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Scottish Players in Action 18/19


PASTA Mick

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30 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said:

You are pulling out exceptions to the rule, there's about 4 or 5 countries who have small populations similar to us that do really well and punch above their weight in recent years. The vast majority of small nations achieve very little and have relatively poor teams. In the 70s,80s and to a lesser extent the 90s we were one of those countries punching above our weight(we qualified for world cups that only had 16 teams). The hope is we can return to that level where we qualify for tournaments but to expect us to match Croatia's or Uruguays achievements is  very unlikely, its not impossible but still very unlikely.

The vast amount of small nations don't give a whit about football. Again, it's not about population. China is the biggest country in the world, they don't care about football, so they've gotten out of football that they've put in. Football is apparently our main sport, but we don't put anything into it.

OK. The last couple of the lines sums up the Scottish mentality. "It's unlikely, so why bother!". It's that type of apathy that's put us where we are. If we aren't hoping to match the likes of Croatia or Uruguay then what's the point of continuing? We SHOULD be aiming to emulate the successes of other nations. Look at Ajax and their achievements this season, with a core of homegrown players. If Celtic managed to get to the quarters or the semis of the European Cup they'd do it with 9 or 10 foreigners.

My point is a tremendous one. We're teaching our kids the basics at 15/16, their foreign counterpart is being taught the basics at 5+. Generally, players are only really coachable till they hit 18 years of age. At this time they are looking to break through to first team football. That being the case, generally, our players receive 2/3 years of skillset coaching, abroad they get 13 years.

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38 minutes ago, Chripper said:

The vast amount of small nations don't give a whit about football. Again, it's not about population. China is the biggest country in the world, they don't care about football, so they've gotten out of football that they've put in. Football is apparently our main sport, but we don't put anything into it.

OK. The last couple of the lines sums up the Scottish mentality. "It's unlikely, so why bother!". It's that type of apathy that's put us where we are. If we aren't hoping to match the likes of Croatia or Uruguay then what's the point of continuing? We SHOULD be aiming to emulate the successes of other nations. Look at Ajax and their achievements this season, with a core of homegrown players. If Celtic managed to get to the quarters or the semis of the European Cup they'd do it with 9 or 10 foreigners.

My point is a tremendous one. We're teaching our kids the basics at 15/16, their foreign counterpart is being taught the basics at 5+. Generally, players are only really coachable till they hit 18 years of age. At this time they are looking to break through to first team football. That being the case, generally, our players receive 2/3 years of skillset coaching, abroad they get 13 years.

My point is a tremendous one. We're teaching our kids the basics at 15/16, their foreign counterpart is being taught the basics at 5+. Generally, players are only really coachable till they hit 18 years of age. At this time they are looking to break through to first team football. That being the case, generally, our players receive 2/3 years of skillset coaching, abroad they get 13 years.

 

Are you seriously trying to suggest our players don't get taught the basics of football until 15 years old. Are you actually involved with youth football at any level, have you ever watched a youth match at any level, because this suggestion is complete and utter ludicrous. It amazes me the amount of times your arguments seem to revolve around 'facts' that you have just made up.

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3 minutes ago, bazmidd said:

Are you seriously trying to suggest our players don't get taught the basics of football until 15 years old. Are you actually involved with youth football at any level, have you ever watched a youth match at any level, because this suggestion is complete and utter ludicrous. It amazes me the amount of times your arguments seem to revolve around 'facts' that you have just made up.

How else could you explain why our INTERNATIONALS are still struggling with the basics?

Look. We struggled to break down the worst international team on planet Earth. We were made to sweat by a team who have 33k population. We were steamrollered by a team who are 116 in the world. 

Are these facts factual enough for you?

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2 minutes ago, Chripper said:

How else could you explain why our INTERNATIONALS are still struggling with the basics?

Look. We struggled to break down the worst international team on planet Earth. We were made to sweat by a team who have 33k population. We were steamrollered by a team who are 116 in the world. 

Are these facts factual enough for you?

Look firstly I believe the players we have at our disposal in the current squad ARE good enough to beat Kazakhstan and San Marino comfortably. We have beaten better nations than them before. There were a number of factors at play for the defeat in Kazakhstan especially and for me the primary factor was being very badly managed. I lay the blame primarily on McLeish and his tactics which I have explained before, this coupled with the amount of call offs, playing an inexperienced backline with no protection in front of it, gaps between Defence, Midfield and Attack as wide as the Forth and players having a very bad night at the office was a recipe for disaster, which it was. A good manager would have adapted to such issues and protected our inexperienced players set us up to stay solid and find confidence by playing our way into the game and slowly gaining control of the game at which point I would expect us to score a couple of goals as our players ARE BETTER than there's. There was no reaction in San Marino because by this point McLeish had completely lost the dressing room. No one really wanted to be there, everything surrounding the game was poisonous and everyone fans players manager seemed to be going through the motions. The players no longer trusted him and his methods after Kazakhstan.

To claim our players not knowing the basics of football as the reason for these two results is just complete nonsense. We do know the basic fundamentals of playing football to even claim that is just ridiculous. Could our players be better coached from a young age? Could the quality of coaching be higher? Yes I would agree. But to claim our players are not coached the basics of football until 15 is just ridiculous. 

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1 minute ago, bazmidd said:

Look firstly I believe the players we have at our disposal in the current squad ARE good enough to beat Kazakhstan and San Marino comfortably. We have beaten better nations than them before. There were a number of factors at play for the defeat in Kazakhstan especially and for me the primary factor was being very badly managed. I lay the blame primarily on McLeish and his tactics which I have explained before, this coupled with the amount of call offs, playing an inexperienced backline with no protection in front of it, gaps between Defence, Midfield and Attack as wide as the Forth and players having a very bad night at the office was a recipe for disaster, which it was. A good manager would have adapted to such issues and protected our inexperienced players set us up to stay solid and find confidence by playing our way into the game and slowly gaining control of the game at which point I would expect us to score a couple of goals as our players ARE BETTER than there's. There was no reaction in San Marino because by this point McLeish had completely lost the dressing room. No one really wanted to be there, everything surrounding the game was poisonous and everyone fans players manager seemed to be going through the motions. The players no longer trusted him and his methods after Kazakhstan.

To claim our players not knowing the basics of football as the reason for these two results is just complete nonsense. We do know the basic fundamentals of playing football to even claim that is just ridiculous. Could our players be better coached from a young age? Could the quality of coaching be higher? Yes I would agree. But to claim our players are not coached the basics of football until 15 is just ridiculous. 

I don't think we have good enough players to beat the likes of Kazakhstan, etc, away from home. We just don't. Our midfield is so bad that I'm advocating playing a fullback and an attacking midfielder in the engine room. Our central defence is so bad that I'm advocating packing the center of defence with three players. We have no right back that is good enough at this level. I don't trust any of our goalkeepers. We have no striker that is good enough at this level.

We have Tierney, Robertson, Fraser and McTominay, but the rest are dreadful. There's no getting past it. They showed their true colours in our two most recent matches. 

I agree with you about the gaps in defense, but they've been there for 18 YEARS! We can't play with a flat back four. Our central defenders struggle at this level, simply because they don't play at a high enough level.

I'm all for blaming McLeish, but these are supposed to be professionals here. With the 3-5-2 that Kazakhstan played it stifled us in midfield, watch it again and you'll see how they suffocated us in midfield... however, this is Kazakhstan, not Belgium. The way that our players floundered was embarrassing. Foreign players who are truly coached properly have a skillset to fall back on whenever they meet any kind of duress, like muscle-memory. The muscle-memory of our players is punt it aimlessly up the park.

Our players lack technique, skill, intelligence, composure, etc, and that comes from coaching at a young age. If our players could do the basics properly then we'd have more players In the EPL, as there is a lot of average players in the EPL, but average players that can do the basics.

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19 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

It'd be a nice get out for Yogi, unfortunately they were discussing the right back position at the time

I was listening also, he specifically stated, Docherty the right back at wolves. Dont know if that equates to him being a bad manager though.

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4 hours ago, Toepoke said:

It'd be a nice get out for Yogi, unfortunately they were discussing the right back position at the time

Oh. Bloody hell....

I kinda wish he was Scottish in fairness, as he'd had a superb season at right wingback. With that name he's probably got Irish roots, though.

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1 hour ago, andyD said:

I think that says more about you than the players available. :D

That says more about the fact that our midfield made Kazakhstan's midfield look like France's.

The fact that Scott McTominay is better than all of the rest of our midfielders combined speaks volumes for their quality.

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2 minutes ago, Chripper said:

That says more about the fact that our midfield made Kazakhstan's midfield look like France's.

The fact that Scott McTominay is better than all of the rest of our midfielders combined speaks volumes for their quality.

Are you being serious? McTominay must be up there with Iniesta and Pirlo in your eyes. 

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24 minutes ago, romanticscot said:

Are you being serious? McTominay must be up there with Iniesta and Pirlo in your eyes. 

Do you realize our bad our midfielders are?

McGinn is Championship standard, so is McLean, as is McDonald, and Shinnie, and McGregor and Christie and Armstrong.

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I get your point, you don't rate our midfielders but Ryan Fraser, James Forrest, Ryan Christie and Callum McGregor combined do not equate to less than McTominay.  McTominay is good at what he does, but relatively new to first team football. Yes I am aware of his performances in Europe just think your grossly exaggerating.

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41 minutes ago, romanticscot said:

I get your point, you don't rate our midfielders but Ryan Fraser, James Forrest, Ryan Christie and Callum McGregor combined do not equate to less than McTominay.  McTominay is good at what he does, but relatively new to first team football. Yes I am aware of his performances in Europe just think your grossly exaggerating.

No, I wasn't including Fraser or Forrest, just the central midfielders.

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2 minutes ago, ceudmilefailte said:

Nailed it, manager is the most important single factor in a football team.

Exactly, and it's especially true in international fitba as the manager has a fraction of the time to work with the players compared to club managers.

We can all talk about formations and tactics till we're blue in the face. To me, what matters is can the manager motivate them? Does he have the player's respect? Do the players actually want to be there, or do they have an urgent appointment with their travel agent / physio / dentist?

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Middleton, Johnston, Aitchison are standouts at that level. I have high hopes for all of them really hope they can break into their first teams regularly. Along with Hornby and Gilmour these are the best players coming through right now. 

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On 4/29/2019 at 7:18 PM, Toepoke said:

Born in Dublin with 5 caps for the Rep of Ireland, safe to say he does.

 

Was actually on the bench for their last qualifier. Like the conundurm on the left here, they have issue trying to fit him and Seamus Coleman into the same 11.

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