Happy Royal Wedding Day Fellow Plebs

[Kimba]

If someone has trusted in the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ as the full payment for their sins ALONE without adding anything of their own, then they are saved.   I hope that is what Scotty believes.  That is all.

[DonnyTJS]

4 hours ago, Kimba said:

FAO Donny:

Another one to check out:

New International Version
How you have fallen from heaven, morning star, son of the dawn! You have been cast down to the earth, you who once laid low the nations!

King James Bible
How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

 

And?

Modern translations go back to the original Hebrew and give a more accurate rendering of the word Hêlêl than the King James translators who followed the Latin Vulgate here. It's odd that you should prefer to follow Roman Catholic tradition than the purity of the original text ... actually it's not.

[DonnyTJS]

9 hours ago, Kimba said:

http://www.av1611.org/biblevs.html

List of some deleted verses.   

 

Have you looked into any of these? The first substantive one is interesting in the present context (Matt. 17:21) because the verse that many versions have not included has Jesus stating that works, not faith, are required for the casting out of a particular evil spirit. The reason it doesn't appear in those versions is that it appears to have been lifted from the parallel context in Mark and in the context of Matthew it creates a contradiction. Also, it doesn't appear in some copies of the source text. Like all bibliographical work, choices have to be made.

The next one I looked at (Luke 17:36) is an example of the KJV adding to the original copy where this verse does not appear. Therefore they lifted it from the parallel passage in Matthew where it does. Versions that exclude this text in Luke are simply staying true to their Greek copy text.

The rest will all be similar. Improved translations of the original texts.

[Scotty CTA]

57 minutes ago, Kimba said:

If someone has trusted in the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ as the full payment for their sins ALONE without adding anything of their own, then they are saved.   I hope that is what Scotty believes.  That is all.

It's all I've ever believed.

I know that I can't earn my salvation (my goodness).

All I've ever tried to tell you is how I know that I have truly accepted the free gift.

I'm not a 'goat' who thinks he's a 'sheep'.

I'm a sheep that knows he's a sheep. 

[Kimba]

15 hours ago, Scotty CTA said:

It's all I've ever believed.

I know that I can't earn my salvation (my goodness).

All I've ever tried to tell you is how I know that I have truly accepted the free gift.

I'm not a 'goat' who thinks he's a 'sheep'.

I'm a sheep that knows he's a sheep. 

Good! Then you won't be pointing to your good deeds/obedience (as in something you did) as proof you are saved anymore.      Awesome.

I won't be answering Donny as I can see all he is interested in doing is trashing God's Word and wanting a fleshly argument instead of genuinely truth seeking - nothing new there though. And if he did that he would see that bible perversions deliberately delete the deity of Christ and the Godhead and twist much more in order to get people to try to earn their salvation.  They also hide the mystery.  Satan doesn't want people to know right division as it keeps them in confusion and their Bible won't make sense and appear contradictory.

 

1 Thessalonians 2:13 For this cause also thank we God without ceasing, because, when ye received the word of God which ye heard of us, ye received it not as the word of men, but as it is in truth, the word of God, which effectually worketh also in you that believe.

Ephesians 3:9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

 

Edited May 25, 2018 by Kimba

[Kimba]

bro' Rodney

 

[Eisegerwind]

18 hours ago, Scotty CTA said:

It's all I've ever believed.

I know that I can't earn my salvation (my goodness).

All I've ever tried to tell you is how I know that I have truly accepted the free gift.

I'm not a 'goat' who thinks he's a 'sheep'.

I'm a sheep that knows he's a sheep. 

Yeah, all very good, how do you know your not a giraffe that thinks she's a Mettalic blue Mercedes biturbo.

[Scotty CTA]

7 hours ago, Kimba said:

Good! Then you won't be pointing to your good deeds/obedience (as in something you did) as proof you are saved anymore.      Awesome.

I never (knowingly) did, though.

(I don't recall using the word 'proof' either).

My 'walk' is evidence/an indication/points to my 'new life'.

And the only reason that the old life is gone is because I accepted the Gospel.

3 hours ago, Eisegerwind said:

Yeah, all very good, how do you know your not a giraffe that thinks she's a Mettalic blue Mercedes biturbo.

Because you are either a 'sheep' or a 'goat' on Judgement Day.

Matthew 25:31-46 English Standard Version (ESV)

The Final Judgment

³¹ “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. ³² Before Him will be gathered all the nations, and He will separate people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. ³³ And He will place the sheep on His right, but the goats on the left. 34. Then the King will say to those on His right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. 35. For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me, 36. I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.’ 37. Then the righteous will answer him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink? 38. And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you?  39. And when did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?’ 40. And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.’

41. “Then He will say to those on His left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42. For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink, 43. I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not clothe me, sick and in prison and you did not visit me.’ 44. Then they also will answer, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to you?’ 45. Then he will answer them, saying, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’  46. And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

[Eisegerwind]

6 hours ago, Scotty CTA said:

I never (knowingly) did, though.

(I don't recall using the word 'proof' either).

My 'walk' is evidence/an indication/points to my 'new life'.

And the only reason that the old life is gone is because I accepted the Gospel.

Because you are either a 'sheep' or a 'goat' on Judgement Day.

Matthew 25:31-46 English Standard Version (ESV)

The Final Judgment

³¹ “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. ³² Before Him will be gathered all the nations, and He will separate people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. ³³ And He will place the sheep on His right, but the goats on the left. 34. Then the King will say to those on His right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. 35. For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me, 36. I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.’ 37. Then the righteous will answer him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink? 38. And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you?  39. And when did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?’ 40. And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.’

41. “Then He will say to those on His left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42. For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink, 43. I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not clothe me, sick and in prison and you did not visit me.’ 44. Then they also will answer, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to you?’ 45. Then he will answer them, saying, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’  46. And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

Ah OK. I must've missed the final judgement I've not had my result yet, how did you get yours. Was it an email or did it come through the post.

[Kimba]

18 hours ago, Scotty CTA said:

I never (knowingly) did, though.

(I don't recall using the word 'proof' either).

My 'walk' is evidence/an indication/points to my 'new life'.

And the only reason that the old life is gone is because I accepted the Gospel.

Because you are either a 'sheep' or a 'goat' on Judgement Day.

Matthew 25:31-46 English Standard Version (ESV)

The Final Judgment

³¹ “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. ³² Before Him will be gathered all the nations, and He will separate people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. ³³ And He will place the sheep on His right, but the goats on the left. 34. Then the King will say to those on His right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. 35. For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me, 36. I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.’ 37. Then the righteous will answer him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink? 38. And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you?  39. And when did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?’ 40. And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.’

41. “Then He will say to those on His left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42. For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink, 43. I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not clothe me, sick and in prison and you did not visit me.’ 44. Then they also will answer, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to you?’ 45. Then he will answer them, saying, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’  46. And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

Ehm, we're at the Judgement seat of Christ.  We're not sheep or goats -  that's Israel.  Again, non right division will have you in all sorts of problems.

That's why you believe faith has to have works to back it up - you're in the wrong program - Israel's instead of the body of Christ mystery program. That's why most of Christendom is in apostasy.

I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” – Matt 15:24

 

 

 

Edited May 26, 2018 by Kimba

[Kimba]

The Bible is filled with language that pictures God’s people as sheep and the LORD as their shepherd. This is the most famous. 

“The LORD is my shepherd; I shall not want. He maketh me to lie down in green pastures: he leadeth me beside the still waters.” – Psalm 23:1-2

But are you a lost sheep? The answer may surprise you. 

A careful study of the many sheep and shepherd passages will reveal that the sheep metaphor in scripture refers to God’s nation of Israel. 

When God led Israel out of Egypt by Moses, they became his sheep that he led to find water and food in the wilderness. 

“Thou leddest thy people like a flock by the hand of Moses and Aaron.” – Psalm 77:20

“But made his own people to go forth like sheep, and guided them in the wilderness like a flock.”
– Psalm 78:52

It was the shepherd’s responsibility to physically provide and protect the sheep until he led them into their promised land. If the sheep of Israel separated themselves from God or the land he gave them, they were considered lost. 

The Egyptians were not the lost sheep. They were enemies to God’s flock. 

Jesus came when Israel had spiritually departed from the Lord, and many were scattered throughout the ancient world. Jesus came as Israel’s good shepherd when he said:

“I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.” – John 10:11

Israel was lost, but they had always been God’s sheep. Jesus came to gather them together and bring in greener pastures (the kingdom).

When Jesus came he knew there would be wolves among the sheep. False teachers and unbelieving rulers were not lost sheep, they were “ravening wolves” (Matt 7:15). It was the believing remnant of Israel that Jesus gave the name “little flock” in Luke 12:32. 

We know that Jesus was not sent to minister to Gentiles from his statements in Matthew:

“Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not” – Matthew 10:5

“I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” – Matt 15:24

Gentiles are not lost sheep. Only Israel could be lost sheep. They were found if they heard the voice of the shepherd King: Christ Jesus. 

Gentiles were never promised a land of green pastures. Gentiles were never promised physical protection and blessing. Gentiles are at home all over the world, and do not need to be gathered into one place like sheep. 

We are Body Members not Sheep

Likewise, Paul never calls the new creature, the church, which is the Body of Christ, sheep, nor does he refer to Christ as our Shepherd. 

Today, in this dispensation of grace, where Israel is fallen, there is not a single lost person in the Body of Christ. The only way to be lost today is if you do not know the gospel that saves. If you are not saved, you are not a member of the one Body of Christ. 

“But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost” – 2 Corinthians 4:3

If you are saved you are not lost. If you are a member of the Body of Christ, you are not a sheep. The lost sheep were a specific people in the Bible: Israel. Israel’s shepherd was their Messiah. 

We in the church are called soldiers, ambassadors, athletes, warriors, and builders. All of these are sent out to build, win, fight, and represent according to God’s already provided instructions. 

The lost sheep of Israel waits for their shepherd to return for them to receive their promises. We do not need a shepherd, nor our Head to be present for us to be who God made us. Israel will never be who God made them until they are led into their kingdom by their Shepherd.

We are already members of Christ’s Body. Our Head is in heaven, but we are in His Body already. 

When the church sees itself as sheep, then it is perceived as the helpless victims of persecution and affliction waiting for a Shepherd. When the church takes its rightful identity as members of Christ’s body, then we become more than conquerors now in all things through Christ (Rom 8:34-39).

http://graceambassadors.com/midacts/are-you-a-lost-sheep

[bonzo]

@Kimba could you no just gie us a wee joke? Its Saturday night. 

[Kimba]

The Judgement Seat of Christ happens after the catching away of the Body of Christ.  Then God goes back to dealing with Israel.  

 

The scripture you quoted Scotty is the white throne judgment at the end.  Because you don't rightly divide between mystery and prophecy you think the rapture and the return of Christ are the same thing.  They're not - the catching away was part of the mystery never revealed before Paul.  You won't find scripture pertaining to the rapture in the gospels - it's talking about Christ returning for the millennial reign.

1Cor 3:12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.

15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

[Kimba]

7 minutes ago, bonzo said:

@Kimba could you no just gie us a wee joke? Its Saturday night. 

ok quick one for you!

A tour bus driver is driving with a bus load of seniors down a highway when he is tapped on his shoulder by a little old lady. She offers him a handful of peanuts, which he gratefully munches up.
After about 15 minutes, she taps him on his shoulder again and she hands him another handful of peanuts.
She repeats this gesture about five more times. When she is about to hand him another batch again he asks the little old lady, 'Why don't you eat the peanuts yourself?' 'We can't chew them because we've no teeth', she replied.
The puzzled driver asks, 'Why do you buy them then?'
The old lady replied, 'We just love the chocolate around them.'

[bonzo]

6 minutes ago, Kimba said:

ok quick one for you!

A tour bus driver is driving with a bus load of seniors down a highway when he is tapped on his shoulder by a little old lady. She offers him a handful of peanuts, which he gratefully munches up.
After about 15 minutes, she taps him on his shoulder again and she hands him another handful of peanuts.
She repeats this gesture about five more times. When she is about to hand him another batch again he asks the little old lady, 'Why don't you eat the peanuts yourself?' 'We can't chew them because we've no teeth', she replied.
The puzzled driver asks, 'Why do you buy them then?'
The old lady replied, 'We just love the chocolate around them.'

Hahaha, thank you. 

[Scotty CTA]

2 hours ago, Kimba said:

Ehm, we're at the Judgement seat of Christ.  We're not sheep or goats -  that's Israel.  Again, non right division will have you in all sorts of problems.

That's why you believe faith has to have works to back it up - you're in the wrong program - Israel's instead of the body of Christ mystery program. That's why most of Christendom is in apostasy.

I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” – Matt 15:24

No, I still don't believe that.

1 hour ago, Kimba said:

The Judgement Seat of Christ happens after the catching away of the Body of Christ.  Then God goes back to dealing with Israel.  

 

The scripture you quoted Scotty is the white throne judgment at the end.  Because you don't rightly divide between mystery and prophecy you think the rapture and the return of Christ are the same thing.  They're not - the catching away was part of the mystery never revealed before Paul.  You won't find scripture pertaining to the rapture in the gospels - it's talking about Christ returning for the millennial reign.

1Cor 3:12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.

15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

Incorrect.

I've posted many times that they are not.

[Kimba]

9 minutes ago, Scotty CTA said:

No, I still don't believe that.

Incorrect.

I've posted many times that they are not.

Why did you post it was above then?  You think you're one of the sheep.   Fairly plain in scripture (as per article as well) Israel are the sheep - not the Body of Christ.

Edited May 26, 2018 by Kimba

[Kimba]

 

 

 

[Kimba]

http://graceambassadors.com/interactive-chart

 

[Scotty CTA]

4 minutes ago, Kimba said:

Why did you post it was above then?

Because a person can still do works without believing that it will add anything to their salvation. 

[Kimba]

1 minute ago, Scotty CTA said:

Because a person can still do works without believing that it will add anything to their salvation. 

But we get saved after believing the gospel.  Not a future Salvation.   You think you're a sheep - that's Israel - it's they're salvation that's future - that's why they have to "endure to the end".  The scripture you quoted has nothing to do with the Body of Christ.

[Scotty CTA]

2 hours ago, Kimba said:

The Bible is filled with language that pictures God’s people as sheep and the LORD as their shepherd. This is the most famous. 

“The LORD is my shepherd; I shall not want. He maketh me to lie down in green pastures: he leadeth me beside the still waters.” – Psalm 23:1-2

But are you a lost sheep? The answer may surprise you. 

A careful study of the many sheep and shepherd passages will reveal that the sheep metaphor in scripture refers to God’s nation of Israel. 

When God led Israel out of Egypt by Moses, they became his sheep that he led to find water and food in the wilderness. 

“Thou leddest thy people like a flock by the hand of Moses and Aaron.” – Psalm 77:20

“But made his own people to go forth like sheep, and guided them in the wilderness like a flock.”
– Psalm 78:52

It was the shepherd’s responsibility to physically provide and protect the sheep until he led them into their promised land. If the sheep of Israel separated themselves from God or the land he gave them, they were considered lost. 

The Egyptians were not the lost sheep. They were enemies to God’s flock. 

Jesus came when Israel had spiritually departed from the Lord, and many were scattered throughout the ancient world. Jesus came as Israel’s good shepherd when he said:

“I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.” – John 10:11

Israel was lost, but they had always been God’s sheep. Jesus came to gather them together and bring in greener pastures (the kingdom).

When Jesus came he knew there would be wolves among the sheep. False teachers and unbelieving rulers were not lost sheep, they were “ravening wolves” (Matt 7:15). It was the believing remnant of Israel that Jesus gave the name “little flock” in Luke 12:32. 

We know that Jesus was not sent to minister to Gentiles from his statements in Matthew:

“Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not” – Matthew 10:5

“I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” – Matt 15:24

Gentiles are not lost sheep. Only Israel could be lost sheep. They were found if they heard the voice of the shepherd King: Christ Jesus. 

Gentiles were never promised a land of green pastures. Gentiles were never promised physical protection and blessing. Gentiles are at home all over the world, and do not need to be gathered into one place like sheep. 

We are Body Members not Sheep

Likewise, Paul never calls the new creature, the church, which is the Body of Christ, sheep, nor does he refer to Christ as our Shepherd. 

Today, in this dispensation of grace, where Israel is fallen, there is not a single lost person in the Body of Christ. The only way to be lost today is if you do not know the gospel that saves. If you are not saved, you are not a member of the one Body of Christ. 

“But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost” – 2 Corinthians 4:3

If you are saved you are not lost. If you are a member of the Body of Christ, you are not a sheep. The lost sheep were a specific people in the Bible: Israel. Israel’s shepherd was their Messiah. 

We in the church are called soldiers, ambassadors, athletes, warriors, and builders. All of these are sent out to build, win, fight, and represent according to God’s already provided instructions. 

The lost sheep of Israel waits for their shepherd to return for them to receive their promises. We do not need a shepherd, nor our Head to be present for us to be who God made us. Israel will never be who God made them until they are led into their kingdom by their Shepherd.

We are already members of Christ’s Body. Our Head is in heaven, but we are in His Body already. 

When the church sees itself as sheep, then it is perceived as the helpless victims of persecution and affliction waiting for a Shepherd. When the church takes its rightful identity as members of Christ’s body, then we become more than conquerors now in all things through Christ (Rom 8:34-39).

http://graceambassadors.com/midacts/are-you-a-lost-sheep

I'm not following you.

Why are the only sheep you are talking about 'lost sheep'?

Why can't I be a saved sheep?

[Kimba]

Just now, Scotty CTA said:

I'm not following you.

Why are the only sheep you are talking about 'lost sheep'?

Why can't I be a saved sheep?

Where does God's word say you're a "saved sheep"?    

Why are you wanting to take what is for Israel and not the Body of Christ?  It's the wrong program.  

 

[Scotty CTA]

1 minute ago, Kimba said:

But we get saved after believing the gospel.  Not a future Salvation.   You think you're a sheep - that's Israel - it's they're salvation that's future - that's why they have to "endure to the end".  The scripture you quoted has nothing to do with the Body of Christ.

I thought that you said that Israel are the lost sheep.

(I'm not lost. Why can't I still be a sheep?)

[Scotty CTA]

Just now, Kimba said:

Where does God's word say you're a "saved sheep"?    

Why are you wanting to take what is for Israel and not the Body of Christ?  It's the wrong program.  

It doesn't.

It says 'sheep'.