Scotland vs Israel - Match Thread [20/11/2018]

[andyD]

1 hour ago, bigfingers said:

The best thing about last night is we can say bye bye to a few players....Ritchie, Snodgrass, Cairney and Kev Macdonald to name a few.

If that was the best thing for you, i think that's kinda sad.

[Texas Pete]

15 minutes ago, macy37 said:

Many of the teams we’ve played lately, in fact say since the England defeat and I’d also include us, are not as strong as certainly Leipzig nor Salzburg to name just two.That in itself has me questioning why he doesn’t turn it on on a more regular basis. Has it been a motivational thing? Has Eck managed him so well he is at last producing? 

I have a feeling that being dropped by McLeish when he was playing with wing backs has spurned Forrest on.

Maybe it was worth the humiliation in Haifa to have Forrest find his form for us at last. 

[Orraloon]

4 hours ago, Dalgety Bay TA said:

 

 He then somehow managed to be the deepest player in defence and play them all on at the chance McGregor pulled off a great save on. WTF was he doing back there. 

 

Aye, well spotted. I didn't see that at the time. I was up the other end of the ground. Patterson and Bates are clearly working well together to try and hold the line and they they must have been thinking the same as you. "WTF is he doing in that position?"

Edited November 21, 2018 by Orraloon

[Scotty CTA]

2 hours ago, JECK said:

It's maybe nit picking, don't want to dwell on it too much (he's going to be great for us)...

No probs, Mate.

2 hours ago, JECK said:

...but it can be done.

I see him block shots every week.

[ScotlandWintheWorldCup]

1 hour ago, andyD said:

For the team as a whole.. The thing that struck me was just how comfortable on the ball we are now. Everyone, and I mean everyone, can take a ball, trust their first touch and move it on. There's no McArthur first touches where it ends up 6 yards away, no panicking in possession and giving it away. Everyone took and moved it comfortably, even when under pressure. It made such a difference and was the foundation for everything we did, and was exemplified by Bates and McKenna playing give and go's on the edge of their box after a corner! We've got some proper footballers suddenly!

The other thing of note was a lack of defensive leadership. Not unexpected given that we've got two 22 year old centerbacks. But we lacked someone making organisational decisions. For the opening goal, someone should have been shouting for McGregor to close down. Another occasions, both McKenna and Bates were backing off, and McKenna should really have closed down, but no one told him to as soon as he didn't. Like i said, it's harsh to blame the two of them, especially since it's their 2nd game together, so perhaps it falls on the keeper to be calling it. McGregor's old enough and experienced enough to be helping direct them. It's something that needs sorted in future games.

Fingers crossed we can carry this confidence into the proper qualifiers and not be distracted by the fact we have a back door waiting for us if we fail. Looking forward to group B in two years time as well. Right now it feels like a tier we stand a chance of staying in.

Agree about how comfortable on the ball we were last night.  I think a lot of that comes from having McGregor as DM, great touch for that position, who knew he could be such an accomplished player in that position.  Means we now have our B.Ferguson again, player who can screen but also pick it up deep and allow the team to get up the pitch.

Great to watch Armstrong and forrest running at them, just like the old days before 1990.  Boy they sure keck themselves when forrst got the ball.

Think it will take some more bad games before our young players are up to international level but the potential is there, you could see after 15mins they figured out how to deny isreal space and ball and take the game to them.  Most INTELLIGENT Scotland performance for years.  Roll on the qualifiers

[ScotlandWintheWorldCup]

14 hours ago, exile said:

That McGregor save in the dying minutes... thought we were a goner then! 😵

Best keeper in the world in my opinion.  Pulls of at least one out of this world save each game.

Also did the SFA pull off a blinder.  Get Mcleish in when they really wanted McFadden?  But McFadden was too inexperienced so the media and fans would have been like its a disgrace.  So they put in McLeish to take the flak and help mentor McFadden to greatness!!!

[asaflaza]

Well played guys, you deserved this win (that Forrest guy!) , good luck at the playoffs.

Cheers from Israel.

Edited November 21, 2018 by asaflaza

[Grim Jim]

15 hours ago, exile said:

That McGregor save in the dying minutes... thought we were a goner then! 😵

I didn't even realize he'd done that until I got home and watched the highlights!   I was probably staring at my watch.

[Grim Jim]

17 hours ago, Toepoke said:

I wonder who before tonight was the last player to score 5 times in a row for us?...

 

Denis Law 1963?

Last 2 of 4 at home to Austria then all 3 away to Norway (we lost 4-3).   Could have been more, but the Austria 'friendly' was abandoned after 79 mins before someone got seriously hurt.

 

And no, that's not from memory...

[Orraloon]

27 minutes ago, Grim Jim said:

Denis Law 1963?

Last 2 of 4 at home to Austria then all 3 away to Norway (we lost 4-3).   Could have been more, but the Austria 'friendly' was abandoned after 79 mins before someone got seriously hurt.

 

And no, that's not from memory...

But you were there, aye? And just forgotten?

 

 

[Grim Jim]

12 minutes ago, Orraloon said:

But you were there, aye? And just forgotten?

 

 

Fecked if I know 😋

[Toepoke]

1 hour ago, Grim Jim said:

Denis Law 1963?

Last 2 of 4 at home to Austria then all 3 away to Norway (we lost 4-3).   Could have been more, but the Austria 'friendly' was abandoned after 79 mins before someone got seriously hurt.

 

And no, that's not from memory...

Cheers! As mentioned last night that was also the last time a Scotland player scored multiple goals in consecutive games. 

Ma faither still talks about that Austria game. The bewildered looks when the ref picked up the ball and walked off.

 

[mariokempes56]

43 minutes ago, Grim Jim said:

Fecked if I know 😋

Me neither - what ?

[Third Lanark]

8 hours ago, JECK said:

Great night and result obviously.  Just one thing i wanted to mention was Mckenna at the second israel goal. He's turned away and not faced up the shot - if he does that he blocks the shot.  This comparison is going to sound ridiculous i know but bear with: At my weekly 7s over time ive managed to face up shots and take the hit basically, watching the ball and not turn away, it actually does not hurt a great deal 8/9 times out of 10.  So what am basically saying is if i can do it, he bloody certainly can! Saying that i think he's smashing defender and could be top class very soon.

That's the reason you've ended up looking like Mark Lawrenson!

[exile]

6 hours ago, asaflaza said:

Well played guys, you deserved this win (that Forrest guy!) , good luck at the playoffs.

Cheers from Israel.

Cheers. Well, good luck with the playoffs if we don't need the play-off place 😉

Edited November 21, 2018 by exile

[exile]

 

4 hours ago, Grim Jim said:

I didn't even realize he'd done that until I got home and watched the highlights!   I was probably staring at my watch.

Edited November 21, 2018 by exile

[exile]

4 hours ago, Grim Jim said:

I didn't even realize he'd done that until I got home and watched the highlights!   I was probably staring at my watch.

It looked a dead cert from the other angle

[Guest faircity]

8 hours ago, macy37 said:

Many of the teams we’ve played lately, in fact say since the England defeat and I’d also include us, are not as strong as certainly Leipzig nor Salzburg to name just two.That in itself has me questioning why he doesn’t turn it on on a more regular basis. Has it been a motivational thing? Has Eck managed him so well he is at last producing? 

That's sidestepping though. Would Leipzig beat Germany? Clearly they wouldn't. I doubt very much that Salzburg would beat Austria. 

As an aside, you think Scotland wouldn't best Salzburg? Are you mental? Or were you wearing your Celtic hat? 

Edited November 21, 2018 by faircity

[PASTA Mick]

25 minutes ago, faircity said:

That's sidestepping though. Would Leipzig beat Germany? Clearly they wouldn't. I doubt very much that Salzburg would beat Austria. 

As an aside, you think Scotland wouldn't best Salzburg? Are you mental? Or were you wearing your Celtic hat? 

I think Salzburg would beat both Austria and Scotland.  They are a really good team. 

[Baz]

10 hours ago, er yir macaroon said:

That’s ridiculous, two slack passes, but otherwise quite astonishing ability to win tackles and drive the team forward. He’s got a role to play, especially in more demanding games. 

It’s not just 2 slack passes though. It may only be 2 that have cost goals but he gives the ball away time and time again.

granted he’s good in the tackle.

honestly think he’s one of the most overrated players in this crop.

[BucksburnDandy]

Delighted to win last night and ultimately it is a big result in terms of trying to qualify. It seems our management team grasped what a great chance this Nations League is to qualify, which too many "football people" haven't realised at all (Willie Miller on Sportsound last night for one).

 

Firstly the positives:

1) We look very entertaining going forward in this formation. The quality of passing and the ingenuity in tight areas to open up the Israelis at times last night was superb. Stick like this and we're going to score plenty

2) The formation. It's clearly what suits our personnel best and what we look most comfortable in. The Kieran Tierney conundrum has a simple answer now, for the good of the team, right back

3) The realisation nearly a year into his time from Alex McLeish that Stuart Armstrong makes a huge difference to us. Armstrong's direct running and smart passing really does set the tempo for how we play and what we create. We have been a dreadful side without him

4) The emergence of McKenna, Bates and Christie. All young lads, all stepping up to the plate in this double header superbly well. Couple that with Forrest and Fraser showing up more prominently, things look a little brighter

5) Winning the group, securing a playoff berth and ultimately being two games from a major championship.

 

A few small negatives:

1) The two goals lost were absolutely dreadful. That they were nearly identical is not acceptable. Both should have been closed by the sitting midfielders. I'll cut Callum McGregor some slack given how new he is in there but we can't keep losing cheap goals like that

2) Paterson at right back is a bombscare

3) Diving in with the subs immediately after the Israeli second goal. While Shinnie was exactly what we needed at that point, Phillips was not and ultimately did little to hold the ball up at all. A minute or two to gather thoughts may not have been a bad thing.

4) The attendance, dreadful

 

All in all though a good night for the few that turned out.

[Barney Rubble]

The simple answer to the Keiran Tierney conundrum is that he does not get picked ahead of a fit and in-form Andy Robertson at left back in a four.

He is not a right back. Never has been, never will be. 

Our best available natural right back at the moment - when fit - is Stephen O'Donnell. At least until another natural right back comes through who is superior.

Re Tierney, he may - and I'm speculating here - be a possible replacement for Mulgrew as a centre back.

But as a right back, no. He isn't comfortable there, even if Strachan asked him to do a passable impression last campaign.

[Bino's]

26 minutes ago, Barney Rubble said:

The simple answer to the Keiran Tierney conundrum is that he does not get picked ahead of a fit and in-form Andy Robertson at left back in a four.

He is not a right back. Never has been, never will be. 

Our best available natural right back at the moment - when fit - is Stephen O'Donnell. At least until another natural right back comes through who is superior.

Re Tierney, he may - and I'm speculating here - be a possible replacement for Mulgrew as a centre back.

But as a right back, no. He isn't comfortable there, even if Strachan asked him to do a passable impression last campaign.

Tierney is better at right back than Stephen O'Donnell

[ceudmilefailte]

Tierney in place of Mulgrew, are we going back to three at the back

I think as long as the starting eleven are playing well at club level they should remain as the starting eleven

Think Patterson  is getting hard done by on here. I got fed up saying he wasn't a right back on here  in the run up to the games but I think some of his  contributions to the team in other ways make him as good an option as any others we have. We don't have a stand out right back but he is far better at defending set pieces and can offer more options with attacking set pieces than the alternatives.. He also gets stuck in more than others and you need some of that on the pitch.

[macy37]

2 hours ago, faircity said:

That's sidestepping though. Would Leipzig beat Germany? Clearly they wouldn't. I doubt very much that Salzburg would beat Austria. 

As an aside, you think Scotland wouldn't best Salzburg? Are you mental? Or were you wearing your Celtic hat? 

Clearly they wouldn’t? Have you seen the krauts lately? And yes Salzburg would beat us and Austria.