The Brexit Thread

[thplinth]

9 hours ago, phart said:

Well apart from May there is no contest in the lying stakes. May has checks and balances on her lies through peer review each week as do the rest of them. Farage can say what he wants and has done.

He's the cunt that says Trump grabbing by the pussy  is "Alpha-Male Boasting" but when someone gets groped in Germany it's suddenly time to chuck everyone out.

A total demagogue with no substance. Getting pushed from nowhere and we're meant to listen to him. Fuck that.

" The biggest racism I’ve seen in British politics is happening north of the border with the SNP, where some of the anti-English hatred is reaching a truly astonishing level and I would think that if the BBC are worried about racism that’s where they ought to be looking... T‎he SNP are openly racist. The anti-English hostility and the kind of language that is used about and towards English people is totally extraordinary.” "

The SNP minded folk on here endlessly characterize UKIP / Farage as racists. BREXIT party - a party that argues for leaving a union - that means they must hate foreigners apparently.

The SNP are also a party that argues for leaving a union, with England. But the SNP and Scots are whiter than white and it has nothing to do with anti English sentiment.

Seems a bit of double standard to me.

Personally I dont think Farage is a racist. I think the EU created Farage and his supporters by going in the direction it went. Britain will not be the only one and the EURO is going to have a lot more problems to come.

Farage is a very skilled speaker IMHO and has a more 'charisma' than all the other leaders combined. I think he is underestimated just like Trump was but only time will tell... 

Edited May 13, 2019 by thplinth

[phart]

The SNP double standards are nothing to do with me, that was in response to SNP picking him as an enemy, when the enmity was already there.

Being able to point out the many faults of the EU is great but when he was a member he would do things like be in the building then not bother to turn up and vote on fishery issues. Even though he talked about it. Sure he might sound good, just look at what he does though actions not words.

I don't care what politicians say in so much as in the context of what they actually do.

[Caledonian Craig]

I don't believe I have ever called Farage a racist. He lives in the past. He dreams of a bygone age of the British Empire and reckons it will all be regained by leaving the EU. All very well but that does not bring India etc back under British control. It also does not rekindle the British car industry, coal industry, ship building industry, electronics industry or motorbike industry. They died in the 70s and 80s long before the EU came into being and they will never return just as the British Empire won't. 

Thplinth, a serious question here, if there were a referendum tomorrow on Scottish independence and that matter alone how would you vote? 

[thplinth]

The discussion of Farage very much reminds me of the discussions of Trump. Endless accusations of 'isms' with never any real evidence. You just repeat it over and over until it becomes a fact in your head. He wants to restore the British Empire... FFS Do you ever listen to how fucking ridiculous that sounds. I doubt most of the folk repeating this tedious shite ever actually went and listened to what Farage says. Fuck this level of conversation. Racist racist racist. Boring fucking arse gravy crap.

[Ally Bongo]

Farage might not be a racist but he wants to take England back to a time when it was more racist than it is now

[Caledonian Craig]

23 minutes ago, thplinth said:

The discussion of Farage very much reminds me of the discussions of Trump. Endless accusations of 'isms' with never any real evidence. You just repeat it over and over until it becomes a fact in your head. He wants to restore the British Empire... FFS Do you ever listen to how fucking ridiculous that sounds. I doubt most of the folk repeating this tedious shite ever actually went and listened to what Farage says. Fuck this level of conversation. Racist racist racist. Boring fucking arse gravy crap.

Calm down eh? 

WTF is racist in what I said. You speak so highly of Farage though do not seem to understand what makes him tick. 

[thplinth]

5 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

Farage might not be a racist but he wants to take England back to a time when it was more racist than it is now

This is the sort of completely mad shit I am talking about. Is that a point? I am not calling him a racist but I sort of am in a sly way... 

5 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Calm down eh? 

WTF is racist in what I said. You speak so highly of Farage though do not seem to understand what makes him tick. 

You speak in crayon cliches... he wants to retake India (yeah that is what you suggested). 

[thplinth]

1 hour ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Thplinth, a serious question here, if there were a referendum tomorrow on Scottish independence and that matter alone how would you vote? 

I already voted on it. Did you?

[Orraloon]

13 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

Farage might not be a racist but he wants to take England back to a time when it was more racist than it is now

I think that is debatable, but even if it is true, so what? If the people of England want to follow him back to that time, then that is up to them.

We don't need to like Farage. We don't need to like his policies. I don't even know what his policies are. If he has got any sense he will fight an election based on one single policy. Taking the UK out of the EU. And doing a better job of it that the Tories or Labour. Even remainers would probably agree that he could do that?

At present Farage is our best chance of gaining independence. The independence movement don't need to embrace him or his policies in order to make best use of the chaos he is causing. But we should be developing a strategy to make best use of his achievements when the time is right. And we could maybe even learn something from his tactics?

 

[Ally Bongo]

3 hours ago, Orraloon said:

I think that is debatable, but even if it is true, so what? If the people of England want to follow him back to that time, then that is up to them.

We don't need to like Farage. We don't need to like his policies. I don't even know what his policies are. If he has got any sense he will fight an election based on one single policy. Taking the UK out of the EU. And doing a better job of it that the Tories or Labour. Even remainers would probably agree that he could do that?

At present Farage is our best chance of gaining independence. The independence movement don't need to embrace him or his policies in order to make best use of the chaos he is causing. But we should be developing a strategy to make best use of his achievements when the time is right. And we could maybe even learn something from his tactics?

 

You had a good point until i looked at the latest Scottish sub sample poll

If by any chance the YouGov subsample is completely accurate, the six Scottish seats would be distributed as follows: SNP 3, Brexit Party 2, Liberal Democrats 1. 

https://scotgoespop.blogspot.com/2019/05/could-ruth-davidson-be-facing-abrupt.html

What happens to the chances of an Independence referendum if the Brexit Party becomes Scotland's second party ?

I cannot believe cunts in Scotland would vote for Farage

 

 

[ParisInAKilt]

How does leaving the EU have anything to do with reimaging the British empire?

[Dave78]

[aaid]

2 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

You had a good point until i looked at the latest Scottish sub sample poll

If by any chance the YouGov subsample is completely accurate, the six Scottish seats would be distributed as follows: SNP 3, Brexit Party 2, Liberal Democrats 1. 

https://scotgoespop.blogspot.com/2019/05/could-ruth-davidson-be-facing-abrupt.html

What happens to the chances of an Independence referendum if the Brexit Party becomes Scotland's second party ?

I cannot believe cunts in Scotland would vote for Farage

 

 

I'm surprised at James Kelly putting any credence in sub-samples.

[Caledonian Craig]

4 hours ago, ParisInAKilt said:

How does leaving the EU have anything to do with reimaging the British empire?

It comes from his many rants about making Britain great again with him speaking of its potential - all in the past really. FFS Britain is such a potential powerhouse it no longer makes it's own cars, motorbikes, ships and electrical goods where it once led the field. And it only produces miniscule amounts of coal and steel where, again, it was once a giant in that area.

[Caledonian Craig]

5 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

You had a good point until i looked at the latest Scottish sub sample poll

If by any chance the YouGov subsample is completely accurate, the six Scottish seats would be distributed as follows: SNP 3, Brexit Party 2, Liberal Democrats 1. 

https://scotgoespop.blogspot.com/2019/05/could-ruth-davidson-be-facing-abrupt.html

What happens to the chances of an Independence referendum if the Brexit Party becomes Scotland's second party ?

I cannot believe cunts in Scotland would vote for Farage

 

 

European Elections have always been the place for people to have their protest vote. I have no doubt the polls are pretty accurate however they cannot be readily transferred into GE voting intentions. Look at past European Elections and your protest vote groups always tend to fair much better than at GE. Parties such as UKIP and Greens do dar better as the hoover up people looking to make a protest vote against Tories and Labour. Now when we get a GE then the Brexit and Change Parties will get found out as they'll struggle to come up with policies on matters that people really care about. Your die-hard Tories and Labour voters aren't for changing and they'll blindly put a cross in their parties box. Plus you have the FPTP system which favours greatly Labour and Tories. I cannot see Brexit Party drumming up support in a leafy West Sussex seat home to comfortable Tories and the same applies to the many other backwaters.

[Dave78]

8 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

European Elections have always been the place for people to have their protest vote. I have no doubt the polls are pretty accurate however they cannot be readily transferred into GE voting intentions. Look at past European Elections and your protest vote groups always tend to fair much better than at GE. Parties such as UKIP and Greens do dar better as the hoover up people looking to make a protest vote against Tories and Labour. Now when we get a GE then the Brexit and Change Parties will get found out as they'll struggle to come up with policies on matters that people really care about. Your die-hard Tories and Labour voters aren't for changing and they'll blindly put a cross in their parties box. Plus you have the FPTP system which favours greatly Labour and Tories. I cannot see Brexit Party drumming up support in a leafy West Sussex seat home to comfortable Tories and the same applies to the many other backwaters.

You're right. But then, like UKIP, the Brexit Party don't need to win seats to achieve their main objective. All they have to do is threaten the Tory majority to get their No-deal Brexit, just as UKIP did to secure a referendum.

Polls show they're doing just that...

https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/1128258417733316608

[Caledonian Craig]

2 minutes ago, Dave78 said:

You're right. But then, like UKIP, the Brexit Party don't need to win seats to achieve their main objective. All they have to do is threaten the Tory majority to get their No-deal Brexit, just as UKIP did to secure a referendum.

Polls show they're doing just that...

https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/1128258417733316608

Yes but my point is that it will only scratch the surface of the Tory seats at a GE. Some people are going way overboard predicting Brexit Party winning the next election. Sorry but that goes into the realm of Santa Claus, fairies and shangri-la.

[Ally Bongo]

10 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Yes but my point is that it will only scratch the surface of the Tory seats at a GE. Some people are going way overboard predicting Brexit Party winning the next election. Sorry but that goes into the realm of Santa Claus, fairies and shangri-la.

I'd imagine the next GE will be a Tory last stand and it all depends who is the party leader then 

The threat of getting Corbyn if you vote UKIP/Brexit instead of the Conservative's is wearing a bit thin down south

[Caledonian Craig]

1 minute ago, Ally Bongo said:

I'd imagine the next GE will be a Tory last stand and it all depends who is the party leader then 

The threat of getting Corbyn if you vote UKIP/Brexit instead of the Conservative's is wearing a bit thin down south

The next GE is a cast iron certainty to be a Hung Parliament. At present Labour will probably be the largest party with around 280 seats then Tories with 260, SNP with around 50 and Lib Dems with around 70 with the others making up remainder of seats. I would be surprised if Brexit Party andf Change won more than 10 seats between them.

[stocky]

7 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

You had a good point until i looked at the latest Scottish sub sample poll

If by any chance the YouGov subsample is completely accurate, the six Scottish seats would be distributed as follows: SNP 3, Brexit Party 2, Liberal Democrats 1. 

https://scotgoespop.blogspot.com/2019/05/could-ruth-davidson-be-facing-abrupt.html

What happens to the chances of an Independence referendum if the Brexit Party becomes Scotland's second party ?

I cannot believe cunts in Scotland would vote for Farage

 

 

1 million Scots voted for Brexit , so that could = 2 seats.  however i think the are guaranteed 1. 

SNP at the mo are taking 3,

Libs taking 1 could be the anti SNP Remainers... but could split between Lab/Tory 

so the other seat could be Anybody's  

Would be great if the Greens got one...

however 38% Leave probably = 2 seats....  depends how many SNP Leavers dont vote SNP...

 

[Ally Bongo]

I think too much is made of the SNP leave vote

A good proportion of that voted Leave for Independence purposes

I know i did ........

[scotlad]

12 hours ago, Orraloon said:

I think that is debatable, but even if it is true, so what? If the people of England want to follow him back to that time, then that is up to them.

We don't need to like Farage. We don't need to like his policies. I don't even know what his policies are. If he has got any sense he will fight an election based on one single policy. Taking the UK out of the EU. And doing a better job of it that the Tories or Labour. Even remainers would probably agree that he could do that?

At present Farage is our best chance of gaining independence. The independence movement don't need to embrace him or his policies in order to make best use of the chaos he is causing. But we should be developing a strategy to make best use of his achievements when the time is right. And we could maybe even learn something from his tactics?

 

I must confess to some grudging admiration of they way he handle his interview with Andrew Marr on Sunday.  After Marr got nowhere with his line of questioning he started hurling quotes Farage had made years earlier, hoping something would stick.  Farage wasn't playing though, just swatting each one contemptuously away.

Contrast that with Gillian Martin MSP, thrown under a bus and sacked from the cabinet because of a quote from a blog post she'd made the best part of a decade earlier!

[stocky]

3 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

I think too much is made of the SNP leave vote

A good proportion of that voted Leave for Independence purposes

I know i did ........

Yes i think so as well, i know a couple of Yes Voters who voted Leave so as they would get ' A material Change of Circumstances' and therefore another referendum,. They are correct  Brexit has given us another Indy Referendum 10 years before we would have got indy ref 2.

My view was if enough Scots voted Remain we could keep England in Europe against their will..... I wonder what would have happened then.... However as usual the SCOTTISH vote did not count, if no Scots had voted, it would have made no difference, 

Same as every election, that is the main reason why i want Independence. 

[ErsatzThistle]

Three SNP MEPs and one Scottish Green MEP would be amazing but it won't happen.

The unionists will vote tactically again to stop "the natz" and we'll end up with two SNP and one each for Conservatives, Labour, Liberal Democrat and Brexit Parties.

[hampden_loon2878]

10 hours ago, ErsatzThistle said:

Three SNP MEPs and one Scottish Green MEP would be amazing but it won't happen.

The unionists will vote tactically again to stop "the natz" and we'll end up with two SNP and one each for Conservatives, Labour, Liberal Democrat and Brexit Parties.

Was looking up past Europeand elections in scotland and the snp’s only just beat labour back in 2014, i was surprised about that however i cant see turn out being much at all, for the fitst time i will not be voting, i am affshore and forgot to get a postal vote