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The 2018-2019 Scottish Cup

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3 minutes ago, GRBear said:

Killie have actually appealed that elbow to the face. Now that's laughable.

Just following what your clubs done after every red they’ve received, it’s called abusing the system but then again  rfc have refused to take responsibility for anything they don’t like for years.

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3 minutes ago, GRBear said:

Hurting.

 

 

I’ll have a debate with you when I get a sensible reply, you obviously didn’t read my post or maybe it was a tad complicated for you🤯🤯🤯

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26 minutes ago, RenfrewBlue said:

I agree with the vast majority of this but the final sentence is wrong. The sectarian pish IS part of Scottish society. 

It exists in everyday life outside of football and although much has been done to eradicate it, the worst excesses have found a welcoming home in our football clubs. As long as they supply the money they appear to be tolerated. 

I don't think we can expect the clubs to change behaviours, it's a governmental responsibility

Any sectarian offence should be getting hammered by the police and clubs who have fans that misbehave should be paying for extra police at their games home and away, so that the offenders can be lifted at the time. 

Leaving it in the clubs hands is just not going to work. 

If only there was a law or something that meant people could be prosecuted for it.   James Kelly is very quiet this week and for that at least we can be grateful.

Anyway, you're spot on that it's a societal rather than solely football thing.   Football though is where it comes to the fore.

In the same way that saw seats damaged at Rugby Park at the weekend, football offers some people an opportunity to behave in anti-social behaviour with apparent impunity as they are part of a crowd.

So something specific needs to happen with regards to football.   I think strict liability backed up with sanctions that will actually hurt, such as closing parts of the ground, games played behind closed doors, points deductions and the like is the only way that you will get the clubs to do anything other than pay lip service.     

I saw a comment on Twitter yesterday, that if Steve Clarke wants to do anything about it, perhaps he needs to talk to his board as they opposed strict liability being brought in.

I'm not where this starts and ends but its some form of vicious circle that sees people go "I'm a protestant, I support Rangers, I love the Queen & the monarchy, etc. etc." and the same thing on the other side.   Too many people just go for the whole package without thinking for themselves.

I'm sure all of us - at least those who live or lived in West and Central Scotland, know people who have extreme sectarian views, probably wear Rangers or Celtic tops all the time but haven't been anywhere near a church or a chapel or Ibrox or Parkhead in years.

It'll take generations to eradicate completely and maybe you never will but while you might not change people's views, you can stop them airing those in a football environment.

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59 minutes ago, RenfrewBlue said:

I agree with the vast majority of this but the final sentence is wrong. The sectarian pish IS part of Scottish society. 

It exists in everyday life outside of football and although much has been done to eradicate it, the worst excesses have found a welcoming home in our football clubs. As long as they supply the money they appear to be tolerated. 

I don't think we can expect the clubs to change behaviours, it's a governmental responsibility. 

Any sectarian offence should be getting hammered by the police and clubs who have fans that misbehave should be paying for extra police at their games home and away, so that the offenders can be lifted at the time. 

Leaving it in the clubs hands is just not going to work. 

Family responsibility not the government 

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1 hour ago, GRBear said:

Killie have actually appealed that elbow to the face. Now that's laughable.

 

If thats a red card then our game is fucked !!

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Nothing will change. Fans will moan about the singing on forums and social media for a few days then it will all be forgotten about until they next play each other. It’s been that way for as long as I can remember and will be like that forevermore  

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1 hour ago, aaid said:

If only there was a law or something that meant people could be prosecuted for it.   James Kelly is very quiet this week and for that at least we can be grateful.

Anyway, you're spot on that it's a societal rather than solely football thing.   Football though is where it comes to the fore.

In the same way that saw seats damaged at Rugby Park at the weekend, football offers some people an opportunity to behave in anti-social behaviour with apparent impunity as they are part of a crowd.

So something specific needs to happen with regards to football.   I think strict liability backed up with sanctions that will actually hurt, such as closing parts of the ground, games played behind closed doors, points deductions and the like is the only way that you will get the clubs to do anything other than pay lip service.     

I saw a comment on Twitter yesterday, that if Steve Clarke wants to do anything about it, perhaps he needs to talk to his board as they opposed strict liability being brought in.

I'm not where this starts and ends but its some form of vicious circle that sees people go "I'm a protestant, I support Rangers, I love the Queen & the monarchy, etc. etc." and the same thing on the other side.   Too many people just go for the whole package without thinking for themselves.

I'm sure all of us - at least those who live or lived in West and Central Scotland, know people who have extreme sectarian views, probably wear Rangers or Celtic tops all the time but haven't been anywhere near a church or a chapel or Ibrox or Parkhead in years.

It'll take generations to eradicate completely and maybe you never will but while you might not change people's views, you can stop them airing those in a football environment.

Excellent post and far better put than I could have managed. Totally agree. 

I do think sectarianism has been on the decline in general society but since 2014 both it and other forms of bigotry have come back stronger. 

It's as if the potential for change brings the worst out in some folk. 

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1 hour ago, ParisInAKilt said:

Family responsibility not the government 

It's the older generations that are passing it down. I think most folk in the west of Scotland will know a family of bigots who essentially brain wash their children into their own bizarre mindset. 

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2 hours ago, aaid said:

If only there was a law or something that meant people could be prosecuted for it.   James Kelly is very quiet this week and for that at least we can be grateful.

Anyway, you're spot on that it's a societal rather than solely football thing.   Football though is where it comes to the fore.

In the same way that saw seats damaged at Rugby Park at the weekend, football offers some people an opportunity to behave in anti-social behaviour with apparent impunity as they are part of a crowd.

So something specific needs to happen with regards to football.   I think strict liability backed up with sanctions that will actually hurt, such as closing parts of the ground, games played behind closed doors, points deductions and the like is the only way that you will get the clubs to do anything other than pay lip service.     

I saw a comment on Twitter yesterday, that if Steve Clarke wants to do anything about it, perhaps he needs to talk to his board as they opposed strict liability being brought in.

I'm not where this starts and ends but its some form of vicious circle that sees people go "I'm a protestant, I support Rangers, I love the Queen & the monarchy, etc. etc." and the same thing on the other side.   Too many people just go for the whole package without thinking for themselves.

I'm sure all of us - at least those who live or lived in West and Central Scotland, know people who have extreme sectarian views, probably wear Rangers or Celtic tops all the time but haven't been anywhere near a church or a chapel or Ibrox or Parkhead in years.

It'll take generations to eradicate completely and maybe you never will but while you might not change people's views, you can stop them airing those in a football environment.

Agree with all that, cracking post 👍

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1 hour ago, RenfrewBlue said:

Excellent post and far better put than I could have managed. Totally agree. 

I do think sectarianism has been on the decline in general society but since 2014 both it and other forms of bigotry have come back stronger. 

It's as if the potential for change brings the worst out in some folk. 

It creeps into society but the biggest vehicles used for it are two big clubs and to a much much lesser extent hearts. The big two could and should be doing a lot more

Edited by vanderark14

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2 minutes ago, RDFH64 said:

Not on the wind up here, did you think the Mcgregor tackle on Ferguson was a red.

Not initially but after seeing another angle, yes. 

You can't show your studs like that in a challenge. 

Your opinion of this angle of last nights red? 

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6 minutes ago, RenfrewBlue said:

Not initially but after seeing another angle, yes. 

You can't show your studs like that in a challenge. 

Your opinion of this angle of last nights red? 

Only seen it on my phone so far but I’ll comment on it when I’ve seen it properly. Thanks for the reply 👍

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4 minutes ago, EddardStark said:

In hindsight, yes. 

👍 it’s refreshing to get honest replies to questions on here, thanks. 

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43 minutes ago, RDFH64 said:

Only seen it on my phone so far but I’ll comment on it when I’ve seen it properly. Thanks for the reply 👍

No problem. I had only seen the highlights on my phone too but just watched the lot on my laptop and I have to say the penalty shout was 50/50. If the Killie striker had gone down while Worrall was actually holding him he'd have got it. Because he waited Worrall let him go and then he went down. 

The red card was totally correct. Threw the elbow deliberately into Kamara's face. Hopefully someone pulls Stevie Clarke up about calling it a joke decision. He's dead wrong about that. 

And there's no challenge by Candeias on the highlights so can't say anything about that one. 

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Still don't see that as violent conduct, we're going to see a lot more red cards for goalkeepers if that criteria is applied consistently.

 

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6 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

Still don't see that as violent conduct, we're going to see a lot more red cards for goalkeepers if that criteria is applied consistently.

 

Maybe so but it doesn't justify Clarke's post match hysteria.

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24 minutes ago, EddardStark said:

Maybe so but it doesn't justify Clarke's post match hysteria.

To be fair there were a few incidents he was unhappy with.

 

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33 minutes ago, EddardStark said:

Maybe so but it doesn't justify Clarke's post match hysteria.

His bit about you lot being bigoted cretins was bang on though. 

 

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1 hour ago, Toepoke said:

Still don't see that as violent conduct, we're going to see a lot more red cards for goalkeepers if that criteria is applied consistently.

 

It’s already been proven that violent conduct is t a red card offence in this country, however in any other country, that is a stick on red card. Just can’t do that. 

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