Kazakhstan vs Scotland - Match Thread [21/03/2019] - Page 15 - TA specific - Tartan Army Message Board Jump to content

Kazakhstan vs Scotland - Match Thread [21/03/2019]


Clyde1998

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36 minutes ago, bazmidd said:

Spot on that post tbh. There has been so many doubts surrounding McLeish and I'm afraid that game there just proves he hasn't got what it takes. I am 100 percent confident a Steve Clarke or Davie Moyes would have at least had us working as a unit and looking like a team that knows and understands the roles and system they are supposed to be playing. Everything was a mess nothing was organised we had players floating about wherever they pleased there was no structure no identity no obvious tactics or way of playing. Defence was a shambles unorganised, midfield equally as bad, zero balance in midfield no protection for the defence and no support for the striker. Had no clue what to do faced with Kazakhstans five at the back. No leaders on the pitch or off it

I agree 100% with you've said.

McLeish seems happy to have a job instead of wanting to make a success of it. The one thing I am supportive of is the young squad, who can become a competent unit if they have a solid leader with good communication skills AND communicating the right stuff. I was prepared to judge McLeish on the competitive games which are now 5, and I think only the Albania game did we look confident. San Marino will get gubbed but I think Cuprus will be another Israel where we graciously  come away with a win. What pains me is this seems another group on paper that looks achievable and here we are expecting the worst.

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15 hours ago, ScotlandWintheWorldCup said:

I would like to see us having a go at 5-3-2 after seeing tonight where they have all the space in the world to attack and our attack is completely nulled against their team.

So I know you are advocating 3-5-2, but as I say I think the wingback midfielders get caught out, I would like three genuine centrebacks, that means no Tierney in back3.

What about something like this using the players around at the moment.

McGregor ( I cant help it, hes retired but without McLeish in there, he is the best keeper in Europe in my opinion)

Tierney     McKenna      Souttar      Bates      Robertson

          Forrest            McGregor           Armstrong

                      Griffiths                Fletcher(obviously effoff cause you listen to your two bit manager about playing for your eng club over Scotland)

                                                                           (But he is our only target man I think)

 

I like a big guy and a mobile poacher like rangers had with mccoist and hately or celtic had with Sutton and larsson

5-3-2 was played by some great teams like: Germany 90's, Croatia 98, Italy2000, Brazil 2002 and Holland at 2014...………….oh and Scotland under craig Brown in the 90's...…..Glory years??

I'd take that team in a heartbeat.

It's time for our fans to wake up and realize that our defenders haven't been able to play in a flat back four at international level since the days of McLeish and Miller, etc. Last night was filled with so much irony. People here say that 3-5-2 doesn't work and that 4-2-3-1 is our best system and that our defenders are strongest when they play with a four... yeah.. well... consider those theories thoroughly debunked.

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5 minutes ago, Chripper said:

I'd take that team in a heartbeat.

It's time for our fans to wake up and realize that our defenders haven't been able to play in a flat back four at international level since the days of McLeish and Miller, etc. Last night was filled with so much irony. People here say that 3-5-2 doesn't work and that 4-2-3-1 is our best system and that our defenders are strongest when they play with a four... yeah.. well... consider those theories thoroughly debunked.

We were pish with those two at centre half too.

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1 minute ago, Squirrelhumper said:

We were pish with those two at centre half too.

Point taken, we did qualify for things back then, though.

And what do we have now? McKenna, Souttar and Bates. Yesterday's result wasn't entirely down to Bates and McKenna, but if you watch it again you'll see how out of the depths they were. Adding an extra body would naturally fill a gap. Not saying that it's entirely down to the defence, it's not, the midfield has so many problems, too, and choosing a championship player and a player who is on the fringes of a poor Southampton team in front of a player who had a stormer against PSG a few weeks ago is absolute lunacy.

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1 minute ago, Chripper said:

Point taken, we did qualify for things back then, though.

And what do we have now? McKenna, Souttar and Bates. Yesterday's result wasn't entirely down to Bates and McKenna, but if you watch it again you'll see how out of the depths they were. Adding an extra body would naturally fill a gap. Not saying that it's entirely down to the defence, it's not, the midfield has so many problems, too, and choosing a championship player and a player who is on the fringes of a poor Southampton team in front of a player who had a stormer against PSG a few weeks ago is absolute lunacy.

Aye, let's go for 3 shite centre halves rather than 2.

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15 minutes ago, runningtings said:

I'd say we should have played more like a 4-5-1 in the opening stages to protect our shaky defence and grown into the game.

3 in the middle of defence and three in the middle of midfield is the way to go and the only way to protect our defence.

Kazakhstan did that and we never laid a glove on their defence.

Edited by Chripper
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12 minutes ago, runningtings said:

I'd say we should have played more like a 4-5-1 in the opening stages to protect our shaky defence and grown into the game.

Exactly what we should have done. There was no protection whatsoever for the defence. McGregor was the anchor man but McTominay should have been beside him. There were too many gaps for McGregor to plug on his own as McGinn and Armstrong were pushed on, and when they pushed on and McGregor covered the midfield completely lost its shape. We started the game far too high up the park. The gaps between defence midfield and attack were enormous and it was so so easy for the kazaks to pick a pass in between the lines. We should have sat a little deeper and more compact. Allow the kazaks a little bit of the ball but keep it compact and difficult to pick a pass, then snap into tackles when they ventured into our half and used our pace on the counter. We pressed them too high and left too many gaps behind. Plus the fact Shinnie had an absolute mare and either got his positioning all wrong or didn't track his runner for all 3 goals is just schoolboy stuff. 

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7 minutes ago, Chripper said:

3 in the middle of defence and three in the middle of midfield is the way to go and the only way to protect our defence.

Kazakhstan did that and we never laid a glove on their defence.

Well it isn't the only way to protect the defence at all and 3 in defence isn't the only way to go either. A variation of 433 could have worked if it was played differently as I explained in my last post. Unfortunately we decided to try and play like Liverpool or Barcelona and left a very inexperienced defence exposed. Added to some schoolboy defending which is what cost us. 

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1 minute ago, bazmidd said:

Well it isn't the only way to protect the defence at all and 3 in defence isn't the only way to go either. A variation of 433 could have worked if it was played differently as I explained in my last post. Unfortunately we decided to try and play like Liverpool or Barcelona and left a very inexperienced defence exposed. Added to some schoolboy defending which is what cost us. 

To be honest, I think it's the only way for our players to protect the defence. We're a limited team with players of limited abilities, there's no getting past that, so I say pack the defence and pack the midfield and make it difficult for teams to find space. 

That's the thing, when we play the way that we played yesterday there's far too much space between our players. When you look at Kazakhstan every single player had at least 2 plays 5 yards away from them, allowing them to make quick little passes... whereas we required Pirlo and Scholes to get the passing together.

They were compact, we were like unfitted jigsaw pieces... all over the place.

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2 hours ago, bigfathagiz said:

Players not playing because they have a sore mouth or worried they might get a burn on plastic aint helping the manager then again if the manager was a Bobby Williamson or Stevie Clark type of guy they probably would have played.

The trouble is in all the angst of yesterday some of the statements on here aren't really fair. Shinnie was dreadful but doing what was asked him. I understand that Robertson's dental treatment was emergency so "sore mouth" or organising a dental trip for the international break isn't fair (stated elsewhere). Fraser and Paterson were asked not to play by their managers because of previous injury problems (although I agree McLeish should have said bollocks to that) and I've read comments about Tierney bring a sick note when he's doubtful for Celtic's next game.

We were dreadful. McLeish doesn't seem to have a clue. Those players on that pitch let themselves down. Not disagreeing with that. But nobody can tell me that our players aren't very good.

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46 minutes ago, Chripper said:

3 in the middle of defence and three in the middle of midfield is the way to go and the only way to protect our defence.

Kazakhstan did that and we never laid a glove on their defence.

fuck me, I wish you'd told us this before...............

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Someone mentioned bringing Craig Brown back. Not a good idea, football has moved on and Craig hasn't, but by jings at the time he knew how to make the most of what we had. In the 96 and 98 qualification campaigns we were just so hard to beat, hard to even score against. It was boring to watch and shredded your nerves as we resisted waves of opposition attacks, but it worked. Started to unravel against Morocco, of course.

 

Is there an equivalent, today, attuned to the football of 2019? Wouldn't bother if he wasn't Scottish (though I would object if he were English, call me petty).

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1 minute ago, KirkieRobRoy said:

Someone mentioned bringing Craig Brown back. Not a good idea, football has moved on and Craig hasn't, but by jings at the time he knew how to make the most of what we had. In the 96 and 98 qualification campaigns we were just so hard to beat, hard to even score against. It was boring to watch and shredded your nerves as we resisted waves of opposition attacks, but it worked. Started to unravel against Morocco, of course.

 

Is there an equivalent, today, attuned to the football of 2019? Wouldn't bother if he wasn't Scottish (though I would object if he were English, call me petty).

Personally I loved the football we played with Craig Brown. 

I disagree, though, people say that "football has moved on". Has it? The only things that have moved on are nutrition, professionalism and sport science. Things off the pitch has changed, but what happens on the pitch has, and will  always be the same

I'd take Brown back in a heartbeat.

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Gordon Dalziel and Mark Wilson have ripped into Shinnie for his performance last night. Before anyone starts, I am not defending Shinnie. He himself admitted he had a nightmare but for two ex professionals to come out and point the finger at him is well out of order, I fully expect Kris Boyd to do the same soon enough.

Why aren't they questioning the commitment of those who dropped out? Why aren't these ex players questioning the more experienced player who were utter dung last night?

They need a scapegoat and I guess they've found one??

At least Shinnie showed for the ball and then took responsibility for the bad performance, where were the rest of last nights cowards?

Edited by vanderark14
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2 minutes ago, Chripper said:

A chip? The only thing that I have even close to my shoulder is you hovering over me.

Keep it up, though. ;)

wheres the face palm emoji? @mods Can we get one made to reply to everyone of chrippers posts?

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1 minute ago, vanderark14 said:

Gordon Dalziel and Mark Wilson have ripped into Shinnie for his performance last night. Before anyone starts, I am not defending Shinnie. He himself admitted he had a nightmare but for two ex professionals to come out and point the finger at him is well out of order, I fully expect Kris Boyd to do the same soon enough.

Why aren't they questioning the commitment of those who dropped out? Why aren't these ex players questioning the more experienced player who were utter dung last night?

They need a scapegoat and I guess they've found one

What an odd thing to say.

So, you're saying that ex footballers shouldn't criticize current football? Does it work in every walk of life? If a plumber does a bad job installing a shower, should his fellow plumbers deny the obvious and congratulate him on fine work?

Sounds like a secret society where everyone scratches their backs to get ahead.

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1 minute ago, vanderark14 said:

wheres the face palm emoji? @mods Can we get one made to reply to everyone of chrippers posts?

So, you want to us an emoji to replace actual, literal words?

Yikes.

If you describe the words you want to use I can help find them. :)

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