Yes, The Blood, It Is My Victory

[Scotty CTA]

1 hour ago, Kimba said:

Mm, no...

Then take it up with God.

(This will be my only reply to you as you are unnecessarily making this hard work.)

Firstly, did you see the word 'and' in Romans 10:9?

"because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord AND believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved."

It doesn't say 'OR'... it says 'AND'.

You respond as if I or that scripture is saying that salvation is granted to anyone who just says 'abracadabra' which not only unnecessarily muddies the waters for the uninitiated, but it's clearly and visibly not true on this very screen.

Now let me ask you... 

Would someone who 'believed in their heart' deny Jesus to others because they were embarrassed or ashamed of Him? The answer is 'no'.

Would someone who 'believed in their heart' deny Jesus because they didn't want to be mocked and scoffed at? The answer is 'no'.

Would someone who 'believed in their heart' deny Jesus because they didn't want to be beaten/have physical harm come to them? The answer is 'no'.

Would someone who 'believed in their heart' deny Jesus to avoid imprisonment? The answer is 'no'.

Now, here's where the rubber hits the road...

Would someone who 'believed in their heart' deny Jesus in order to save their own life? Again, the answer is 'no'.

I assume that you're aware that more Christians (something like 2/3 of 70 million) have died for their faith in the past 100 years than in the past 2,000 years?

Yes, a Jew confessing Jesus was a death sentence in Paul's time, but you have to understand that the Bible is right up to date...

21 Coptic Christians Beheaded by ISIS Honored for Refusing to Deny Christ

So, are you telling me that you know for certain that you'll live out your life never having to confess with your mouth in any way, shape, or form (what is in your heart) 'that Jesus is Lord' like the Jews in Paul's time?

We're not trying to thread a needle here. We're shining a light on Jesus, 'the narrow gate', and Jesus said in John 6:37 "All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out."

1 hour ago, Kimba said:

NO WORKS - EVER - FREE GIFT.

Correct, however you've gone down some strange rabbit hole where you believe that any outward expression of inner repentance is 'works' instead of evidence of 'change'.

Example... My public baptism by emersion at age 48 was an outward expression of an inward change, but I know that I wasn't saved by it. (My goodness.)

 

 

 

[Scotty CTA]

"but whoever denies Me before men, I also will deny before my Father Who is in heaven." Matthew 10:33

 

So, who would deny Jesus before men? The bold unsaved deniers and those not truly saved? Correct.

Now, who would confess Jesus at the penalty of death? Those who already believe in their hearts? Correct.

Would it be safe to say that only an already saved person would confess Jesus even if it meant death? Yes... yes it would. 

[iainmac1]

9 hours ago, Scotty CTA said:

assume that you're aware that more Christians (something like 2/3 of 70 million) have died for their faith in the past 100 years than in the past 2,000 years?

2 thirds? You are saying that around 47 million Christians have died for their faith in the last century? Do you have any proof of this?

[Scotty CTA]

I've read it in a few different places.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2002/jun/04/religion.booksnews

[Larky Masher]

2 hours ago, Scotty CTA said:

I've read it in a few different places.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2002/jun/04/religion.booksnews

That's a robust, peer reviewed source, you couldn't argue with that.

[Ormond]

5 hours ago, Larky Masher said:

That's a robust, peer reviewed source, you couldn't argue with that.

[Scotty CTA]

5 hours ago, Larky Masher said:

That's a robust, peer reviewed source, you couldn't argue with that.

Then do your own research and give everyone the 'real' numbers.

(Bet you won't.)

[Larky Masher]

55 minutes ago, Scotty CTA said:

Then do your own research and give everyone the 'real' numbers.

(Bet you won't.)

I don't need to do any research as I know crackpot pseudo-science when I see it and as it states in the first line of link to the "source" you posted "A new book which claims that Christians are the victims of worldwide persecution has stirred controversy in Italy amid accusations that it minimises the Holocaust and demonises Islam."

 

[Scotty CTA]

3 hours ago, Larky Masher said:

I don't need to do any research...

Then how would you have any idea of the real numbers?

Keep in mind that the countries that did/are doing the most prosecution are either communist (North Korea, China, the U.S.S.R. etc.) or heavily Islamic (Somalia, Pakistan, Sudan, Uganda, Nigeria, etc.).

 

[Scotty CTA]

3 hours ago, Larky Masher said:

...as I know crackpot pseudo-science when I see it...

So you're a flat earther now?

3 hours ago, Larky Masher said:

A new book which claims that Christians are the victims of worldwide persecution has stirred controversy in Italy amid accusations that it minimises the Holocaust...

Does stating that Stalin was ultimately responsible for 20-25 million victims 'minimise' the holocaust (or are we forbidden from quoting any numbers over 6 million?)

3 hours ago, Larky Masher said:

...and demonises Islam."

Yeah, wouldn't want to demonise the fine upstanding citizens in ISIS. 

[Larky Masher]

1 hour ago, Scotty CTA said:

Then how would you have any idea of the real numbers?

Keep in mind that the countries that did/are doing the most prosecution are either communist (North Korea, China, the U.S.S.R. etc.) or heavily Islamic (Somalia, Pakistan, Sudan, Uganda, Nigeria, etc.).

 

How do you have any idea?

[Larky Masher]

57 minutes ago, Scotty CTA said:

So you're a flat earther now?

Does stating that Stalin was ultimately responsible for 20-25 million victims 'minimise' the holocaust (or are we forbidden from quoting any numbers over 6 million?)

Yeah, wouldn't want to demonise the fine upstanding citizens in ISIS. 

Not sure where you're going with the first point

So Stalin killed just on the basis of religion?

The 6 million comment and equating ISIS with Islam are rather distasteful.

[Kimba]

On April 1, 2018 at 4:50 PM, Scotty CTA said:

Then take it up with God.

(This will be my only reply to you as you are unnecessarily making this hard work.)

Firstly, did you see the word 'and' in Romans 10:9?

"because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord AND believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved."

It doesn't say 'OR'... it says 'AND'.

You respond as if I or that scripture is saying that salvation is granted to anyone who just says 'abracadabra' which not only unnecessarily muddies the waters for the uninitiated, but it's clearly and visibly not true on this very screen.

Now let me ask you... 

Would someone who 'believed in their heart' deny Jesus to others because they were embarrassed or ashamed of Him? The answer is 'no'.

Would someone who 'believed in their heart' deny Jesus because they didn't want to be mocked and scoffed at? The answer is 'no'.

Would someone who 'believed in their heart' deny Jesus because they didn't want to be beaten/have physical harm come to them? The answer is 'no'.

Would someone who 'believed in their heart' deny Jesus to avoid imprisonment? The answer is 'no'.

Now, here's where the rubber hits the road...

Would someone who 'believed in their heart' deny Jesus in order to save their own life? Again, the answer is 'no'.

I assume that you're aware that more Christians (something like 2/3 of 70 million) have died for their faith in the past 100 years than in the past 2,000 years?

Yes, a Jew confessing Jesus was a death sentence in Paul's time, but you have to understand that the Bible is right up to date...

21 Coptic Christians Beheaded by ISIS Honored for Refusing to Deny Christ

So, are you telling me that you know for certain that you'll live out your life never having to confess with your mouth in any way, shape, or form (what is in your heart) 'that Jesus is Lord' like the Jews in Paul's time?

We're not trying to thread a needle here. We're shining a light on Jesus, 'the narrow gate', and Jesus said in John 6:37 "All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out."

Correct, however you've gone down some strange rabbit hole where you believe that any outward expression of inner repentance is 'works' instead of evidence of 'change'.

Example... My public baptism by emersion at age 48 was an outward expression of an inward change, but I know that I wasn't saved by it. (My goodness.)

 

 

 

It's very unfortunate Scotty, but you being a Bible blender mixing prophecy and mystery (and not knowning the difference) means that you've added works to salvation - and are trusting in them, which is NO salvation.  This is commonly known as the Lordship Salvation heresy.   If you keep Bible blending and don't rightly divide you will get yourself into all sorts of problems.

It is sad to see your haughty, modern day pharisee attitude that somehow you've done something more than others to be worthy of salvation (which you haven't)

My advice is to stop listening to false teachers and learn right division in this dispensation of grace.   The DOCTRINE for this dispensation is in Romans through Philemon - given to Paul by the ascended Lord Jesus Christ.   There is no water baptism or confessing sins in this dispensation, otherwise you've made Christ of no effect.  Oh, no tithing either.   Sorry.

http://graceambassadors.com/salvation/is-faith-without-works-dead

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 3, 2018 by Kimba

[Kimba]

On April 1, 2018 at 5:10 PM, Scotty CTA said:

"but whoever denies Me before men, I also will deny before my Father Who is in heaven." Matthew 10:33

 

So, who would deny Jesus before men? The bold unsaved deniers and those not truly saved? Correct.

Now, who would confess Jesus at the penalty of death? Those who already believe in their hearts? Correct.

Would it be safe to say that only an already saved person would confess Jesus even if it meant death? Yes... yes it would. 

You see there you are going back to the gospels quoting Jesus in his EARTHLY ministry to Israel and completely ignoring that Paul says we don't know Christ after the flesh now and ignoring the revelation of the mystery doctrines.

I know you believe you can lose your salvation as well.  So, basically Im afraid, you've got it pretty badly wrong and now have developed a pharisee attitude that your works prove your salvation, when they don't.   Very sad. 

[Kimba]

http://graceambassadors.com/mystery/paul/christ-sent-you-a-special-apostle-why-wont-you-listen

 

Religious people won't listen because they believe something they've done merits salvation.  WRONG.

[Huddersfield]

[Kimba]

http://graceambassadors.com/salvation/how-do-i-know-i-am-saved

 

The gospel is what saves.   False gospels that add works will keep you LOST.

Eph 1:13 

13 In whom ye also TRUSTED, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

HIS GLORY, Scotty, not yours.

 

[Kimba]

 

Ray Comfort, Paul Washer, John MacArthur, Pat Robertson, Kirk Cameron and countless other false prophets like them who teach the damnable heresy of Lordship Salvation.   Those are the false teachers you listen to Scotty. WOLVES.

[Kimba]

God’s Word clearly states that salvation is by Grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone.

Ephesians 2:8-9: [8] For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: [9] Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Lordship “salvation” (LS) is the unsupportable and unbiblical belief that the PERFORMANCE of good works, the PROMISE of good works, or the EVIDENCE of good works MUST accompany faith in Christ in order to establish, or provide evidence, that such faith has resulted in eternal life.

LS can be overt (one must forsake all of his sins and follow Christ in obedience and discipleship in order to be saved) or VERY SUBTLE (one’s behavior willchange once he is saved, one must desire to get better in order to be saved, one must want to have a relationship with Jesus in order to be saved, or one must go beyond mere intellectual assent and actively respond –  do something (such as Rahab opening the door to spies, or Abraham offering Isaac on the altar) in response to God’s message in order to be saved).

Nowhere in the Bible does it say that any of these man-made conditions are necessary for one to receive eternal life. And yet, such things are taught by many churches, ministries, and pastors throughout professing Christendom.

We expose the people who promote LS, because they:

• Keep people lost (  2 Corinthians 4:4);

 

• Are accursed (Galatians 1:9);

 

• Frustrate grace (Galatians 2:21);

 

• Bewitch believers, rendering the believers ineffective in their Christian lives (Galatians 5:4); and

 

• Are to be marked and avoided (Romans 16:17 and 16:18)

In addition to the above, LS causes people to focus on themselves, rather than on Christ, for assurance of salvation.

We cannot know whether or not someone influenced by LS is saved. In some cases, they may have never even heard the Gospel presented clearly, and may have never believed in Jesus as their Savior. In other cases, they may have believed in Jesus as their Savior, but have received bad teaching that causes them ongoing confusion. We cannot tell which is which. But, in any case, they need our prayers and they need a clear presentation of the gospel.

One wonders why so many thousands of seeking souls flock to the false message of LS.  Could it be a cultic draw by charismatic personalities who manipulate scripture, relish the attention, fame and (incidentally) the dollars cleverly conned from their followers?

Or, could it be that they walk into the nearest church, and they are sold a false LS gospel?  After all, people naturally want to trust authority figures.  In either case, the person who is fed false LS teaching is being steered away from the truth.

Although this list is by no means complete, following are some of the terms that are associated with Lordship salvation as being requirements for receiving eternal life:

“Repent of your sins”
“Turn from your sins”
“Be willing to turn from your sins”
“Put Christ on the throne of your life”
“Give your life to Christ”
“Commit to follow Christ”

Some proponents of Lordship salvation will allow that salvation is by Grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone, but then will insist that a saved person will show signs of being saved, such as sinning less and doing good works. If these “signs” are not present, they will insist, or at least heavily suspect, that a person has never believed in Christ as Savior.

This thought process can never lead to assurance of salvation, because it is always dependent on how one thinks he is DOING at any given point in time (we put DOING in all caps, because it is a work).  Other folks think that God knows whether or not they are TRYING (we put TRYING in all caps, because it is a work).  Trying will not help you attain eternal life.  Eternal life is a free gift, received when someone trusts in Christ alone for it.

 

That's you Scotty.  Not once have I seen you preaching the gospel of Grace on here.  Never.

 

[Eisegerwind]

23 minutes ago, Kimba said:

God’s Word clearly states that salvation is by Grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone.

Ephesians 2:8-9: [8] For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: [9] Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Lordship “salvation” (LS) is the unsupportable and unbiblical belief that the PERFORMANCE of good works, the PROMISE of good works, or the EVIDENCE of good works MUST accompany faith in Christ in order to establish, or provide evidence, that such faith has resulted in eternal life.

LS can be overt (one must forsake all of his sins and follow Christ in obedience and discipleship in order to be saved) or VERY SUBTLE (one’s behavior willchange once he is saved, one must desire to get better in order to be saved, one must want to have a relationship with Jesus in order to be saved, or one must go beyond mere intellectual assent and actively respond –  do something (such as Rahab opening the door to spies, or Abraham offering Isaac on the altar) in response to God’s message in order to be saved).

Nowhere in the Bible does it say that any of these man-made conditions are necessary for one to receive eternal life. And yet, such things are taught by many churches, ministries, and pastors throughout professing Christendom.

We expose the people who promote LS, because they:

• Keep people lost (  2 Corinthians 4:4);

 

• Are accursed (Galatians 1:9);

 

• Frustrate grace (Galatians 2:21);

 

• Bewitch believers, rendering the believers ineffective in their Christian lives (Galatians 5:4); and

 

• Are to be marked and avoided (Romans 16:17 and 16:18)

In addition to the above, LS causes people to focus on themselves, rather than on Christ, for assurance of salvation.

We cannot know whether or not someone influenced by LS is saved. In some cases, they may have never even heard the Gospel presented clearly, and may have never believed in Jesus as their Savior. In other cases, they may have believed in Jesus as their Savior, but have received bad teaching that causes them ongoing confusion. We cannot tell which is which. But, in any case, they need our prayers and they need a clear presentation of the gospel.

One wonders why so many thousands of seeking souls flock to the false message of LS.  Could it be a cultic draw by charismatic personalities who manipulate scripture, relish the attention, fame and (incidentally) the dollars cleverly conned from their followers?

Or, could it be that they walk into the nearest church, and they are sold a false LS gospel?  After all, people naturally want to trust authority figures.  In either case, the person who is fed false LS teaching is being steered away from the truth.

Although this list is by no means complete, following are some of the terms that are associated with Lordship salvation as being requirements for receiving eternal life:

“Repent of your sins”
“Turn from your sins”
“Be willing to turn from your sins”
“Put Christ on the throne of your life”
“Give your life to Christ”
“Commit to follow Christ”

Some proponents of Lordship salvation will allow that salvation is by Grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone, but then will insist that a saved person will show signs of being saved, such as sinning less and doing good works. If these “signs” are not present, they will insist, or at least heavily suspect, that a person has never believed in Christ as Savior.

This thought process can never lead to assurance of salvation, because it is always dependent on how one thinks he is DOING at any given point in time (we put DOING in all caps, because it is a work).  Other folks think that God knows whether or not they are TRYING (we put TRYING in all caps, because it is a work).  Trying will not help you attain eternal life.  Eternal life is a free gift, received when someone trusts in Christ alone for it.

 

That's you Scotty.  Not once have I seen you preaching the gospel of Grace on here.  Never.

 

Top work Kimba. Heres a vid of Kimba and Scotty discussing 'Church and State'.

 

 

[phart]

Is this what the CIA calls unintentional blowback?

 

[bonzo]

Trouble at mill? 

[Eisegerwind]

3 minutes ago, bonzo said:

Trouble at mill? 

Crossbeams gone askew on't treadle.

[Kimba]

2 COR 4:3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

4 In whom the god of this world (Satan) hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

5 For we preach NOT OURSELVES, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake.

6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

 

Romans 16-17

17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offenses CONTRARY to the doctrine which ye have learned; and AVOID them.

18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches DECEIVE the hearts of the simple.

 

Heretics such as those following Lordship Salvation are to be marked and avoided as they preach false gospels and false doctrine contrary to the one given to Paul - the revelation of the mystery.

Scotty does not even preach 1 Corinthans 15:1-4.  Absolute shame.

 

 

Edited April 3, 2018 by Kimba

[ger intae them]

Wholly whoar!