Racism in football

[Jim Beem]

1 hour ago, dandydunn said:

What’s a gammon? I’ve never heard that in my life directed at someone. 

The Question Time audience is usually jammed with furious blustering gammon. As an example. 

[Mox]

33 minutes ago, DoonTheSlope said:

Then that’s racist in itself 

It's a term that racists use to try and make out that they themselves are the victim of some kind of phantom persecution, it would be hilarious if it weren't so tragic.

[Jim Beem]

2 minutes ago, Mox said:

It's a term that racists use to try and make out that they themselves are the victim of some kind of phantom persecution, it would be hilarious if it weren't so tragic.

And they often have a pineapple ring on their face. 

[Mox]

3 minutes ago, Jim Beem said:

And they often have a pineapple ring on their face. 

You noticed that to?

[Pool Q]

I’ve always been uncomfortable with it, although I don’t agree it is inherently racist. It wouldn’t be applied to most white people, and the term is applied as a result of the attitude and behaviour rather than race. Indeed in my experience it is usually used by white people. It is a pejorative term for right wing middle-aged, middle England Brexit voting males who get shoutily angry the moment anyone questions their conservative, anti-immigrant, royalist, anti-EU world view. Essentially anyone who doesn’t accept all of this as being self-evident common sense is not only wrong, but has to be shouted at for being a border line traitor. Think the audience in most editions of QT, or google Mike Graham ‘interviewing’ Femi on LBC. All that said, wouldn’t use it myself.

Edited December 31, 2018 by Pool Q

[Ally Bongo]

If a black person calling another black person "Guy Gibson's dog" isnt racist then how is a white person calling another white person "Gammon" racist ?

Answers on a postcard to;

It isnt

[Jim Beem]

31 minutes ago, Pool Q said:

I’ve always been uncomfortable with it, although I don’t agree it is inherently racist. It wouldn’t be applied to most white people, and the term is applied as a result of the attitude and behaviour rather than race. Indeed in my experience it is usually used by white people. It is a pejorative term for right wing middle-aged, middle England Brexit voting males who get shoutily angry the moment anyone questions their conservative, anti-immigrant, royalist, anti-EU world view. Essentially anyone who doesn’t accept all of this as being self-evident common sense is not only wrong, but has to be shouted at for being a border line traitor. Think the audience in most editions of QT, or google Mike Graham ‘interviewing’ Femi on LBC. All that said, wouldn’t use it myself.

Definitely not exclusive to middle England though, I’ve seen a few outbreaks of Gammonella in Scotland. Granted they are normally Tories. 

[Lairdyfaeinverclyde]

Bit off topic. I was watching the 'Dambusters' this afternoon, sad i know. I had just read some comments on this thread when i heard the 'N' word on the telly. It turned out it was someone shouting on there dog, a black Labrador called 'ni..er'. I know the film was made years ago but was still surprised the'N' word was left in. 

[Ally Bongo]

42 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

If a black person calling another black person "Guy Gibson's dog" isnt racist then how is a white person calling another white person "Gammon" racist ?

Answers on a postcard to;

It isnt

 

16 minutes ago, Lairdyfaeinverclyde said:

Bit off topic. I was watching the 'Dambusters' this afternoon, sad i know. I had just read some comments on this thread when i heard the 'N' word on the telly. It turned out it was someone shouting on there dog, a black Labrador called 'ni..er'. I know the film was made years ago but was still surprised the'N' word was left in. 

They give a warning at the start each time it is on now along the lines of what was acceptable language in the 40s compared to present day

[phart]

5 hours ago, Mox said:

Of course I'm angry about racism, we should all be angry that's it creeping back into a sport that we all love. You and your pal are clearly comfortable with it, I'm not happy that players and people can't go to a game safe in the knowledge that won't be abused because of their colour, that is a disgrace and if you're happy to sit back and do nothing about it then you should be ashamed.

As for your last point, I've not got a fucking clue what you're on about.

I'm clearly comfortable with what?Folk being racially abused at football games? Just baseless nonsense, more indicative of conditioned response rather than any sort of reason.

I was laughing at you cause you were enraged at racism/prejudice etc while making perjorative blanket statements, so now i'm happy with racism.

Never had the Race Card pulled on me ever in my life and now it's done on the TAMB, what race are you Mox?

It's a special kind of zealotry isn't it Mox where you get to rage and accuse cause your cause is so Just. I can make damaging baseless accusations cause i'm fighting in the name of RACISM, reminds me of the PETA folk that dig up the scientists dead relatives fighting animal cruelty. My cause is so Just therefore i can rage and slander.

Edited December 31, 2018 by phart

[phart]

58 minutes ago, Pool Q said:

I’ve always been uncomfortable with it, although I don’t agree it is inherently racist. It wouldn’t be applied to most white people, and the term is applied as a result of the attitude and behaviour rather than race. Indeed in my experience it is usually used by white people. It is a pejorative term for right wing middle-aged, middle England Brexit voting males who get shoutily angry the moment anyone questions their conservative, anti-immigrant, royalist, anti-EU world view. Essentially anyone who doesn’t accept all of this as being self-evident common sense is not only wrong, but has to be shouted at for being a border line traitor. Think the audience in most editions of QT, or google Mike Graham ‘interviewing’ Femi on LBC. All that said, wouldn’t use it myself.

 

It's not racist and certainly not racist in the context that the n-word is. It doesn't have any kind of historical prejudice and oppression behind it but as a philosophical point it makes sense cause of the reasons you iterate. However partisans(Mox) just see their opponents buzz words and off they go to battle for their Cause.

Edited December 31, 2018 by phart

[Toepoke]

17 hours ago, dandydunn said:

What’s a gammon? I’ve never heard that in my life directed at someone. 

Seemed to originate when these guys all had a go at Corbyn in an election debate...

[bonzo]

15 hours ago, Lairdyfaeinverclyde said:

Bit off topic. I was watching the 'Dambusters' this afternoon, sad i know. I had just read some comments on this thread when i heard the 'N' word on the telly. It turned out it was someone shouting on there dog, a black Labrador called 'ni..er'. I know the film was made years ago but was still surprised the'N' word was left in. 

There's also pat bonners nickname.

[ParisInAKilt]

This is the most tolerant society has ever been, least that’s how I see it. Always gonna have the odd bell end or old guy who should know better but easy enough to identify them and stop them going if that’s what the clubs decide.

[ParisInAKilt]

On 12/31/2018 at 10:53 PM, Mox said:

You've not got a clue about racism, all you and others like you do is trivialise racism, you've never experienced racism in your life you absolute whopper, the colour of your skin has never held you back. You're an old white British guy, you've benefitted from your skin colour all your life and now you've just turned into a sad old virgin, sitting in your mums spare room never leaving the gaff and pontificating about racism on the internet. You're a loser, there's no other term for it, a complete loser.

Edited January 1, 2019 by ParisInAKilt

[Scotland Ever More]

21 hours ago, DoonTheSlope said:

Racism isn’t making a comeback as it’s never really went away. For some reason it’s just getting highlighted more lately 

Just on Saturday night there I was having a pish at half time and there was people along the troff singing about the Irish Republican Army to the tune of the slosh that Yinitit sing. Where’s the outrage from the some of the same people who no doubt are posting the same faux outrage about the auld cunt that was on tele.... I’ve no been able to get that IRA song oot my heid ever since.

They people getting upset about this most probably the same people at Ibrox last week shouting about about orange bastards then logging onto the computer greeting because some Hun called him a bead rattling cunt

Ive read forums and twitter/Facebook over the last couple of days and it’s all “aye but there’s more of them singing bad songs than us” if they are that bothered about it then they’d get their own houses in order first instead of dictating onto others

A problem is a problem is a problem. It doesn’t matter if it’s 50,000 Rangers and Hearts fans at Ibrox singing about being up their knees in fenian blood, 3,500 in the Away ends singing about joining the Ira, or a few people in a toilet singing party songs it’s never going to go away

 

I'm not sure you understand what racism actually is if you're equating it to rebel songs

[RenfrewBlue]

1 hour ago, Scotland Ever More said:

I'm not sure you understand what racism actually is if you're equating it to rebel songs

He's not equating. He's making the very valid point that there's loads of offensive, stupid shit that gets sung/shouted and one side points at the other without sorting out their own house first. 

If everyone was actually serious about stopping these issues they'd just get on with it rather than being full of whataboutery. 

In a football context neither Rangers nor Celtic are really intent on getting rid of the bigots as they contribute too much cash to the coffers. Just tidying up round the edges is all that ever gets done. 

[Scotland Ever More]

1 hour ago, RenfrewBlue said:

He's not equating. He's making the very valid point that there's loads of offensive, stupid shit that gets sung/shouted and one side points at the other without sorting out their own house first. 

If everyone was actually serious about stopping these issues they'd just get on with it rather than being full of whataboutery. 

In a football context neither Rangers nor Celtic are really intent on getting rid of the bigots as they contribute too much cash to the coffers. Just tidying up round the edges is all that ever gets done. 

1. At no point does he explain that.

2. Rebel songs aren't bigoted.

[kumnio]

I just can’t take anti white racism seriously to be honest. I think I’ve been on the end of it in some Asian countries, but it’s just not worth getting upset about. 

Some people receive terrible treatment and abuse because of their skin colour, I couldn’t think that happens to white people in Scotland in any great scale. 

[Rolling hIlls]

11 minutes ago, Scotland Ever More said:

1. At no point does he explain that.

2. Rebel songs aren't bigoted.

Rebel songs aren't bigoted? Against not whom?  I was in a club at the weekend full of Cellic fans (with a couple of my pals).  I ca assure you as if you don't already know lol that the vast majority were bigotted and I took a lot of slagging!!!  Quote of the year already SEM..  Oh, it's only the first.  Good marker though and sets the bar quite high.  Racism and sectarianism go hand in in hand.  Both hating other humans.  Trying to split hairs is pathetic.  A mans a man for a that and being Scottish you should know that.  Had a quiet night with family last night but on the Jura today (first one).  Scotland Forever ❤️

[Rolling hIlls]

Cue the name calling now like orange vermin scum and such like.  Wait...………. for it...………… C'mon SEM, you know you want to resort to it!

[Scotland Ever More]

10 minutes ago, Rolling hIlls said:

Rebel songs aren't bigoted? Against not whom?  I was in a club at the weekend full of Cellic fans (with a couple of my pals).  I ca assure you as if you don't already know lol that the vast majority were bigotted and I took a lot of slagging!!!  Quote of the year already SEM..  Oh, it's only the first.  Good marker though and sets the bar quite high.  Racism and sectarianism go hand in in hand.  Both hating other humans.  Trying to split hairs is pathetic.  A mans a man for a that and being Scottish you should know that.  Had a quiet night with family last night but on the Jura today (first one).  Scotland Forever ❤️

Do you consider flower of Scotland bigoted?

[Scotland Ever More]

8 minutes ago, Rolling hIlls said:

Cue the name calling now like orange vermin scum and such like.  Wait...………. for it...………… C'mon SEM, you know you want to resort to it!

What's wrong with your life that you're sitting on NYD craving attention on a football forum?

[Rolling hIlls]

1 minute ago, Scotland Ever More said:

What's wrong with your life that you're sitting on NYD craving attention on a football forum?

Sitting having a drink with my partner.  Waiting on steak pie cooking then going out in Gala for a wee while to meet colleagues.  Nothing wrong wi that SEM?  Na, don't fall out, I think hatred is bad all over.  But in saying that I can sit in the Celtic club and listen to the songs and comfortable with being in a pub of Rangers supporters singing the sash etc.  I don't take it seriously and people I know get that.  Unfortunately as in life you always get some who go too far.  Anyone who goes to a game nowadays and gets caught on camera singing or shouting sectarian or racist pish deserves all they get.  You are Celtic and Scotland as a lot of my mates are.  Be proud of that mate.  Have a good day and I mean that 👍

[phart]

1 hour ago, kumnio said:

I just can’t take anti white racism seriously to be honest. I think I’ve been on the end of it in some Asian countries, but it’s just not worth getting upset about. 

Some people receive terrible treatment and abuse because of their skin colour, I couldn’t think that happens to white people in Scotland in any great scale. 

exactly it doesn't have the same historical weight. Currently it's unlikely to accumulate any either, but now we have moved the pendulum let is stay at rest instead of swinging it the other way.

 

Still pretty weird to have the race card pulled on me though, presumably by a white guy who might be even older than me.