dohadeer Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 When we were last qualifying for major tournaments, in the mid to late 1990s, our whole team/squad was pretty much at English Premiership level. (Either playing in the English Premiership, for the Old Firm, in a top European league, or a few others who were very close to that level.) The standard was down from the 1970s and 1980s, when we had many players playing at an even higher level, but we were still at English Premiership level. Since then, our level of defenders and attackers has fallen away, (apart from usually being lopsidedly strong in one of the full back positions), yet our level of midfielders has managed to stay at English Premiership level. (Goalkeepers have stayed to a good level as well, but that’s much easier to maintain, given that you only need 3 of them in a squad.) For example, this season we had Stuart Armstrong, Tom Cairney, Ryan Fraser, James McArthur (retired from internationals?), Kevin McDonald, Scott McTominay, Callum Paterson, Matt Ritchie and Robert Snodgrass playing in the English Premier league (any midfielders I’ve forgotten?) and then plenty of Scottish midfielders at Celtic as well, who you would consider to be of a similar level. We are currently really strong at left back, (our two best players are left backs, frustratingly and bizarrely) but apart from that, our defence and attack are nowhere near as strong as the midfield. This has been the case consistently over the past 20 years. The two times when we were strong enough to qualify, but found ourselves in really tough groups - Euro 2008 Qualifiers and Euro 2016 Qualifiers - were also built on really strong midfields, carrying for the weaknesses elsewhere. Can anyone think of any particular reason why our midfield has remained so strong, and why we are able to produce so many good midfielders, while the standard of the defence and attack has fallen pretty drastically? That is clearly where our problems lie, the midfield has always been good enough to at least compete with the teams just outside the big guns of Europe, but our defence and attack leave us way behind most of the second-tier nations and therefore unable to compete for qualifying places. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third Lanark Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 In a similar vein England have always had strong defences and attacks yet lacked real quality in midfield - until now at least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohadeer Posted May 20, 2019 Author Share Posted May 20, 2019 13 minutes ago, Third Lanark said: In a similar vein England have always had strong defences and attacks yet lacked real quality in midfield - until now at least. I’m not sure what time period you’re referring to, but I don’t think that’s true at all?! The ‘golden generation’ had the likes of Beckham, Scholes, Gerrard and Lampard, for example, all playing at elite European level. England famously lacked a decent left-sided midfielder for a lot of years, (painfully for them Ryan Giggs played youth football for England, but selected Wales at senior level), but the rest of the midfield was really strong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orraloon Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 We don't have any top class midfield players. You are just deluding yourself if you think we do. McTominay might become one but he isn't one yet. We do have two top class left backs, neither of whom could be bothered to turn up for our most important game of the group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohadeer Posted May 20, 2019 Author Share Posted May 20, 2019 21 minutes ago, Orraloon said: We don't have any top class midfield players. You are just deluding yourself if you think we do. McTominay might become one but he isn't one yet. We do have two top class left backs, neither of whom could be bothered to turn up for our most important game of the group. I’m not saying they’re ‘top class.’ They are English Premier league and Old Firm level players though. Even if you take away the Cardiff and Fulham ones, who aren’t quite regular Premier League level, that still leaves more than a team’s worth of Premier League midfielders, two teams’ worth once you add in the Celtic midfielders. Obviously our midfield isn’t at the level of England, Croatia, Spain, or whoever else, that’s not what I’m claiming. I’m just wondering why the level of our midfield is always way ahead of the level of our defence and attack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orraloon Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 4 minutes ago, dohadeer said: I’m not saying they’re ‘top class.’ They are English Premier league and Old Firm level players though. Even if you take away the Cardiff and Fulham ones, who aren’t quite regular Premier League level, that still leaves more than a team’s worth of Premier League midfielders, two teams’ worth once you add in the Celtic midfielders. Obviously our midfield isn’t at the level of England, Croatia, Spain, or whoever else, that’s not what I’m claiming. I’m just wondering why the level of our midfield is always way ahead of the level of our defence and attack. I think we are equally shyte all over the park. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohadeer Posted May 20, 2019 Author Share Posted May 20, 2019 28 minutes ago, Orraloon said: I think we are equally shyte all over the park. The facts say otherwise though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonny78 Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Thumb is coming back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daviebee Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Probably cos most youngsters aren't getting a chance. Clubs would rather buy fifth-rate journeyman sh*te to keep goals out at one end or try and knock them in at the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceudmilefailte Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Matt Ritchie appears to be a left back now and a pretty good one at that. He has appeared to be the ultimate case of cant really be bothered with international football every time I saw him play for Scotland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
er yir macaroon Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 10 hours ago, ceudmilefailte said: Matt Ritchie appears to be a left back now and a pretty good one at that. He has appeared to be the ultimate case of cant really be bothered with international football every time I saw him play for Scotland. He must be the slowest full back in world football. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceudmilefailte Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 36 minutes ago, er yir macaroon said: He must be the slowest full back in world football. Not sure if that is his apathy to Scotland or if he actually slow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farcity Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 I smell Chripper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 On 5/20/2019 at 5:36 PM, Orraloon said: We don't have any top class midfield players. You are just deluding yourself if you think we do. McTominay might become one but he isn't one yet. We do have two top class left backs, neither of whom could be bothered to turn up for our most important game of the group. I’m not sure Tierney can be called top class yet. Great player, yes but is he a class above McGregor or Forrest? Or McTominay for that matter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrelhumper Posted May 22, 2019 Share Posted May 22, 2019 Brophy in squad for next month. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ElChris04 Posted May 22, 2019 Share Posted May 22, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Squirrelhumper said: Brophy in squad for next month. Brophy and Jack Harper in Mcnulty & McBurnie Out Guy’s had a cracking season with Malaga, plus he’s set to move to Getafe who had a remarkable season just there. Could be destined for big things. Definitely worth calling up over them who’ve done nothing in a jersey. Edited May 22, 2019 by ElChris04 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrniaboc Posted May 22, 2019 Share Posted May 22, 2019 11 minutes ago, ElChris04 said: Brophy and Jack Harper in Mcnulty & McBurnie Out Guy’s had a cracking season with Malaga, plus he’s set to move to Getafe who had a remarkable season just there. Could be destined for big things. Definitely worth calling up over them who’ve done nothing in a jersey. Would love to see Harper in the Squad. Not sure about McBurnie out though. He's only 22 and scored the same number of goals this season! 7 uneventful caps during a dark time for the national team shouldn't be what we judge him on. He deserves a lot more chances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ElChris04 Posted May 22, 2019 Share Posted May 22, 2019 3 hours ago, mrniaboc said: Would love to see Harper in the Squad. Not sure about McBurnie out though. He's only 22 and scored the same number of goals this season! 7 uneventful caps during a dark time for the national team shouldn't be what we judge him on. He deserves a lot more chances. That’s fair enough. There would be nothing wrong and giving him the odd chance since like you say and others would, we can’t judge under the Eck era. But still, there’s just something about him which I don’t rate. Maybe it was Mcleish’s tactics that affected him as a player. We’ll see as the time comes I guess if he gets called up under Clarke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted May 22, 2019 Share Posted May 22, 2019 (edited) While I agree with those who've said our midfield currently hasn't been up to much for a while, the OP has a point regarding strikers. Really concerning how poor our goalscoring options have been, for pretty much all of this century so far. Edited May 22, 2019 by Toepoke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceudmilefailte Posted May 22, 2019 Share Posted May 22, 2019 9 hours ago, ElChris04 said: Brophy and Jack Harper in Mcnulty & McBurnie Out Guy’s had a cracking season with Malaga, plus he’s set to move to Getafe who had a remarkable season just there. Could be destined for big things. Definitely worth calling up over them who’ve done nothing in a jersey. Has he had a cracking season for Malaga? How many times do you think he will play for Getafe next season? Is he even a striker? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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