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11 hours ago, aaid said:

What's Bertie Armstrong got to say about it then?

What ever hes told by his masters, an absolute knob of a man, he is chair of the SFF and has nothing to do with the process side of things.

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16 hours ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

Contrary to the msm peddling that all fishermen are pro brexit, it is not the case, processors have been uneasy about it from the onset and inshore and west coast lads are definitely against it. 

Yep I've a mate who runs a seafood trading business, reckons he'll have to close down if there's a no deal Brexit. The bulk of his sales are exports to Spain and France.

 

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1 hour ago, Toepoke said:

Yep I've a mate who runs a seafood trading business, reckons he'll have to close down if there's a no deal Brexit. The bulk of his sales are exports to Spain and France.

 

Most know i am a euro sceptic however i am i no way a fan of how this strimash is unfolding, i voted for brexit niavely, giving the torys a little bit of trust that they could handle the process, this was obviously a mistake. If there is a no deal in three weeks this could sink the country which we will take years to recover from

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2 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

Most know i am a euro sceptic however i am i no way a fan of how this strimash is unfolding, i voted for brexit niavely, giving the torys a little bit of trust that they could handle the process, this was obviously a mistake. If there is a no deal in three weeks this could sink the country which we will take years to recover from

No Deal or May's Deal same outcome I reckon. 

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This whole affair looks as if it will run and run.  Imagine May's deal goes through, through gritted teeth. (On the back of brexiteer MPs too scared of a no deal, and remainer MPs too concerned for 'democracy' to push for a second vote.)

So we have a scenario where although the MPs settled for the deal, maybe a majority of the nation is unhappy. Though some may be sick of brexit, there could be two sides agitating for further change. I mean, are ardent Brexiteers going to give up, if we are still shackled to the EU on so many fronts? Are ardent remainers going to be happy with a scenario where we are paying for taking EU rules but having no say? 

So what are the chances there could be continued agitation for another few years, possibly leading to another referendum, with return to EU and clean break both on the card as well as status quo?    

Edited by exile

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Juncker: "Our agreement provides meaningful clarifications & legal guarantees to the Withdrawal Agreement & #backstop". Doesn't say it repeals or removes the backstop. Sounds like a fudge, to give the appearance that May was won concessions?. 

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From a further look, looks like it's just window dressing, just pretending to be a breakthrough.

So a bit like the Vow, let's people pretend it's what they want, makes people feel better about voting for it, but ultimately nothing of substance, nothing that can't be reneged on later. 

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10 minutes ago, kumnio said:

Almost three years in, and they still dont have a fucking clue whats going on.

An absolute shambles. What Theresa May has essentially said is that there will be a vote and it's either no deal or an extension.

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So here we go

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-47551121

NI will get tariff-free imports from RoI/EU. Goods direct from RoI to Wales/England ports will face tariffs.

Time for that bridge from NI to Scotland?

Or in treating NI differently from the rUK, the beginning of the loosening of the precious, precious union? 

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13 hours ago, Mox said:

An absolute shambles. What Theresa May has essentially said is that there will be a vote and it's either no deal or an extension.

What exactly is the point of 2 more separate votes ?

If a no deal vote is defeated tonight surely the same people are going to vote for an extension, there will be no time for an alternative. Would it not have made more sense just to have 2 questions/votes tonight. No deal or extension ?  This whole thing is getting dragged out to ridiculous proportions. 

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They are just running down the clock. The political equivalent of taking the ball to the corner flag.

The BBC's coverage of this shambles has been appalling.  They had an item on Distorting Scotland last night, a vox pop from Dundee, where they had almost everyone demanding "just get on with it, just leave".  That's not honest reporting; that's just fabricated propaganda.

As for this people's vote shite: there isn't time, and why should Scotland go through that just to be ignored again?  Especially if, as some have suggested, remain would not be an option.

If Nicola tries to put the indyref off until after the 2021 election, she will lose a lot of members from the SNP.  Leaving aside the material change argument, the separate matter of the way we have been treated like an abused spouse since 2014 is in itself justification for indyref2.  I can understand we need to wait a short time (weeks) until we see what form of Brexit occurs, but even if it ends up as a full revocation of A50, there is still more than enough justification for indyref2.

I'm away to enquire about getting a Lithuanian passport as my grandfather was born there.

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55 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

What exactly is the point of 2 more separate votes ?

If a no deal vote is defeated tonight surely the same people are going to vote for an extension, there will be no time for an alternative. Would it not have made more sense just to have 2 questions/votes tonight. No deal or extension ?  This whole thing is getting dragged out to ridiculous proportions. 

If they vote in favour of a no deal exit then they shouldn't need the 2nd vote. I think?

It would be interesting if they vote against a no deal exit and against asking for an extension. Or, if the EU don't agree to an extension. I think they need the EUs agreement for and extension? Not sure if they have already got that agreement ? Then the only option left to them would be to withdraw the Article 50 application altogether. And we start all over again.

That would knock any Independence referendum back another couple of years which would probably suit Nicola just fine.

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39 minutes ago, Alibi said:

They are just running down the clock. The political equivalent of taking the ball to the corner flag.

Brilliant, i'm nicking that :ok:

39 minutes ago, Alibi said:

If Nicola tries to put the indyref off until after the 2021 election, she will lose a lot of members from the SNP. 

When you say "put off" what do you mean exactly? Do you mean put off the section 30 request, or do you mean put off a consultative referendum that holds no weight, will be boycotted by the No side, and likely found illegal by the supreme court?

 

 

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1 hour ago, Dave78 said:

 

When you say "put off" what do you mean exactly? Do you mean put off the section 30 request, or do you mean put off a consultative referendum that holds no weight, will be boycotted by the No side, and likely found illegal by the supreme court?

 

 

I mean deliberately kick the can further and further down the road without starting the process prior to the 2021 election - in effect allowing the current mandate to expire.  In 2021 the election campaign is very likely to see the full forces of the unionist media deployed to try to prevent an indy majority by whatever means possible.  I don't think now is the time, but in a few weeks we should see what has happened on 29th March and it may well become clearer.  All this "we should wait ten years" nonsense should get short shrift.  I'm of an age where I'd rather we were more ambitious than that.

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2 hours ago, Orraloon said:

If they vote in favour of a no deal exit then they shouldn't need the 2nd vote. I think?

It would be interesting if they vote against a no deal exit and against asking for an extension.

Yeah , but why bother voting on different days when everyone knows there is the option of asking for an extension out there too ?   

At this late stage  ‘no extension ‘ effectively means ‘leaving without a deal ‘ , so you would be better just having ‘ no deal’ and ‘ extension’ as the options on the one vote. 

Or is there another option I am not aware of? 

She may of course think the MP’s  are too thick  to understand the question therefore needs to split it 🙄

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2 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

 

Or is there another option I am not aware of? 

 

Like the one I mentioned in my previous post?;)

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4 minutes ago, Orraloon said:

Like the one I mentioned in my previous post?;)

😂

I dont really think withdrawing Article 50 is a serious option , is it ?  Its surely got to be an extension or a no deal Brexit. 

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2 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

😂

I dont really think withdrawing Article 50 is a serious option , is it ?  Its surely got to be an extension or a no deal Brexit. 

Why not?

I think that the EU refusing to give an extension is a possibility. It would only need one of the 27 members to decide that they have had enough of the UK's fannying aboot.

Then the only two options would be no deal exit on 29th March (There is no transition period if there is no deal.) or the UK revoke article 50 to give them at least two years to sort things out. I'm fairly sure the UK could then apply  for another article 50 whenever the UK chooses. 

 

 

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24 minutes ago, Orraloon said:

Why not?

I think that the EU refusing to give an extension is a possibility. It would only need one of the 27 members to decide that they have had enough of the UK's fannying aboot.

Then the only two options would be no deal exit on 29th March (There is no transition period if there is no deal.) or the UK revoke article 50 to give them at least two years to sort things out. I'm fairly sure the UK could then apply  for another article 50 whenever the UK chooses. 

 

 

Did the ECJ not rule that article 50 can only be revoked if the member state was not planning to buy time but planning to remain in the EU and that retriggering it would not be possible ?

FWIW I wouldn't blame member states for declining an extension but I  think they will approve it if requested. Its a mess though , its not long till the European elections, I am not sure what can be achieved between now and then. 

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1 hour ago, TDYER63 said:

Did the ECJ not rule that article 50 can only be revoked if the member state was not planning to buy time but planning to remain in the EU and that retriggering it would not be possible ?

 

I think that is technically correct but in practice I don't think that EU could enforce it. It would be like saying that, once a country had invoked article 50 then withdrew it, they would be tied into EU membership for ever and ever. It would probably need to be tested in court but I can't see how that would be legal. Maybe PAIK is correct and that was the plan all along?;) I don't think the ECJ ruling put any time limit between withdrawal of article 50 and applying for a new one. Just some wolly words about the decision should be "unconditional" or something like that.

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