Tartan Chris Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 Weird transfer link in the paper yesterday...Benitez wants to sign Ryan Fraser and will send Ritchie back to Bournemouth plus 15m. Fraser can do way better than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Russell's Lovechild Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 6 hours ago, Tartan Chris said: Weird transfer link in the paper yesterday...Benitez wants to sign Ryan Fraser and will send Ritchie back to Bournemouth plus 15m. Fraser can do way better than that. Richie will get the better move! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanderark14 Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 8 hours ago, Tartan Chris said: Weird transfer link in the paper yesterday...Benitez wants to sign Ryan Fraser and will send Ritchie back to Bournemouth plus 15m. Fraser can do way better than that. Fraser would be mental to accept that move, he’s currently equal top for assists this season in one of Europe’s toughest leagues. His stock has never been so high. He should be aiming for a top six club Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASTA Mick Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 3 hours ago, vanderark14 said: Fraser would be mental to accept that move, he’s currently equal top for assists this season in one of Europe’s toughest leagues. His stock has never been so high. He should be aiming for a top six club I don't think he will move to Newcastle. If Spurs are actually interested, that would be the move. If he can make Wilson look too draw, imagine what he'd do with Kane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third Lanark Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 9 minutes ago, PASTA Mick said: I don't think he will move to Newcastle. If Spurs are actually interested, that would be the move. If he can make Wilson look too draw, imagine what he'd do with Kane. It took me ages to work out that typo! I was thinking 'artist' then I realised - 'top drawer'. Do take more care old chap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamboman Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 Slightly off topic but there was a BBC rumour that Gerrard is going to be looking for more liverpool players to bring on loan...... DANGER! This is not right, and something needs to be done about the amount of players coming to scotland on loan. We are becoming a league to develop players for other countries and clubs and not our own... Maybe this sounds a bit like "make scotland great again" but fook me we need to do something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanderark14 Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 2 hours ago, PASTA Mick said: I don't think he will move to Newcastle. If Spurs are actually interested, that would be the move. If he can make Wilson look too draw, imagine what he'd do with Kane. Agreed. I do think our press should be be doing more to hype players like Fraser up. I honestly believe he is the real deal. He was probably the last attacking player worth going to pittodrie just to watch him. This time next season we could have some established players playing at the top level Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chripper Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 53 minutes ago, jamboman said: Maybe this sounds a bit like "make scotland great again" but fook me we need to do something. It doesn't. The EPL have a homegrown rule and look at their youth international sides. They're winning world cups left, right and center. See? This is yet another idea that we have had and yet the SFA continue to have little ideas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkyBlueScot Posted April 23, 2019 Author Share Posted April 23, 2019 Just seen reports that Hoffenheim are interested in Celtic's Liam Morrison. Doesn't work for everyone (Burke) but it's positive that Bundesliga teams are taking notice of Scottish youngsters. any reports on him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkyBlueScot Posted April 24, 2019 Author Share Posted April 24, 2019 And John Souttar being linked to Derby. If he does go there along with Shinnie (which seems favourite) then there's a large pool of Scots at the top end of the Championship and we should have more Scots in the EPL next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killiefaetheferry Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 Derby now in a play off place. Stranger things ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkyBlueScot Posted April 24, 2019 Author Share Posted April 24, 2019 1 hour ago, killiefaetheferry said: Derby now in a play off place. Stranger things ... I know going up doesn't mean they'll be there next season (as in Douglas' case last season) but Fleck, Cooper, McLean, Phillips, Burke, McGinn, Douglas (again), Rhodes (probably not) and Hutton are all potentially in the Premier League next season. Am i missing anyone? Wonder if the Souttar/Shinnie deals are as likely if Derby are promoted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chripper Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 1 hour ago, SkyBlueScot said: but Fleck, Cooper, McLean, Phillips, Burke, McGinn, Douglas (again), Rhodes That's all fine and good but none of them are particularly good. I'm being kind with that... the unkind version is that all seven of them are hopeless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tartan_McCole Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 16 hours ago, SkyBlueScot said: And John Souttar being linked to Derby. If he does go there along with Shinnie (which seems favourite) then there's a large pool of Scots at the top end of the Championship and we should have more Scots in the EPL next season. Always seems like a good thing, however it just means there is a fair chance they'll get replaced the first chance they can buy a Costa Rican international For £7million with the promotion money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noctonjock Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 21 hours ago, Chripper said: That's all fine and good but none of them are particularly good. I'm being kind with that... the unkind version is that all seven of them are hopeless. Really? I wouldn't say hopeless. Cooper especially is very important to leeds and is also a lot better than 3/4 of our centre backs and Fleck is also a good player who has proved it the last 2 seasons . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chripper Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 7 minutes ago, noctonjock said: Really? I wouldn't say hopeless. Cooper especially is very important to leeds and is also a lot better than 3/4 of our centre backs and Fleck is also a good player who has proved it the last 2 seasons . Honestly, I think "hopeless" is still too kind. All of them are Championship/lower half of the EPL standard players. International level is a couple of notches above, which is why our players struggle even against the poorest of teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 1 hour ago, Chripper said: Honestly, I think "hopeless" is still too kind. All of them are Championship/lower half of the EPL standard players. International level is a couple of notches above, which is why our players struggle even against the poorest of teams. Firstly the guys mentioned by firstbluescot are hardly first team players, they are mostly squad players (bar mcginn)who are only going to fill in when someone is injured. Secondly what is your expectations regarding our squad, it's unlikely that we will ever have 23 or more players like Robertson and mctominay who are at top clubs or a Fraser who could play at a top club. The players mentioned are hardly hopeless but admittedly they are not top level players but they are good players at English championship level. Thirdly international football is not always a high standard, most small countries like ourselves have players that come from the English championship or other second tier leagues across Europe, English championship players do compete at international level and have performed well at international level. Ni and Iceland along with countless other small countries rely on English championship players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chripper Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 2 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said: Firstly the guys mentioned by firstbluescot are hardly first team players, they are mostly squad players (bar mcginn)who are only going to fill in when someone is injured. Secondly what is your expectations regarding our squad, it's unlikely that we will ever have 23 or more players like Robertson and mctominay who are at top clubs or a Fraser who could play at a top club. The players mentioned are hardly hopeless but admittedly they are not top level players but they are good players at English championship level. Thirdly international football is not always a high standard, most small countries like ourselves have players that come from the English championship or other second tier leagues across Europe, English championship players do compete at international level and have performed well at international level. Ni and Iceland along with countless other small countries rely on English championship players. But that's the point, isn't it? The fact that those players are even in our squad speaks volumes of how rotten we are. I wouldn't agree with you, though, Cooper is easily as good as Souttar or McKenna, etc. And Fleck and McLean are pretty much the same standard as McGregor, etc. I kinda agree and kinda not on the third point. It's not always a high standard, it's just a different standard. The fact that so many of our clubs keep getting knocked out at early stages of domestic European competitions is pretty much a signal that our players can't compete with foreign players. They can't even compete against Kazakhstan! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Chripper said: But that's the point, isn't it? The fact that those players are even in our squad speaks volumes of how rotten we are. I wouldn't agree with you, though, Cooper is easily as good as Souttar or McKenna, etc. And Fleck and McLean are pretty much the same standard as McGregor, etc. I kinda agree and kinda not on the third point. It's not always a high standard, it's just a different standard. The fact that so many of our clubs keep getting knocked out at early stages of domestic European competitions is pretty much a signal that our players can't compete with foreign players. They can't even compete against Kazakhstan! It comes back to my point about expectations, most countries of our size and ability have squad players that are from the English championship and are the same standard as fleck or mclean, if you are expecting that to change anytime soon then you will be disappointed to say the least. Also we have had players in our squads from the English second tier for at least 20 years from what I can remember albeit in the last 15 years it has become a far larger share of the squad. The expectation I personally have is that we can field a team of players that are good players in the epl or any of Europe's top leagues and to have a few players who are at top clubs in Europe, eg Robertson and mctominay. I would be very surprised if most of the members on this board expect much more than that and if they do then they are deluding themselves imo. I also believe we are only a few players away from this goal like for instance a couple of top cbs would be needed and a good striker unless we can get Griffith's back. What we are also missing is good management that can make us good enough to qualify for tournaments. Edited April 25, 2019 by mccaughey85 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chripper Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 1 minute ago, mccaughey85 said: It comes back to my point about expectations, most countries of our size and ability have squad players that are from the English championship and are the same standard as fleck or mclean, if you are expecting that to change anytime soon then you will be disappointed to say the least. Also we have had players in our squads from the English second tier for at least 20 years from what I can remember albeit in the last 15 years it has become a far larger share of the squad. The expectation I personally have is that we can field a team of players that are good players in the epl or any of Europe's top leagues and to have a few players who are at top clubs in Europe, eg Robertson and mctominay. I would be very surprised if most of the members on this board expect much more than that and if they do then they are deluding themselves imo. I also believe we are only a few players away from this goal like for instance a couple of top cbs would be needed and a good striker unless we can get Griffith's back. What we are also missing is good management that can make us good enough to qualify for tournaments. Nah. It won't change anytime soon. I don't expect it to ever change, as no one who has any real say in Scottish football wants change. It's me being pragmatic when I call those players useless, because they are. Why dance around the subject. The expectation you personally have is that we can field a team of players that are good players in the epl or any of Europe's top leagues and to have a few players who are at top clubs in Europe, eg Robertson and McTominay? I don't think that's going to happen anytime soon, to be fair. We have how many eligible players in the EPL (apart from Robertson and McTominay)? two or three? And one of them is McDonald.... Ever since I called for the reintroduction of the 3-5-2 in this place I've been soundly mocked, but in reality if we play a system that everyone else plays we will get thrashed. Man United played 3-5-2 against Man City because City are better than them. That pretty much sums it up. Okay, City won (through two goalkeeping errors) but that had nothing to do with the system that United played. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Chripper said: Nah. It won't change anytime soon. I don't expect it to ever change, as no one who has any real say in Scottish football wants change. It's me being pragmatic when I call those players useless, because they are. Why dance around the subject. The expectation you personally have is that we can field a team of players that are good players in the epl or any of Europe's top leagues and to have a few players who are at top clubs in Europe, eg Robertson and McTominay? I don't think that's going to happen anytime soon, to be fair. We have how many eligible players in the EPL (apart from Robertson and McTominay)? two or three? And one of them is McDonald.... Ever since I called for the reintroduction of the 3-5-2 in this place I've been soundly mocked, but in reality if we play a system that everyone else plays we will get thrashed. Man United played 3-5-2 against Man City because City are better than them. That pretty much sums it up. Okay, City won (through two goalkeeping errors) but that had nothing to do with the system that United played. Well i would say the Celtic players mcgregor, Tierney, forrest and griffiths would be good players in the epl, add the epl players of Robertson, Fraser, snodgrass,mctominay and armstrong then you have the basis of a decent team imo. Mcginn is getting rave reviews at villa and will probably be playing epl sometime soon. Another positive is they are all 26 and under bar Griffith's. Imo all that is needed is two epl class cbs and you have a decent side that should qualify for the euros under good management. I think it's just a case that you don't rate most of our players bar one or two. This is understandable but imo the players are not that bad and plenty of countries achieve better results with far worse players, for example ni and Iceland. Edited April 25, 2019 by mccaughey85 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrniaboc Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 3 hours ago, Chripper said: Honestly, I think "hopeless" is still too kind. All of them are Championship/lower half of the EPL standard players. International level is a couple of notches above, which is why our players struggle even against the poorest of teams. There haven't been many Kazakhs in the lower end of the EPL, or even the the upper end of the Championship, recently. In fact, most of their squad play for mid-table Russian clubs. A standard far below that of the English league. To call these lads hopeless is unbelievably negative and misinformed. With the right management and team spirit these guys could perform wonders in a Scotland jersey. Just look at Robson-Kanu at the last Euros for Christ's sake! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chripper Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 23 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said: Well i would say the Celtic players mcgregor, Tierney, forrest and griffiths would be good players in the epl, add the epl players of Robertson, Fraser, snodgrass,mctominay and armstrong then you have the basis of a decent team imo. Mcginn is getting rave reviews at villa and will probably be playing epl sometime soon. Another positive is they are all 26 and under bar Griffith's. Imo all that is needed is two epl class cbs and you have a decent side that should qualify for the euros under good management. I think it's just a case that you don't rate most of our players bar one or two. This is understandable but imo the players are not that bad and plenty of countries achieve better results with far worse players, for example ni and Iceland. Errrrr… that's what we said about Armstrong, and he's struggling. But yes, the EPL isn't an incredible league where only the strongest survive. Look at McArthur and Arfield, those two did well in the EPL. But yes, I would imagine that McGregor, Griffiths and Forrest would be with an EPL team like Burnley. The only player out of those Celtic players that would do well with a top 6 team is Tierney. The others would be treading water. Errr…. If Armstrong can't break into a pretty poor Southampton team then I don't think we should pin our hopes on him. Snodgrass is pretty much retired. McGinn getting rave reviews in the Championship is akin to a player getting rave reviews in the SPL. It means nothing. And yes, an EPL team will probably buy him for £15m (Probably a team like Burnley), but that just goes to show how crazy English football is. No. They are that bad. The struggled against the worst ranked international team on planet Earth. People can blame McLeish all they like, but the fact is that the players are the ones who froze against Kazakhstan and the players are the ones who looked the equal of the worst team on Earth. 13 minutes ago, mrniaboc said: There haven't been many Kazakhs in the lower end of the EPL, or even the the upper end of the Championship, recently. In fact, most of their squad play for mid-table Russian clubs. A standard far below that of the English league. To call these lads hopeless is unbelievably negative and misinformed. With the right management and team spirit these guys could perform wonders in a Scotland jersey. Just look at Robson-Kanu at the last Euros for Christ's sake! Which just goes to show how bad our players are, and how over-rated English football is (barring the top 6 of the EPL) In order to shape our team we must scrap the 4 at the back system. It's too open and we don't have the central defenders for it. In other worse, we have to pack the defence and condense the middle of the park. We have to be hard to beat and that can only be done by playing with a 3/5 defence. The tagline of "our players are comfortable with four at the back as they play it every week" got obliterated when Kazakhstan pulverized us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daviebee Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 1 hour ago, Chripper said: Errrrr… that's what we said about Armstrong, and he's struggling. But yes, the EPL isn't an incredible league where only the strongest survive. Look at McArthur and Arfield, those two did well in the EPL. But yes, I would imagine that McGregor, Griffiths and Forrest would be with an EPL team like Burnley. The only player out of those Celtic players that would do well with a top 6 team is Tierney. The others would be treading water. Errr…. If Armstrong can't break into a pretty poor Southampton team then I don't think we should pin our hopes on him. Snodgrass is pretty much retired. McGinn getting rave reviews in the Championship is akin to a player getting rave reviews in the SPL. It means nothing. And yes, an EPL team will probably buy him for £15m (Probably a team like Burnley), but that just goes to show how crazy English football is. No. They are that bad. The struggled against the worst ranked international team on planet Earth. People can blame McLeish all they like, but the fact is that the players are the ones who froze against Kazakhstan and the players are the ones who looked the equal of the worst team on Earth. Which just goes to show how bad our players are, and how over-rated English football is (barring the top 6 of the EPL) In order to shape our team we must scrap the 4 at the back system. It's too open and we don't have the central defenders for it. In other worse, we have to pack the defence and condense the middle of the park. We have to be hard to beat and that can only be done by playing with a 3/5 defence. The tagline of "our players are comfortable with four at the back as they play it every week" got obliterated when Kazakhstan pulverized us. And we played 3/5 at the back against Israel and got fkin humped as well! 2-1 going on 6 or 7 FFS. I wonder what the common factor was? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chripper Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, daviebee said: And we played 3/5 at the back against Israel and got fkin humped as well! 2-1 going on 6 or 7 FFS. I wonder what the common factor was? So, you're citing one match over a period of 18 years? How about when we almost beat England? We've been playing with 4 at the back continuously for 18 years. We've played with 3 at the back for what, five matches in that period? I don't think it's fair to bring up one match, as I could mention 18 years worth of embarrassment. If we had played with a 3/5 at the back for two or three year and we were still hopeless at it, then fine, but we haven't given it a consistent chance. Edited April 25, 2019 by Chripper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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