dohadeer Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 8 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said: I am not basing my opinion just on his Scotland senior performances. I watched a fair few of his performances when he got on for Swansea in the epl. I also watched him for Scotland u21s as well. I am not suggesting that he never ever controlled a ball but I genuinely was left wondering how a guy whos touch was so poor 60 percent of the time could possibly get to the level he has. Now fair enough I actually have been impressed with some of his goals for Barnsley and Swansea when he was in the championship so I do believe there is maybe a player in there somewhere and we should persevere with him by giving some more opportunities in the future but his performances for Scotland have been that poor that he wouldn't be a starter if I was picking the side for this upcoming match/matches. I guess the main thing we disagree on is wether he should start in our play off games. I respect your opinion that you think mcburnie should start but I personally would much rather Naismith or griffiths. I think it’s ridiculous to suggest a Hearts player be picked ahead of a Sheffield United player. You are showing a major lack of understanding in the difference of levels that those two teams’ players play at. Hearts players and Sheffield United players are not in any way comparable/interchangeable. A small sample size of Scotland performances doesn’t change that, anyone can have bad games and good games. Can you explain where you got the 60 per cent figure from please, that you quoted for how often McBurnie’s ‘touch was so poor.’ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 27 minutes ago, vanderark14 said: I agree, griffiths being back will push him to the top of the queue. It might be harsh on naismith but if i had to pick one of those to put a chance away, id pick griffiths. He needs proper support though, christie, mcginn , armstrong and fraser behind him would be perfect Fletcher would divide opinion, personally.i dont think he should be considered. It would be great if he was on form and committed to scotland but he clearlynisnt committed. I agree it would be a bit harsh on Naismith but Griffiths is scoring and playing in a team at the top of the league and he isn't. Griffiths did get subbed early in the second half yesterday though so who knows if he will still be playing come the playoff. A lot can happen in 5 weeks. Fletcher is a tough one. I agree with you in that he has had his chance and has shown zero commitment to Scotland recently and shouldn't be considered. If Clarke selects him and he bags a couple of goals and/or assists against Israel and Serbia/Norway then I doubt people will care too much about what has gone before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ElChris04 Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 (edited) Griffiths is the obvious choice without a doubt. Out and out goal scorer and our most prolific, Took of yesterday Early but before doing so was crucial to the build up to the first goal. Aye there’s 5 weeks left to go but as it stands Griff is first choice for me. I’d also quote Shankland and hope he gets called up again. Despite his level I’ve watched him play which he’s clearly too good for he gives me confidence up front with his clinical ability and for me is the striker like Griffiths that fits Clarke’s style of play in the 4-3-3. Edited February 17, 2020 by ElChris04 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 On 2/16/2020 at 1:01 PM, dohadeer said: I’ll be honest and say that I don’t remember which players started which particular games for us, let alone how well they played in those games. 29 minutes ago, dohadeer said: I think it’s ridiculous to suggest a Hearts player be picked ahead of a Sheffield United player. You are showing a major lack of understanding in the difference of levels that those two teams’ players play at. Hearts players and Sheffield United players are not in any way comparable/interchangeable. A small sample size of Scotland performances doesn’t change that, anyone can have bad games and good games. Can you explain where you got the 60 per cent figure from please, that you quoted for how often McBurnie’s ‘touch was so poor.’ What's ridiculous is you clearly don't watch Scotland games yet you have opinion on who should start. Clarke will pick his first team based on who has played well under him, that's why he went with Naismith over mcburnie because mcburnie has been terrible in his games. You are sounding very arrogant in suggesting I don't understand the difference in levels of Sheffield United and hearts. I fully understand that Sheffield United are much better side than hearts but it doesn't mean that mcburnie is a good player or that he will do better than Naismith for Scotland. The last two games showed this. Also I have said many times that I am not basing my opinion on just his Scotland appearances. The 60 percent isnt very accurate tbf but if I watch a player and he can't control a ball most of the time and his touch is poor more times than it's good then I will gather an opinion that he's a poor player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohadeer Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 6 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said: What's ridiculous is you clearly don't watch Scotland games yet you have opinion on who should start. Clarke will pick his first team based on who has played well under him, that's why he went with Naismith over mcburnie because mcburnie has been terrible in his games. You are sounding very arrogant in suggesting I don't understand the difference in levels of Sheffield United and hearts. I fully understand that Sheffield United are much better side than hearts but it doesn't mean that mcburnie is a good player or that he will do better than Naismith for Scotland. The last two games showed this. Also I have said many times that I am not basing my opinion on just his Scotland appearances. The 60 percent isnt very accurate tbf but if I watch a player and he can't control a ball most of the time and his touch is poor more times than it's good then I will gather an opinion that he's a poor player. Why would Sheffield United be playing a ‘poor player’ in 24 of their 26 games in the English Premiership? That’s the bit that isn’t making sense for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnish Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 Maybe just because they have invested all that money in him and have no one better to use as an alternative? Doesn't mean he's been any good. He's only scored in one in six of those games for instance. Mcgoldrick who never scores at all has actually been picked ahead of him most of the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohadeer Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 25 minutes ago, mcnish said: Maybe just because they have invested all that money in him and have no one better to use as an alternative? Doesn't mean he's been any good. He's only scored in one in six of those games for instance. Mcgoldrick who never scores at all has actually been picked ahead of him most of the season. They wouldn’t be sitting sixth in the league, and he wouldn’t have 24 appearances if he was a poor player. They’re not a good enough team to carry passengers. Every single one of their players must be having a good/great season for them to be sat where they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohadeer Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 52 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said: What's ridiculous is you clearly don't watch Scotland games yet you have opinion on who should start. Clarke will pick his first team based on who has played well under him, that's why he went with Naismith over mcburnie because mcburnie has been terrible in his games. You are sounding very arrogant in suggesting I don't understand the difference in levels of Sheffield United and hearts. I fully understand that Sheffield United are much better side than hearts but it doesn't mean that mcburnie is a good player or that he will do better than Naismith for Scotland. The last two games showed this. Also I have said many times that I am not basing my opinion on just his Scotland appearances. The 60 percent isnt very accurate tbf but if I watch a player and he can't control a ball most of the time and his touch is poor more times than it's good then I will gather an opinion that he's a poor player. A quick check now, and it looks we started 11 players as attackers during our qualification group: Burke 3 times, McBurnie 2, Naismith 2, Brophy (?!), Paterson (not a striker), Phillips (not a striker), and Shankland (?!) How on Earth can you make a judgement on players based on three matches or less?! That’s crazy. That’s why you’d have to go further and judge them on their club form where you have 20-30 matches to analyse. Anyone can have three bad games over the course of a season. That’s just simple variance. I can’t believe people would judge or suggest that Clarke judges on the basis of two matches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfingers Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 2 minutes ago, dohadeer said: A quick check now, and it looks we started 11 players as attackers during our qualification group: Burke 3 times, McBurnie 2, Naismith 2, Brophy (?!), Paterson (not a striker), Phillips (not a striker), and Shankland (?!) How on Earth can you make a judgement on players based on three matches or less?! That’s crazy. That’s why you’d have to go further and judge them on their club form where you have 20-30 matches to analyse. Anyone can have three bad games over the course of a season. That’s just simple variance. I can’t believe people would judge or suggest that Clarke judges on the basis of two matches. He's already been quoted saying he doesn't forget the players who have done well for him in previous qualifiers. If players have fitted well into his system and way of thinking in 2 or 3 matches then that could be enough for them to start in the play offs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohadeer Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 (edited) 9 minutes ago, bigfingers said: He's already been quoted saying he doesn't forget the players who have done well for him in previous qualifiers. If players have fitted well into his system and way of thinking in 2 or 3 matches then that could be enough for them to start in the play offs. Fair enough, if that’s his criteria. That seems a ridiculously small sample of matches to be judging people on. To me, if we’re going to go into international matches with a Hearts player (bottom of the Scottish Premiership) up front, we might as well admit defeat before we’ve started. Shankland’s call-up was a bit of a frightening watershed moment for me, as I didn’t think we were THAT bad - I still don’t - to be needing to be selecting players from the Scottish Championship. I think it’s crazy to select a Hearts player over a Sheffield United player, by basing the decision on two performances, against Cyprus and Kazakhstan. Edited February 17, 2020 by dohadeer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 21 minutes ago, dohadeer said: A quick check now, and it looks we started 11 players as attackers during our qualification group: Burke 3 times, McBurnie 2, Naismith 2, Brophy (?!), Paterson (not a striker), Phillips (not a striker), and Shankland (?!) How on Earth can you make a judgement on players based on three matches or less?! That’s crazy. That’s why you’d have to go further and judge them on their club form where you have 20-30 matches to analyse. Anyone can have three bad games over the course of a season. That’s just simple variance. I can’t believe people would judge or suggest that Clarke judges on the basis of two matches. Clarke will base his selection on both form for Scotland under him and club form. Mcburnie might of only started 2 games but he's had other appearances for Scotland of the bench. I am guessing he takes into consideration both club form and form for Scotland. Mcburnie has scored 4 goals this season and has been terrible every time he's played for Scotland. This is why mcburnie didn't start our last two games and probably won't start in our play off games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orraloon Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 2 hours ago, Texas Pete said: I agree it would be a bit harsh on Naismith but Griffiths is scoring and playing in a team at the top of the league and he isn't. Griffiths did get subbed early in the second half yesterday though so who knows if he will still be playing come the playoff. A lot can happen in 5 weeks. Fletcher is a tough one. I agree with you in that he has had his chance and has shown zero commitment to Scotland recently and shouldn't be considered. If Clarke selects him and he bags a couple of goals and/or assists against Israel and Serbia/Norway then I doubt people will care too much about what has gone before. It's not Gibralter we are playing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohadeer Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 1 hour ago, mccaughey85 said: Clarke will base his selection on both form for Scotland under him and club form. Mcburnie might of only started 2 games but he's had other appearances for Scotland of the bench. I am guessing he takes into consideration both club form and form for Scotland. Mcburnie has scored 4 goals this season and has been terrible every time he's played for Scotland. This is why mcburnie didn't start our last two games and probably won't start in our play off games. ‘McBurnie.... has been terrible every time he’s played for Scotland.’ I. Don’t. Believe. You. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumnio Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 1 minute ago, dohadeer said: ‘McBurnie.... has been terrible every time he’s played for Scotland.’ I. Don’t. Believe. You. You. Would. Be. Very. Wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Ramy 1314 Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 Serious question, I know this is been brought up, but we play Israel in 5 weeks. Who would you want, on current form cuz it's getting near time. Naisy, Griff, McBurnie, Shankland. I am going out on a limb here thinking Clarke will have a loan striker, dont agree, as we have nothing to lose, we are at home, we have beaten them already.. Anyhoo, I'm no expert, but its comin sooner than later, and it's time tae put up, barring injuries.. Alba Gu Brath.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumnio Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 A loan striker? Can we get Ronaldo then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 58 minutes ago, Orraloon said: It's not Gibralter we are playing. Fair point. 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orraloon Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 16 minutes ago, kumnio said: A loan striker? Can we get Ronaldo then? Might get the older fat one for a one off game? He'd still be better than McBurnie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumnio Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 17 minutes ago, Orraloon said: Might get the older fat one for a one off game? He'd still be better than McBurnie. Id take him, what a player he was. And yep, probably still better than McBurnie, certainly quitter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceudmilefailte Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 41 minutes ago, dohadeer said: ‘McBurnie.... has been terrible every time he’s played for Scotland.’ I. Don’t. Believe. You. He's not been great but then he does't get to start against San Marino home or away, Cyprus home or away or Kazakhstan at home. These seem to be the games Clarke will be using as his bench mark for "never let us down" so we can look forward to the same old crap. It took Griffiths for ever to win over the Scotland support and Kenny miller even longer, we do love our scapegoats. Knives are already out for Forrest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumnio Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 4 minutes ago, ceudmilefailte said: Knives are already out for Forrest. Could really have picked a better example than the 28 year old with 34 caps. He's not a young up and coming kid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfingers Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 Seems to be a lot of emphasis here on the striker role but we do have midfielders and wide men who can score goals too. A striker who can link up the play is just as important as someone who can hit the back of the net. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 2 hours ago, dohadeer said: ‘McBurnie.... has been terrible every time he’s played for Scotland.’ I. Don’t. Believe. You. You don't have to believe me, start watching Scotland matches and you will be able to decide for yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohadeer Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 1 minute ago, mccaughey85 said: You don't have to believe me, start watching Scotland matches and you will be able to decide for yourself. I think you have made your mind up about him, and then whether consciously or subconsciously, you’ve turned him into a caricature of a bad footballer, in your head. ’He’s been terrible every game he’s played for Scotland.’ ’He was terrible every time I saw him play for the under-21s.’ ’Every club game I have seen him play, he’s been terrible.’ This all sounds so far removed from anything resembling reality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohadeer Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 8 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said: You don't have to believe me, start watching Scotland matches and you will be able to decide for yourself. I should add, I do watch Scotland matches, obviously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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