andyD Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 So with Robertson out, we're going to need another captain for the upcoming games. Am I right in thinking that Shinnie is the only one who's regularly been a club captain? I don't imagine it'll be him tho, as being the late call it's unlikely he'll even play. I honestly can't come up with a leader from the remaining players.. McGregror was captain against Kazakhstan right? Can't say I want that to happen again. Any ideas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csinclair Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 I'd go with McKenna though can see it probably being someone like Marshall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wee-toon-red Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 Naismith. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csinclair Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 Naismith is a good shout too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrelhumper Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 Just now, wee-toon-red said: Naismith. This. Like him or loathe him, he rarely lets us down. It's also be his 50th cap which is no mean feat given his serious injury record. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wee-toon-red Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Squirrelhumper said: This. Like him or loathe him, he rarely lets us down. It's also be his 50th cap which is no mean feat given his serious injury record. If we had five or six players with the commitment of Naismith - and the career he's had - we'd have far less need to worry about the attitudes of the regular call off crew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyD Posted November 12, 2019 Author Share Posted November 12, 2019 33 minutes ago, wee-toon-red said: Naismith. I'm just not sure what good it is to us to play Naismith. 33, barely kicked a ball all season. Wouldn't we be way better off giving more experience to McBurnie or Shankland? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanderark14 Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 53 minutes ago, andyD said: So with Robertson out, we're going to need another captain for the upcoming games. Am I right in thinking that Shinnie is the only one who's regularly been a club captain? I don't imagine it'll be him tho, as being the late call it's unlikely he'll even play. I honestly can't come up with a leader from the remaining players.. McGregror was captain against Kazakhstan right? Can't say I want that to happen again. Any ideas? Mckenna or Mcginn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceudmilefailte Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 Any ones birthday coming up? Also as Andy says playing Naismith should be a non starter. In fact I'll go as far to say if he does start I'll never go to a another Scotland game until we have a new manager. Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaid Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 49 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said: This. Like him or loathe him, he rarely lets us down. It's also be his 50th cap which is no mean feat given his serious injury record. If he's going to start then he should be captain for no other reason than its his 50th cap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BucksburnDandy Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 Naismith should probably captain the side because he is the biggest leader in the squad. You only need to watch him play at Hearts to realise that while Berra has the armband, Naismith is the real captain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wee-toon-red Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 4 hours ago, andyD said: I'm just not sure what good it is to us to play Naismith. 33, barely kicked a ball all season. Wouldn't we be way better off giving more experience to McBurnie or Shankland? We’ve got an opportunity to qualify for a major tournament taking place in a matter of months. We play the players who are most likely to get us the results we need until then and imo Naismith falls squarely into that category. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dark_Knight Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 Naismith shouldn't even be in the squad. We haven't held on to a striker so tightly since McCoist. McGinn. Long term? Robertson with McTominay as vice captain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morrisandmoo Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019  33 minutes ago, wee-toon-red said: We’ve got an opportunity to qualify for a major tournament taking place in a matter of months. We play the players who are most likely to get us the results we need until then and imo Naismith falls squarely into that category. Naismith is the best forward option we have. i expect that will still be the case if we miraculously make the euros. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotsdeutsch Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 Naismith every day of the week and twice on Sunday even with a full strength squad. I’d like to see him & griff up front but that’s probably a pipe dream. We definitely need griff back playing regularly ASAP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 3 hours ago, The_Dark_Knight said: Naismith shouldn't even be in the squad. We haven't held on to a striker so tightly since McCoist. Kenny Miller was still playing for us at 33. Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrelhumper Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 14 hours ago, andyD said: I'm just not sure what good it is to us to play Naismith. 33, barely kicked a ball all season. Wouldn't we be way better off giving more experience to McBurnie or Shankland? We need to finish 3rd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrelhumper Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 14 hours ago, ceudmilefailte said: Any ones birthday coming up? Also as Andy says playing Naismith should be a non starter. In fact I'll go as far to say if he does start I'll never go to a another Scotland game until we have a new manager. Â Settle. It's two games we need to win to get 3rd and avoid slipping into another pot. I'd rather we played somebody who has proven he's good enough. No reason you can't play a 33 year old striker if he's better than what we've got. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrelhumper Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 15 hours ago, wee-toon-red said: If we had five or six players with the commitment of Naismith - and the career he's had - we'd have far less need to worry about the attitudes of the regular call off crew. It's telling that two of the players with the biggest amount of caps this generation are two who suffered most with injuries (Naismith and Fletcher) yet both often played through pain barrier to represent their country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyD Posted November 13, 2019 Author Share Posted November 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Squirrelhumper said: Settle. It's two games we need to win to get 3rd and avoid slipping into another pot. I'd rather we played somebody who has proven he's good enough. No reason you can't play a 33 year old striker if he's better than what we've got. "Proved he's good enough"... The reality is we've failed repeatedly all the years of Naismith's career. His 9 in 49 for Scotland is far from impressive. By no measure was he a reliable scorer at international level during his best years. He's made just 5 appearances this season and only completed more than 45 minutes once. Naismith's scored 2 goals this season and 10 league goals last season. None of this is evidence of a player who deserves a call up let alone a starting spot. In the time it's taken Naismith to score his last dozen league goals.. Shankland has scored 31 (and 11 more in the cup) McBurnie's scored 23. Johnny Russell's scored 23. "It'd be nice for him to get 50" is not a reason for playing a player in a match that we're trying to win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanderark14 Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 35 minutes ago, andyD said: "Proved he's good enough"... The reality is we've failed repeatedly all the years of Naismith's career. His 9 in 49 for Scotland is far from impressive. By no measure was he a reliable scorer at international level during his best years. He's made just 5 appearances this season and only completed more than 45 minutes once. Naismith's scored 2 goals this season and 10 league goals last season. None of this is evidence of a player who deserves a call up let alone a starting spot. In the time it's taken Naismith to score his last dozen league goals.. Shankland has scored 31 (and 11 more in the cup) McBurnie's scored 23. Johnny Russell's scored 23. "It'd be nice for him to get 50" is not a reason for playing a player in a match that we're trying to win. I agree with you to a certain extent but want to add to what you have said Shankland has scored 31 (and 11 more in the cup) - done in a pub league McBurnie's scored 23. - but at this time he's hardly getting game time and I think he has scored once for his new team Johnny Russell's scored 23. - decent shout but I don't know much about the standard of the MLS, I doubt its worse than our own league so Russell is good shout. Basically we don;t have much options upfront, each of them brings something different to the table but none of them are perfect. Perhaps we should for the classic Levein 4-6-0................................... Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wee-toon-red Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 We've got a relatively young/inexperienced squad so if the choice is McBurnie, Shankland or Naismith then Naismith's experience, determination and will to win gets him in the team for me every time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyD Posted November 13, 2019 Author Share Posted November 13, 2019 37 minutes ago, vanderark14 said: I agree with you to a certain extent but want to add to what you have said Shankland has scored 31 (and 11 more in the cup) - done in a pub league McBurnie's scored 23. - but at this time he's hardly getting game time and I think he has scored once for his new team Johnny Russell's scored 23. - decent shout but I don't know much about the standard of the MLS, I doubt its worse than our own league so Russell is good shout. Basically we don;t have much options upfront, each of them brings something different to the table but none of them are perfect. Perhaps we should for the classic Levein 4-6-0................................... Â Shankland - yeah, the level matters, but 42 goals in 15 months.. you're probably worth looking at. McBurnie - I'm not sure "he's not getting game time" is something that can be used to strengthen the case fo playing Naismith. I think we've got options, we just have to be a bit smarter about using them. Obviously Fletch and Griff being absent for whatever reason doesn't help the cause. But it is what it is, Fletch is 32, so I guess we should let him go anyway. Jordan Rhodes also can't even make the bench at Sheffield Wednesday right now, which I find bizarre given they're playing 2 up top. But oh well.. For me Shankland's the obvious option. Clearly knows where the goal is, looked decent in his start and sub appearance, good age, full of confidence and should now be over any 'first game jitters' he might have had. Burke's still an option to me. His pace and physique are really good assets, Clarke just needs to realise that he's not a target man. Play the ball on the floor, put balls in behind and let him run. Hoofing it up to his head is not the way to use him. McBurnie is kinda in the same boat as Burke. He's not a target man despite being 6'3". He's much better on the deck, but we haven't played with these players enough to actually work that out as a team. They get thrown in for a game or two then shuffled out to the bench then back in later for a game or two. It's silly. Chris Martin is suggesting he might have remembered where the goal is, scoring in three of his 10 games for Derby recently, along with 3 assists. Not a popular option for sure, but fit and able and scoring at a decent level. Fraser Hornby is out on loan in Belgium, playing grown up football for the first time. 4 goals in 9 games so far suggests he might be worth paying attention to as well. So there are guys around who can do the job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyD Posted November 13, 2019 Author Share Posted November 13, 2019 2 minutes ago, wee-toon-red said: We've got a relatively young/inexperienced squad so if the choice is McBurnie, Shankland or Naismith then Naismith's experience, determination and will to win gets him in the team for me every time. I'm sort of feeling like the 'young squad' thing is a bit of a myth. McGinn and McGregor are 25 and 26. They're coming to their peak, not raw 20 year olds. Prior to Porteous being added the youngest squad member was Oli Burke at 22, and he's 9 caps deep already. Christie's 24, so is Shankland. Forrest, Palmer and Gallagher are all 28. I suppose the weirdest thing about the squad compared to most other nations is.. there's no one 21 or under (pre-porteous) and there's no one 30+ other than the keepers. It's a very 'in the middle' squad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrelhumper Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 2 hours ago, andyD said: "Proved he's good enough"... The reality is we've failed repeatedly all the years of Naismith's career. His 9 in 49 for Scotland is far from impressive. By no measure was he a reliable scorer at international level during his best years. He's made just 5 appearances this season and only completed more than 45 minutes once. Naismith's scored 2 goals this season and 10 league goals last season. None of this is evidence of a player who deserves a call up let alone a starting spot. In the time it's taken Naismith to score his last dozen league goals.. Shankland has scored 31 (and 11 more in the cup) McBurnie's scored 23. Johnny Russell's scored 23. "It'd be nice for him to get 50" is not a reason for playing a player in a match that we're trying to win. He's shown more in a Scotland shirt more than those 3 combined. If Shankland ever gets 9 Scotland goals i'll be amazed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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