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BBC Documentary about Argentina 1978


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4 hours ago, aaid said:

Two years of elation for forty years of embarrassment?  I appreciate this isn't a popular opinion but I wish it'd never happened.

Some of us experienced something no Scotland fan has afterwards

Yes we were young

But for those 2 years beforehand we really really believed that we were one of if not the best team in the World and that we really were going to win it or reach the semis

Thats what i wouldnt trade

And lets not forget - as i stated earlier there were really good reasons for us to believe that and it wasnt a fantasy unlike today

Magical times

Edited by Ally Bongo
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15 minutes ago, Orraloon said:

The way they covered the guy with the Argentine wife was good. I bet he never got to go to another WC just in case he just picked up another (Spanish, Italian, Mexican) burd.

My Mrs who was not even watching it actually turned from her book and gave a wee “awwwww” at the end bit when he introduced his wife.

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5 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

I don't remember seeing the film of the team hotel / training camp before. Looked absolutely shocking.

Even i didnt realise it was that bad

The SFA coined in hundreds of thousands (a few million in today's money) from qualification

Dozens of them went on a free junket yet nobody could scout the accommodation never mind get the team moved when they realised it was a dump

Then there was the penny pinching on payments and bonuses issue

No wonder weasel Macari and others were selling stories to the press - doesnt make it right as tens of thousands would have swopped places with them regardless of it being a shithole - but still

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7 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

 

Dozens of them went on a free junket yet nobody could scout the accommodation never mind get the team moved when they realised it was a dump

 

 

Well the manager couldn't be arsed scouting the opposition, so maybe the SFA took his lead.....

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46 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

To be fair to the SFA serious lessons were learned and the organisation got a lot better at future tournaments. Unfortunately the players didn't.

 

Not if you read Archie McPherson's book. The hotel in Mexico in 86 for the games in Neza was like a prison according to the players interviewed. They claimed it was all they could get as we were last to qualify

 

Sotogrande in 82 was top end but a two hour drive from the ground in Malaga

 

The place in Rapallo for Italia 90 was the dogs bollocks apparently 

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1 hour ago, Scotland Ever More said:

Those scenes at Anfield when we beat Wales are amazing.

Seemed to be loads more Lion rampants  than saltires in the crowd back then, any particular reason for this?

The late 60s and 70s was the beginning of political awareness in Scotland

Football was the only sport of note that Scotland and Scottish identity were represented on the World stage 

The Lion Rampant or The Royal Flag of Scotland specifically belongs to a King or Queen of Scotland and as there hasnt been one since the 17th century it was more dramatic then than the Saltire - most of them had "Bannockburn" and "1314" on them

Basically it was more of a "get it up ye" flag to the English than the Saltire

Ironically the majority of the Scotland supporters in those days followed Rangers

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7 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

The late 60s and 70s was the beginning of political awareness in Scotland

Football was the only sport of note that Scotland and Scottish identity were represented on the World stage 

The Lion Rampant or The Royal Flag of Scotland specifically belongs to a King or Queen of Scotland and as there hasnt been one since the 17th century it was more dramatic then than the Saltire - most of them had "Bannockburn" and "1314" on them

Basically it was more of a "get it up ye" flag to the English than the Saltire

Ironically the majority of the Scotland supporters in those days followed Rangers

Thanks for the reply. 

I already knew that about Rangers fans, one of the reasons why not many Celtic fans followed the national side back then.

Thankfully the days of singing the sash in the west enclosure and booing Celtic players are long gone. 

 

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13 minutes ago, Scotland Ever More said:

Thanks for the reply. 

I already knew that about Rangers fans, one of the reasons why not many Celtic fans followed the national side back then.

Thankfully the days of singing the sash in the west enclosure and booing Celtic players are long gone. 

 

Can remember being in a big beer tent during Sweden 92 - cant remember if it was Gothenburg or Norkopping due to being very drunk for 2 weeks - and was taken aback when the group of lads beside us said they supported Celtic - our crowd was mainly Airdrie and Dundee fans with me being the sole Accie and some Rangers boys from Methil although they said they supported East Fife

Changed days - most of the guys i know that still go to the games and am friendly with support Celtic  

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having retired yesterday, I was out for a meal last night, so I've just watched the documentary.

I cried my fucking eyes out!

We were easily the best team in the world  in the previous 15 months. Missed penalty agsinst Peru and a ridiculous draw with Iran. The second group stage would have been a doddle. 

Perhaps it is a bit of nostalgia (and a good few pints), but I really believed.

Anyway off at 06:05 to PutinLand for a 40 day feast of football.

 

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9 minutes ago, VASCO said:

 

We were easily the best team in the world  in the previous 15 months. Missed penalty agsinst Peru and a ridiculous draw with Iran. The second group stage would have been a doddle. 

 

Had we beaten Peru and got out the group as winner we would have been paired with West Germany, Italy and Austria.

Doubt we would have had enough in the tank to top that group, but as you said, had we taken our 1977 form into the World Cup, you never know what might have happened.

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19 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

Can remember being in a big beer tent during Sweden 92 - cant remember if it was Gothenburg or Norkopping due to being very drunk for 2 weeks - and was taken aback when the group of lads beside us said they supported Celtic - our crowd was mainly Airdrie and Dundee fans with me being the sole Accie and some Rangers boys from Methil although they said they supported East Fife

Changed days - most of the guys i know that still go to the games and am friendly with support Celtic  

I've seen a massive change in attitudes toward the national team from when I started going to CP in the early 90s.

I'd say most still don't bother much with international football in general but know of very very few people who'd actively want Scotland to lose and you do get a decent amount who cheer us one from the armchair and from the terraces. 25 years ago that wasn't the case. Suppose there's various factors for this really. 

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52 minutes ago, wanderer said:

Had we beaten Peru and got out the group as winner we would have been paired with West Germany, Italy and Austria.

Doubt we would have had enough in the tank to top that group, but as you said, had we taken our 1977 form into the World Cup, you never know what might have happened.

Had we beaten Peru the result would've been changed to a 3-0 defeat cos of the drugs issue.

Performance enhancing drugs FFS - Johnston played like he was on sleeping tablets!

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18 minutes ago, daviebee said:

Had we beaten Peru the result would've been changed to a 3-0 defeat cos of the drugs issue.

That's what I remember, but I can't find anything to corroborate that.

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22 minutes ago, daviebee said:

Had we beaten Peru the result would've been changed to a 3-0 defeat cos of the drugs issue.

Performance enhancing drugs FFS - Johnston played like he was on sleeping tablets!

The year before he had destroyed the Argentinian defence in Buenos Aires and one of their players told him not to come back for the World Cup or things would be bad for him !

It was also supposed to be Dalglish & Gemmill to go for the drug test but Gemmill said he was too dehydrated and tapped Willie on the shoulder so he went in his place

Kinda backs up him being oblivious to what he had taken but they were stimulants and a lot of players used them in England but they were not for his hay fever and not prescribed by the team doctor

Johnston played a part in the first goal but he was no worse than the rest of the team - Jordan, Dalglish and Johnston were never in the game after 30 minutes backing up the belief that Rioch and Masson in the middle of the park were finished

Edited by Ally Bongo
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8 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

The year before he had destroyed the Argentinian defence in Buenos Aires and one of their players told him not to come back for the World Cup or things would be bad for him !

It was also supposed to be Dalglish & Gemmill to go for the drug test but Gemmill said he was too dehydrated and tapped Willie on the shoulder so he went in his place

Kinda backs up him being oblivious to what he had taken but they were stimulants and a lot of players used them in England but they were not for his hay fever and not prescribed by the team doctor

Johnston played a part in the first goal but he was no worse than the rest of the team - Jordan, Dalglish and Johnston were never in the game after 30 minutes backing up the belief that Rioch and Masson in the middle of the park were finished

I remember as well that Ally MacLeod said before the tournament that Willie Johnston "would be a sensation in Argentina!"  :lol:

Don't know if this one is true but apparently one of the other players reported that after his miserable performance Johnston said, "All I need now is to fail the drugs test..."  Maybe just one of these stories - like the one about Derek Johnstone not being picked against Iran cos he'd been taking the same pills.

I'd love to live through all the euphoria again, but only if the Good Lord took me before the WC actually started.   :lol: 

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1 hour ago, wanderer said:

Had we beaten Peru and got out the group as winner we would have been paired with West Germany, Italy and Austria.

No the group winners (Peru) played Argentina, Brazil and Poland in the second round. It would've been a tough ask to get out of either group.

 

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Nice documentary.
Lots of elements : the football story, the fans with the 1970s backdrop.

Getting to Argentina in 1978 must have been a major undertaking / adventure into unknown for fans.
Like going to the moon for an away game.  Different era.

About 10 years ago I was in Mendoza and took a trip to the stadium.
The gates were opened and we wandered in to stand on the empty terraces.
Still remember just standing there thinking of events from many decades previous.
Archie Gemmils goal against Holland.

An ere sort of place that deserves a footnote in the history of the Scottish nation.

 

Resize of Resize of mendoza (29).JPG

Edited by Haggis_trap
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Watched it again last night as it was bugging me why I knew the bar so well that one of the journalist was being interviewed in (one with the Scottish flags laid out along the walls in background) and just found out its the Edinburgh Ukraine Club he was being interviewed in 

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