all the while he’s got the press behind him and a huge chunk of the UK. His fake illness has been a magnificent bit of the whole pantomime.