Coronavirus

[ParisInAKilt]

7 hours ago, Dave78 said:

My missus is a nurse manager in the A+E department of our local hospital in Dublin. She's been working nightshift since Monday.

Every day i get an update from her, but talking to her tonight was quite sobering. Said she can see the fear in her colleagues faces. They've already had to make some heartbreaking 'do not resuscitate' decisions that would have otherwise been straightforward if not for the crisis.

Said staff morale is on the floor, and some of her colleagues will need counselling when all this is over. 

That’s awful. Fair play to everyone who can do that style of nursing.

[Grumpyauldgit]

38 minutes ago, EddardStark said:

They should be reported to licencing authorities. I doubt we have the  police resources to raid the establishments. I don't think it will be long before we see the army on the streets. 

You can bet your erse the local LSO, will have a list of places that have broken the ban, and I can see their licensees being revoked with immediate effect.

As for the army on the streets, speaking as an ex squaddie, the Army will only go on the streets, once the virus starts to have a major effect on the emergency services. The government will need somebody to replace all the doctor's, nurses, police and firemen that go down with it, so the obvious choice will be the army.

The army medical core are all doctors, every squaddie at some time or another has done first aid/combat medic courses,(some very good, some not so good, example could I set a broken leg yep, could I hook up a IV yep, could I run an ICU, no chance you leave that to the professionals) and could help (but never in a million years replace) nurses.

As for fire fighting, yet again most squaddies are trained in it to varying degree's, I could put out a chip fan fire, and get your cat out of a tree without the use of a fire arm, but for running into burning buildings and cutting people out of cars, that gets left to the people who know best.

When it comes to helping the Police, this is where the army really will be useful, if needed.

Every squaddie is trained in crowd control, and when we where out on patrol in N Ireland, most of the time, we acted as the local police force, and from what I can gather from pals who severed in Afghanistan and Iraq, they did the same there.

I really doubt, that any squaddies taking over from the regular police would be armed (Those taking over from armed police would be), so the chances of PC Bloggs being replaced by John J Rambo, are in my opinion very slim, at best they will get a riot control stick(Pick axe handle), and told to behave themselves.

You might even see them out driving tankers or clearing the bins, if things really get bad (Anybody remember the Glasgow bin strike of 75, or the tanker strikes in the late 70's).

The real trouble will be the reaction and panic of people, once the army are deployed, as a many people will over react, and think we have declared martial law, or staged some sort of coup (some of them even live on this board), as opposed to the reality of the situation, which is, the army going in to help and back up the emergency services.

[ThistleWhistle]

https://mobile.twitter.com/gordonmaloney/status/1241462684144537601

 

Landlord evicting a paramedic because he'll probably get Corona.  

[Texas Pete]

8 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

From FB

Glasgow already seeing the effects - probably why Nicola has been as sombre the last 24 hours

 

This is why Facebook should be banned. 

There have been 110 confirmed cases in Glasgow. A lot of these people will already have been discharged from hospital so I doubt this is real. Don’t get me wrong, things are going to get bad but we’re not quite there yet. 

A “quote” from an unnamed source is about as much use as a cock flavoured lollipop. 

[Texas Pete]

15 minutes ago, ThistleWhistle said:

https://mobile.twitter.com/gordonmaloney/status/1241462684144537601

 

Landlord evicting a paramedic because he'll probably get Corona.  

I wouldn’t believe anything I read on Twitter. This is probably fake. 

[Terry Munro]

18 minutes ago, ThistleWhistle said:

https://mobile.twitter.com/gordonmaloney/status/1241462684144537601

 

Landlord evicting a paramedic because he'll probably get Corona.  

Mon to fuck man 

[ThistleWhistle]

36 minutes ago, Texas Pete said:

I wouldn’t believe anything I read on Twitter. This is probably fake. 

Its elaborate if it is because they accept the offer of a room further down the thread. 

[Texas Pete]

2 minutes ago, ThistleWhistle said:

Its elaborate if it is because they accept the offer of a room further down the thread. 

It’s horrific if it is true. 

I’ve seen too much attention seeking bollocks on Twitter to believe anything on it. 

[bonzo]

3 hours ago, vanderark14 said:

A local pub in my home town defied the orders to close too. People who.messaged the pub were told to fuck off. These types of utter cretins are what will cause martial law.

I read an article yesterday about York, the streets were empty but 1000s of people had pissed off to Bridlington for the day The lockdown is coming, tomorrow? Tuesday?

[ThistleWhistle]

 

[Ally Bongo]

1 hour ago, Texas Pete said:

This is why Facebook should be banned. 

There have been 110 confirmed cases in Glasgow. A lot of these people will already have been discharged from hospital so I doubt this is real. Don’t get me wrong, things are going to get bad but we’re not quite there yet. 

A “quote” from an unnamed source is about as much use as a cock flavoured lollipop. 

NHS Scotland has only 58 ICU beds

It is entirely possible this is true

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/crisis-over-just-58-intensive-21694691

[Texas Pete]

10 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

NHS Scotland has only 58 ICU beds

It is entirely possible this is true

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/crisis-over-just-58-intensive-21694691

Anything is possible but most people that catch the virus, even those who require medical treatment, won’t require intensive care. Seems like an attention seeking, made up story to me.

Unless the media are deliberately holding things back to prevent panic, the NHS is not overwhelmed. Not yet anyway. 

[Huddersfield]

5 minutes ago, Texas Pete said:

Anything is possible but most people that catch the virus, even those who require medical treatment, won’t require intensive care. Seems like an attention seeking, made up story to me.

Unless the media are deliberately holding things back to prevent panic, the NHS is not overwhelmed. Not yet anyway. 

Again, I think it depends where you are & how far you want to extrapolate the current extremes to indicate what might become more commonplace. This from the Telegraph...

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/03/20/exhausted-nurses-overwhelmed-london-hospital-wore-bin-bags-protect/

 

[aaid]

23 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

NHS Scotland has only 58 ICU beds

It is entirely possible this is true

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/crisis-over-just-58-intensive-21694691

That's pish - before the start of this epidemic and the increase in beds, there were 275 ICU beds in Scotland, which isn't a huge number but somewhat higher than 58.

The source for this is an audit Scotland report which said that occupancy rates were about 84%.  

That Record report is quoting specifically level 3 ICU beds, of which there were 190 with an occupancy rate of 74%.

It's 58 unoccupied beds at a particular point in time, not a total of 58 beds.

It's irresponsible reporting from the Record as its giving the wrong impression.

[aaid]

14 minutes ago, Texas Pete said:

Anything is possible but most people that catch the virus, even those who require medical treatment, won’t require intensive care. Seems like an attention seeking, made up story to me.

Unless the media are deliberately holding things back to prevent panic, the NHS is not overwhelmed. Not yet anyway. 

That's exactly what it is - really irresponsible reporting

[ParisInAKilt]

Media once again proving how morally bankrupt they can be, all for getting a story out. 

Imagine thinking Scotland has 58 ICU beds and printing that. Mind boggling. 

[TDYER63]

22 minutes ago, aaid said:

That's pish - before the start of this epidemic and the increase in beds, there were 275 ICU beds in Scotland, which isn't a huge number but somewhat higher than 58.

The source for this is an audit Scotland report which said that occupancy rates were about 84%.  

That Record report is quoting specifically level 3 ICU beds, of which there were 190 with an occupancy rate of 74%.

It's 58 unoccupied beds at a particular point in time, not a total of 58 beds.

It's irresponsible reporting from the Record as its giving the wrong impression.

I thought that sounded a ridiculously  low number. My mum was in ICU in the RAH in Paisley a few years ago and it alone had about 6 beds .

She was in accident and emergency about 18 months ago and if I remember correctly it was in the middle of renovation as the hospital was adding  even more ICU beds. 

[aaid]

1 minute ago, TDYER63 said:

I thought that sounded a ridiculously  low number. My mum was in ICU in the RAH in Paisley a few years ago and it alone had about 6 beds .

She was in accident and emergency about 18 months ago and if I remember correctly it was in the middle of renovation as the hospital was adding  even more ICU beds. 

And people need to remember that in normal circumstances that's probably the right number of ICU beds that's needed.

[Texas Pete]

38 minutes ago, Huddersfield said:

Again, I think it depends where you are & how far you want to extrapolate the current extremes to indicate what might become more commonplace. This from the Telegraph...

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/03/20/exhausted-nurses-overwhelmed-london-hospital-wore-bin-bags-protect/

 

I should’ve specified that I meant NHS Scotland.

London has it far worse than the rest of the UK at the moment. I could believe the post was from a nurse in London, particularly with the use of tube instead of subway or underground. 

[ParisInAKilt]

3 minutes ago, aaid said:

And people need to remember that in normal circumstances that's probably the right number of ICU beds that's needed.

That’s it. 

My sister works in ICU over here and regularly staff are either asked to bank off or are sent to another ward to work because they have more staff than patients. 

[Mox]

Are we in anyway likely to gain an advantage at combating this as its peak comes in the warmer months?

[Ally Bongo]

1 minute ago, Mox said:

Are we in anyway likely to gain an advantage at combating this as its peak comes in the warmer months?

It's no exactly cauld in Spain

Nobody knows for sure

[Orraloon]

28 minutes ago, aaid said:

That's pish - before the start of this epidemic and the increase in beds, there were 275 ICU beds in Scotland, which isn't a huge number but somewhat higher than 58.

The source for this is an audit Scotland report which said that occupancy rates were about 84%.  

That Record report is quoting specifically level 3 ICU beds, of which there were 190 with an occupancy rate of 74%.

It's 58 unoccupied beds at a particular point in time, not a total of 58 beds.

It's irresponsible reporting from the Record as its giving the wrong impression.

I'm guessing that Audit Scotland report is from last year?

About 3 weeks ago I was speaking to a retired  Health Protection Scotland manager  ( I think it is soon to be renamed Public health Scotland). He is a qualified Doctor and made sure he did enough clinical work every year, to keep him up to date. He was at a fairly senior level in a regional health board. He has been retired for about 3 years. 3 weeks ago he reckoned that NHS Scotland was already up to over 350 ICU beds. They have plans in place to get to about 800 by the time we reach peak epidemic. 

The problem then becomes not having enough qualified staff to run these beds. That is why they are asking retired nurses and doctors to come back to help out. Plenty of them will do it, because that is the type of people they are. He knew 3 weeks ago that he will be recalled.

The NHS has been planning for this for a while now even if the government haven't.

Will it be enough? Time will tell.

 

[aaid]

2 minutes ago, Orraloon said:

I'm guessing that Audit Scotland report is from last year?

About 3 weeks ago I was speaking to a retired  Health Protection Scotland manager  ( I think it is soon to be renamed Public health Scotland). He is a qualified Doctor and made sure he did enough clinical work every year, to keep him up to date. He was at a fairly senior level in a regional health board. He has been retired for about 3 years. 3 weeks ago he reckoned that NHS Scotland was already up to over 350 ICU beds. They have plans in place to get to about 800 by the time we reach peak epidemic. 

The problem then becomes not having enough qualified staff to run these beds. That is why they are asking retired nurses and doctors to come back to help out. Plenty of them will do it, because that is the type of people they are. He knew 3 weeks ago that he will be recalled.

The NHS has been planning for this for a while now even if the government haven't.

Will it be enough? Time will tell.

 

I assume so.  Not sure on the exact date but it was published earlier this year, no doubt based on data from 2019.

As you point out, having enough qualified staff is probably the bigger concern.  It's relatively straightforwards to add additional beds - although not something that can be done overnight - but you can't just magic up new trained and qualified doctors and nurses.

[phart]

2 hours ago, Texas Pete said:

I wouldn’t believe anything I read on Twitter. This is probably fake. 

I looked into it and found the original guys tweet, it seems to be genuine.

Incredulity isn't a good replacement for investigation/experimentation.