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If Croatia can do it, so can we.


er yir macaroon

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Unfortunately there are a few reasons - the SFA, a total dinosaur manager and clubs who'd rather sign sh*te from the lower leagues in England or someone with a foreign name than give youngsters a chance.

Sort all that out (not much chance with the SFA as turkeys don't vote for Christmas) and we could certainly do it with a favourable draw.  I'd say it'd take 10-15 years to be challenging properly though.

Not holding my breath.  It's been a bit depressing watching this WC and seeing what also-rans we are.  :(

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1 hour ago, er yir macaroon said:

There’s no reason Scotland can’t get to a World Cup final. Don’t believe anyone who tells you otherwise. 

There are a million reasons why Scotland will never get to a world cup final. The comparison with Croatia is lazy and utterly spurious, our only connection is the size of population, nothing more.

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11 minutes ago, Mox said:

There are a million reasons why Scotland will never get to a world cup final. The comparison with Croatia is lazy and utterly spurious, our only connection is the size of population, nothing more.

To be fair it's not really

The Croatians themselves couldnt tell you the answer to why they have had such success in the last 20-25 years

They dont have any football development structure of note - certainly not anywhere near the lengths that Iceland have went with regards facilities - and their association has went through years of corruption

Their initial success after the break up of Yugoslavia could be put down to the legacy of multi sport clubs that had been in place before the War at Dynamo Zagreb and also Red Star Belgrade in Serbia

Then there was the war itself - refugees, poverty, desolation - kids more likely to play sports outdoors rather on TV

Once this generation passes it is unlikely Croatia will reach these levels again unless of course it inspires them to revolutionise their game at home again (like Iceland)

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Interesting article in The Scotsman: https://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/scotland/why-scotland-fans-are-wrong-to-look-to-croatia-as-a-model-to-follow-1-4767975

Basically says Croatia succeed despite having no plan or structure. However the players get first team football at an early age, come through U21s together and then have no fear leaving home. That said there has to be some luck involved when you get players if that quality at the same time. How many of England's team could play for Barcelona, Real Madrid, Juve etc?

Maybe there are things to be positive about. We just have to wait a little bit longer.

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I put this on the other Croatia thread but probably belongs more here 

7 minutes ago, exile said:

Aside from natural talent two other things spring to mind

The climate, and evolving a game that is suited to tournament climates... which could be assisted by summer football? But I know there are arguments against that too.

And another thing that got me thinking, their league is not exactly renowned for being one of the top leagues but their players play in the top leagues. People growing up in Croatia must expect to have to travel, learn a new culture and language, to play for world class teams. Scots probably settle for taking their chances in the Premiership/Championship. Not much we can do about that?

Going back to natural talent, then, I wonder if a bit of selective immigration from talented footballing countries would help (though it might not please the Rees Moggs of this world)... as an alternative to trawling the English leagues for people with Scottish grannies.    

Of course there are lots of small countries so we would not be alone in trying to emulate Croatia. But maybe need to do it our own way - Iceland did it their way. 

But also, I think smaller countries may have 'golden generations' from time time time but are less likely to get to the top as regularly as the bigger countries. Smaller or medium sized countries that won stuff (Czechoslovakia, Denmark, Greece) have not tended to repeat the feat... at least in the 'modern era'.     

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2 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

To be fair it's not really

The Croatians themselves couldnt tell you the answer to why they have had such success in the last 20-25 years

They dont have any football development structure of note - certainly not anywhere near the lengths that Iceland have went with regards facilities - and their association has went through years of corruption

Their initial success after the break up of Yugoslavia could be put down to the legacy of multi sport clubs that had been in place before the War at Dynamo Zagreb and also Red Star Belgrade in Serbia

Then there was the war itself - refugees, poverty, desolation - kids more likely to play sports outdoors rather on TV

Once this generation passes it is unlikely Croatia will reach these levels again unless of course it inspires them to revolutionise their game at home again (like Iceland)

They actually play football

Passing, possession, ability

We continue to just lump it up the park

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Younger folks might not remember this but the former Yugoslavia were one of the better nations in world football before the 1990s.   They favoured a game that concentrated on excellent technique which was unusual in Europe at the time.  So much so they were referred to as the Brazil of Europe - at a time when that was considered a compliment.

I think Croatia have largely just taken that on and run with it.

In reality they were decades ahead of us decades ago.

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34 minutes ago, Bino's said:

They actually play football

Passing, possession, ability

We continue to just lump it up the park

Also, as pointed out above, our clubs don't like to play Scottish people

They prefer to over pay average foreigners, who they get to lump it up the park

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42 minutes ago, aaid said:

Younger folks might not remember this but the former Yugoslavia were one of the better nations in world football before the 1990s.   They favoured a game that concentrated on excellent technique which was unusual in Europe at the time.  So much so they were referred to as the Brazil of Europe - at a time when that was considered a compliment.

I think Croatia have largely just taken that on and run with it.

In reality they were decades ahead of us decades ago.

Aye, I remember watching Red Star Belgrade pass Rangers off the park in the European Cup. Robert Prosinecky was sensational.

 

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1 hour ago, aaid said:

Younger folks might not remember this but the former Yugoslavia were one of the better nations in world football before the 1990s.   They favoured a game that concentrated on excellent technique which was unusual in Europe at the time.  So much so they were referred to as the Brazil of Europe - at a time when that was considered a compliment.

I think Croatia have largely just taken that on and run with it.

In reality they were decades ahead of us decades ago.

Very true.

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1 hour ago, aaid said:

Younger folks might not remember this but the former Yugoslavia were one of the better nations in world football before the 1990s.   They favoured a game that concentrated on excellent technique which was unusual in Europe at the time.  So much so they were referred to as the Brazil of Europe - at a time when that was considered a compliment.

I think Croatia have largely just taken that on and run with it.

In reality they were decades ahead of us decades ago.

Yes they had better technical ability but a bit of an exaggeration none the less emphasised by their performances in Finals tournaments

Their record against us also stunk - only beat us once in 8 attempts

So something has happened since 1990 that has pushed them on while we have been stagnant

It is possible that the style of play that they have had is more suited to the modern game but it must be more than that

 

 

Edited by Ally Bongo
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2 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

Yes they had better technical ability but a bit of an exaggeration none the less emphasised by their performances in Finals tournaments

Their record against us also stunk - only beat us once in 8 attempts

So something has happened since 1990 that has pushed them on while we have been stagnant

It is possible that the style of play that they have had is more suited to the modern game but it must be more than that

 

 

There's certainly an argument that if the Balkan war hadn't happened and Yugoslavia hadn't split up they would have won the Euros and 1992 and possibly the World Cup in 94.  In fact Croatia, had they been able compete might have done if on their own.

I was one of a hundred or so Scots lucky enough to see Croatia's first competitive game in 1994 - and that deserves a thread of its own - and they were packed with talent.  Prosnecki, Jarni, Boban, Boksic, etc, etc.

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16 minutes ago, er yir macaroon said:

It’s remarkable how this thread has become about looking for excuses as to why we can’t be as good as them. Absolutely remarkable. 

Erm - apart from Mox and Bonny (who is an absolute rocket) most of us have been looking for reasons as to why we arent rather than why we cant

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