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Scottish player transfers


SkyBlueScot

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1 minute ago, Third Lanark said:

I care too. It's really annoying. I thought it was just some English folk who said 'should of'!  

To be fair, when folk say it, it just sounds the same. "Should've", "should of". Which is probable where the mistake comes in. It's only when they write it down wrong that they show off their ignorance. I blame the teachers. Especially primary teachers. 😉

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15 hours ago, mccaughey85 said:

I am happy for guys like hickey or Oliver burke to go to big clubs or leagues like serie a or the EPL as long as they will play games. The coaching and the facilities are better in these leagues but it doesn't substitute for playing first team football. Ideally a player will get both but the first team football is more important imo. If a players not playing first team football during 17-22 then he probably won't make it at a good level. 

The coaching and training facilities will be better at bayern than bologna. Would you rather he had went to bayern or bologna? He would certainly get the best coaching in the world at bayern. 

I am talking about our best players we have right now who have shown in the last 2/3 years that they are good enough. Our recent success is built on guys who are good enough to play epl football. We have 2 players who are elite and then we have another 8/9 who are good epl players. Every one of these players barring mctominay played first team football at 17-22. 

Even if we were to look at ferguson or browns careers then it only proves my point. Ferguson at the age of 18/19 broke into an excellent rangers side who could easily of finished in the top 6/7 in the EPL. He got good experience playing with excellent players under a good manager. Are you trying to say he should of spent 18-22 not playing first team football but getting top coaching and playing reserve football at somewhere like arsenal or man utd? The problem with fergusons career is that he should of moved to England around 23/24 but football was different back then, rangers and celtic could match alot of EPL clubs wages and ferguson was a guy who liked being at home and being a rangers player. 20 years ago celtic and rangers were able to keep top players in Scotland. Its near impossible to do that now. 

Scott brown played first team football at hibs from 17 to 22. I doubt he would progressed alot better had he spent those years in the likes of Aston villa or Evertons youth setup playing no first team football. Do you think he would of been a better player had he spent his youth years doing that? Again brown should of left around the 23/24 age and went south to test himself but he was happy being at celtic, he also probably wouldn't of played for the top clubs in England anyway. He was never good enough for that level anyway. 

Dunno about golf, I don't know anything about that sport lol. 

 

Im not sure where the age up to 22 has come from as we are discussing youth and young players. Ie 14 to maybe 19. Obviously there comes a point where players need to play 1st team football but imo a proper footballing education is more important when they are 16-18. 

With regards to Hickey I was happy for either Bayern or Bologna. He has done well to break into and establish himself in the 1st team this year but even last year when he was more of a back up player, his long term prospects will have been better served than if he had played 40 games at Hearts. Do you think Hickey is a better player now having hardly started last season compared to another full season in Scotland?

Likewise, do you think Gilmour made the wrong mlve by going to Chelsea amd playing in youth sides when he could have racked up 70 odd appearences for Rangers by now. Gilmour himself says that he wants to be the best in the world and to do that he felt he had to leave.

Do I think Ferguson and Brown would have become better players not getting 1st team football from age 16 to 19 at Man Utd over Rangers and Hibs. Yes. For a start the drinking and chips cultute wouldnt have existed. Also you develop and add more to your game when training and playing against a better standard of player. If a striker doesnt need to think to get space and score goals then he wont develop this trait. If the defenders are better and he isnt getting space he will have to in order to survive.

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13 hours ago, 0Neils40yarder said:

Sorry to make this point, it's just something that does my tits in...its 'should have' or 'should've' not 'should of'...

...anyway, Hickey has clearly made the right move, he's playing every week for a decent side in Serie A

Michael Stewart ruins his intellectual vibe by repeatedly falling into the “of” trap. 

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20 minutes ago, er yir macaroon said:

Michael Stewart ruins his intellectual vibe by repeatedly falling into the “of” trap. 

How does that happen? "Should've" and "Should of" sound the same. Haven't listened to him much, does he emphasise the "of" bit or something?

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7 hours ago, Diamond Scot said:

Im not sure where the age up to 22 has come from as we are discussing youth and young players. Ie 14 to maybe 19. Obviously there comes a point where players need to play 1st team football but imo a proper footballing education is more important when they are 16-18. 

With regards to Hickey I was happy for either Bayern or Bologna. He has done well to break into and establish himself in the 1st team this year but even last year when he was more of a back up player, his long term prospects will have been better served than if he had played 40 games at Hearts. Do you think Hickey is a better player now having hardly started last season compared to another full season in Scotland?

Likewise, do you think Gilmour made the wrong mlve by going to Chelsea amd playing in youth sides when he could have racked up 70 odd appearences for Rangers by now. Gilmour himself says that he wants to be the best in the world and to do that he felt he had to leave.

Do I think Ferguson and Brown would have become better players not getting 1st team football from age 16 to 19 at Man Utd over Rangers and Hibs. Yes. For a start the drinking and chips cultute wouldnt have existed. Also you develop and add more to your game when training and playing against a better standard of player. If a striker doesnt need to think to get space and score goals then he wont develop this trait. If the defenders are better and he isnt getting space he will have to in order to survive.

Totally agree. In my mind, the ideal situation would be for a young Scot to go to the performance schools for the standard 4 years between 12 and 16. Then head off to an elite team like Chelsea, Bayern from 16 to around 19, then at that point a focus can be put on first team football. I don't know if Morrison or Hepburn went to the Performance Schools, but they are currently following that model.

I heard a nice quote from Gilmour where he said something along the lines of "at Rangers he was expected to be the best midfielder at Rangers, or maybe Scotland. At Chelsea he is expected to be the best midfielder in the world". The standards set are so much higher. 

 

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1 hour ago, ger intae them said:

wrong thread, but since we’re having a go at incorrectly used ‘of’s…….bugs my tits when it’s used as in ‘it isn’t that big of a deal’……… yes it is!

 

How about the: Their, there and they're confusion that's endemic on this forum? That's real tit bugging!

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10 hours ago, Diamond Scot said:

Im not sure where the age up to 22 has come from as we are discussing youth and young players. Ie 14 to maybe 19. Obviously there comes a point where players need to play 1st team football but imo a proper footballing education is more important when they are 16-18. 

With regards to Hickey I was happy for either Bayern or Bologna. He has done well to break into and establish himself in the 1st team this year but even last year when he was more of a back up player, his long term prospects will have been better served than if he had played 40 games at Hearts. Do you think Hickey is a better player now having hardly started last season compared to another full season in Scotland?

Likewise, do you think Gilmour made the wrong mlve by going to Chelsea amd playing in youth sides when he could have racked up 70 odd appearences for Rangers by now. Gilmour himself says that he wants to be the best in the world and to do that he felt he had to leave.

Do I think Ferguson and Brown would have become better players not getting 1st team football from age 16 to 19 at Man Utd over Rangers and Hibs. Yes. For a start the drinking and chips cultute wouldnt have existed. Also you develop and add more to your game when training and playing against a better standard of player. If a striker doesnt need to think to get space and score goals then he wont develop this trait. If the defenders are better and he isnt getting space he will have to in order to survive.

Well I would consider a young player to be between roughly the ages of 16/17-22. Its the key development time of their career and its also the age with which alot of our players either get bought by epl/top clubs and the ages that they spend at these top/epl clubs. 

Perhaps our young players who are under the age of 16/17 would benefit more from the EPL youth set ups. I haven't really been arguing against that point. My point has been young lads heading to epl clubs between the ages 17-22 with no hope of playing first team and also giving up the chance of playing first team football at the club they were at. 

I am confused by the hickey question, he got first team gametime last season, might not of started every week but he was getting chances. That to me is better than heading to bayern where he wouldn't of gotten in the first team. I would be happy if kerr Smith gets the same amount of first team action as hickey did in his first season at bologna. My whole argument has been a young(17-22) player getting first team chances, Hickeys gotten that at bologna. 

With Billy gilmour it's hard to tell, a couple of seasons playing with rangers might have served him well before moving. Hes struggling this season in the EPL albeit with a poor Norwich side. Also gilmour was 15 when Chelsea signed him, not many players are ready for first team football at that age anyway so he might well have gained more by moving at that age. Hes also a very special talent and one of the few we have who might buck the trend of making it at an epl club although that isn't a certainty quite yet. 

The ferguson/brown point is strange, I doubt either would be better players from spending time in say the man utd youth set up at those specific ages you have said. Also no youth set up would want brown and ferguson for those specific ages anyway. If they bought both at 16/17 then they would be there for 4/5 years. Personally I think ferguson and brown developed into good players because they played first team football at a young age. Ferguson broke into a very good rangers team at the age of 18/19 where he played with an excellent standard of player and he also got experience in European football. Do you think it was better for him to play for Rangers at that age or to be getting no first team football at say arsenal or Man utd?

Scott brown was playing first team football at 17 every week at hibs. Again would you rather he spent 17-19 in some epl youth set up playing epl2?

Your saying you get better playing against a better standard of player. Have you watched any epl2/u23s or u18s epl football. It's a terrible standard and its a long way off even the spl, in fact I would say scottish championship is a better standard. Scott brown and ferguson probably learned more playing spl than they would of spending those years in some epl youth set up. 

It's proven that our elite players and our best epl players have mostly come through the route I am suggesting. The fact that only 1 player in the last 15 years has come through the route of EPL reserve football shows it perhaps isn't the best route. The stats back this up. 

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9 hours ago, mccaughey85 said:

Well I would consider a young player to be between roughly the ages of 16/17-22. Its the key development time of their career and its also the age with which alot of our players either get bought by epl/top clubs and the ages that they spend at these top/epl clubs. 

Perhaps our young players who are under the age of 16/17 would benefit more from the EPL youth set ups. I haven't really been arguing against that point. My point has been young lads heading to epl clubs between the ages 17-22 with no hope of playing first team and also giving up the chance of playing first team football at the club they were at. 

I am confused by the hickey question, he got first team gametime last season, might not of started every week but he was getting chances. That to me is better than heading to bayern where he wouldn't of gotten in the first team. I would be happy if kerr Smith gets the same amount of first team action as hickey did in his first season at bologna. My whole argument has been a young(17-22) player getting first team chances, Hickeys gotten that at bologna. 

With Billy gilmour it's hard to tell, a couple of seasons playing with rangers might have served him well before moving. Hes struggling this season in the EPL albeit with a poor Norwich side. Also gilmour was 15 when Chelsea signed him, not many players are ready for first team football at that age anyway so he might well have gained more by moving at that age. Hes also a very special talent and one of the few we have who might buck the trend of making it at an epl club although that isn't a certainty quite yet. 

The ferguson/brown point is strange, I doubt either would be better players from spending time in say the man utd youth set up at those specific ages you have said. Also no youth set up would want brown and ferguson for those specific ages anyway. If they bought both at 16/17 then they would be there for 4/5 years. Personally I think ferguson and brown developed into good players because they played first team football at a young age. Ferguson broke into a very good rangers team at the age of 18/19 where he played with an excellent standard of player and he also got experience in European football. Do you think it was better for him to play for Rangers at that age or to be getting no first team football at say arsenal or Man utd?

Scott brown was playing first team football at 17 every week at hibs. Again would you rather he spent 17-19 in some epl youth set up playing epl2?

Your saying you get better playing against a better standard of player. Have you watched any epl2/u23s or u18s epl football. It's a terrible standard and its a long way off even the spl, in fact I would say scottish championship is a better standard. Scott brown and ferguson probably learned more playing spl than they would of spending those years in some epl youth set up. 

It's proven that our elite players and our best epl players have mostly come through the route I am suggesting. The fact that only 1 player in the last 15 years has come through the route of EPL reserve football shows it perhaps isn't the best route. The stats back this up. 

You're still doing it 

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It’s quite obvious moving to a better and bigger club with better coaches and facilities will make a player, especially a young player, a better player.

It doesn’t mean they will become regulars for that club but it would be pretty idiotic to not realise they will improve and make it at a better level by following this route. 

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On 1/19/2022 at 2:26 PM, ProudScot said:

It’s quite obvious moving to a better and bigger club with better coaches and facilities will make a player, especially a young player, a better player.

It doesn’t mean they will become regulars for that club but it would be pretty idiotic to not realise they will improve and make it at a better level by following this route. 

Idiotic? If thats the case then give me examples of Scottish guys who went through epl or big clubs youth systems and went on to play at a good level(top 5 European leagues). Theres only mctominay(arguably not even Scottish) in the nearly 20 years and maybe gilmour although hes not made it for certain. 

Nobody has said that a player won't improve with better coaching and facilities but if a player isn't playing first team football between the ages of 17-22 which is the age most of our young players spend at epl/top clubs youth set ups then they tend not to make it at a decent level. Thats the obvious fact here and the stats back that up. 

Ideally the best situation is that a player gets top coaching and facilities as well as first team football like hickey is getting at bologna. If kerr Smith gets that at Aston villa then it will be a great move for him. 

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"SPFL clubs will be allowed just six loans in or out by 2024 as FIFA announces a shake-up of the temporary transfer system" Doesn't apply to under 21s or homegrown players.

I can't decide if this is a good or a bad thing for Scotland. Obviously the main culprits are Celtic and Rangers. Instead of sending foreign duds out on loan, they'll just stay in the squad and be a further barrier to youths getting a chance. Though I do like that this applies to loans in as well. So they won't be able to just bring in emergency loans in January to solve a problem e.g Robbie Keane, Craig Bellamy etc

It does mean most other SPFL teams, who already can't afford to pay more than a couple hundred thousand on one player, will be forced to use youths more often. That is probably a good thing for the national team, but you'd think that'll just create an even bigger divide between the old firm and the rest of the teams. 

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19 minutes ago, syecosse said:

Oliver Burke has joined Millwall on loan. 

That's good news. He didn't seem to be getting much of a look in at Sheffield United. Hope he gets a chance at Millwall and can make the most of it.

Edited by mcguffin
typo
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21 minutes ago, ger intae them said:

You’ve been told mcgahey…… lose yer of’s……. not wanted round these parts…..

I will say the same to you as well, don't read my posts. You don't see me bitching about spelling mistakes and grammar to other posters on here. I suspect that certain ppl don't like the points I made regarding scottish youngsters not making it at epl clubs and have pulled me up on using 'should of' instead of should've rather than just discussing the points I made. 

Could you plz change your name as well, it doesn't make sense, use 'into' instead intae. See we can both play this game. 

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