Jump to content

Recommended Posts

1 minute ago, Rossy said:

You're twisting yourself in knots trying to find a reason (not that people like you need one) to have a go at Sturgeon.

What she said....with blinding clarity...it's that the only thing that is certain, is the uncertainty that this vote has caused. Even a child could understand that, and I fail to see what it is she said that caused you to run on here desperate to criticise her.

You would have thought that there were more important things to worry about......a leaderless rUK for instance, or the (possible) looming recession, or the pound collapsing, or HSBC moving jobs to France, or US companies re-considering investing in the UK, or a thousand other things.

Everything she has said since Thursday has been correct and relevant. The UK is now a different place from the country it was on Wednesday, and Scotland has already voted for a different direction.

It would be absolutely irresponsible of her not to consider the option of a 2nd independence referendum.

Now, I realise that people like you will be desperate to drown her out with the type of hate-filled bile that you can already see in newspaper forums this morning. 

However, this time I think it'll take more than that. You'll have to up your game.

Absolute bullshit.  Yer pissed oot yer hoop.  Sober up ya fanatic.  Will promise you I don't mention Princess Nicola, in the Indyref2 forum anymore, :wub:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, BlueGaz said:

  Will promise you I don't mention Princess Nicola, in the Indyref2 forum anymore, :wub:

I'll give you about 30 minutes before you come on here spluttering with rage again...:ok:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Rossy said:

I'll give you about 30 minutes before you come on here spluttering with rage again...:ok:

Rage?  no rage here.  £50.00 to Sunshine Appeal if after 30 mins?  Promise only to mention Nicola in the Wales v Northern Ireland thread from now on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, McDange said:

Given Scottish LibDems & SLab are already at rock bottom, will they stand side-by-side with the Tories again? 

Yes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't know what to think about this. On the one hand I agree that Scotland is entitled to vote again on Independence, but on the other hand I'm not sure where you draw the line on these things. How many referendums can you have and how often can you call for one? I'm not trying to annoy the pro-Independence folk here, because the same could apply if you became independent. The pro-unionists could potentially keep demanding another referendum asking if you wanted to give up being independent and rejoin the UK? The same point could be made about the recent decision to leave the EU? Should we have a referendum in a years time to see if people have changed their minds? And another one in five years time? Where do you stop with this sort of thing.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, George Saint said:

I don't know what to think about this. On the one hand I agree that Scotland is entitled to vote again on Independence, but on the other hand I'm not sure where you draw the line on these things. How many referendums can you have and how often can you call for one? I'm not trying to annoy the pro-Independence folk here, because the same could apply if you became independent. The pro-unionists could potentially keep demanding another referendum asking if you wanted to give up being independent and rejoin the UK? The same point could be made about the recent decision to leave the EU? Should we have a referendum in a years time to see if people have changed their minds? And another one in five years time? Where do you stop with this sort of thing.

 

 

You can have as many or as few as the people decide. 

If a party has made an election promise to hold a referendum and it wins a majority, it has a mandate to hold that referendum.

The Swiss hold referendums almost every month to give the people the choice. 

J

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, George Saint said:

I don't know what to think about this. On the one hand I agree that Scotland is entitled to vote again on Independence, but on the other hand I'm not sure where you draw the line on these things. How many referendums can you have and how often can you call for one? I'm not trying to annoy the pro-Independence folk here, because the same could apply if you became independent. The pro-unionists could potentially keep demanding another referendum asking if you wanted to give up being independent and rejoin the UK? The same point could be made about the recent decision to leave the EU? Should we have a referendum in a years time to see if people have changed their minds? And another one in five years time? Where do you stop with this sort of thing.

 

 

I don't think you should have another referendum to *see* if people have changed their minds but I think you should be able have another one if people *have* changed their minds.

Quite how you establish that is of course the $64000 question but in the context of Scotland, I have no doubt that Nicola won't be pushing the button until she's certain herself that's the case. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How can there be a referendum when no one knows what's going to pan out? The UK leaving EU is up in the air. There is no plan. Already the Leave statements are unraveling on £ sent to EU and immigration levels.

There is also no plan on what would happen with an independent Scotland getting into EU with regards to €uro, public finances and other details.

38% of Scotland voted out despite Scottish Leave lacking resources and 1/3 of SNP supporters voted leave. So Sturgeon says she talks for Scotland but in this case all she cares about is promoting nationalism

It's all very confusing at the moment. I'm really not enjoying it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Alan said:

How can there be a referendum when no one knows what's going to pan out? The UK leaving EU is up in the air. There is no plan. Already the Leave statements are unraveling on £ sent to EU and immigration levels.

There is also no plan on what would happen with an independent Scotland getting into EU with regards to €uro, public finances and other details.

38% of Scotland voted out despite Scottish Leave lacking resources and 1/3 of SNP supporters voted leave. So Sturgeon says she talks for Scotland but in this case all she cares about is promoting nationalism

It's all very confusing at the moment. I'm really not enjoying it.

TBH, as of yet there is no 2nd referendum, only the exploring of all options. Which is entirely pragmatic IMHO.

Which if the electorate had have done the same before voting on Thursday, I'm sure we wouldn't be in this mess.

Reminds me of the Iraq invasion where the post hostility planning simply did not happen.

Bush didn't even know that there were two factions of Muslims prior to committing the troops!  

J

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Alan said:

How can there be a referendum when no one knows what's going to pan out? The UK leaving EU is up in the air. There is no plan. Already the Leave statements are unraveling on £ sent to EU and immigration levels.

There is also no plan on what would happen with an independent Scotland getting into EU with regards to €uro, public finances and other details.

38% of Scotland voted out despite Scottish Leave lacking resources and 1/3 of SNP supporters voted leave. So Sturgeon says she talks for Scotland but in this case all she cares about is promoting nationalism

It's all very confusing at the moment. I'm really not enjoying it.

Brexit means the future is as much a leap in the dark as Scottish independence - in a sense more so, because it turns out there is no plan (which a compliant media failed to notice).

Surely a second indyref would only take place when the relation to the EU was clearer - especially if the EU was positive to Scottish membership - so a Scottish future in Europe would be at least as certain as a Brexit rUK outside it.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I really dislike referendums (or is it referenda). No details. No plans. Statements that are pish voted on by people who do not look at detail or decide on other reasons e.g. "them immigrants" when there will always be immigration and Norway & Australia have more immigration than UK.

Globally politics is really under pressure. Liberal democracy is taking a beating. "Facts", "experts" and "co-operation" are bad words.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Scunnered said:

I can't see it.  The Scottish Government haven't been friends of the Unions particularly over blacklisting.  BUT these things should be balloted to members where yes, there could be a chance of support for independence.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, aaid said:

 

If any major Union backs a Yes vote I'll donate £10 British pounds to the charity of your choice,

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Scunnered said:

If any major Union backs a Yes vote I'll donate £10 British pounds to the charity of your choice,

TASA

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, Scunnered said:

If any major Union backs a Yes vote I'll donate £10 British pounds to the charity of your choice,

That's worth 20p at the current exchange rate.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, exile said:

Brexit means the future is as much a leap in the dark as Scottish independence - in a sense more so, because it turns out there is no plan (which a compliant media failed to notice).

Surely a second indyref would only take place when the relation to the EU was clearer - especially if the EU was positive to Scottish membership - so a Scottish future in Europe would be at least as certain as a Brexit rUK outside it.

Agree with this. IMO a second referendum is the absolute nuclear option here, but Sturgeon's right to let it be known the button is there to be pressed.

A lot of lengthy negotiations are about to take place, it's understandable for us to want answers immediately but patience is required for now...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If indeed another referendum is called, it'll be at least 2 years away. By then we'll have got a better picture and the reactive feelings just now will have calmed down. And a lot can happen in that period.

The key to success is capturing the 55+ demographic. Convince them and it's won. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Alan said:

I really dislike referendums (or is it referenda). No details. No plans. Statements that are pish voted on by people who do not look at detail or decide on other reasons e.g. "them immigrants" when there will always be immigration and Norway & Australia have more immigration than UK.

Globally politics is really under pressure. Liberal democracy is taking a beating. "Facts", "experts" and "co-operation" are bad words.

Granted I didn't see everything, but I never once saw anyone worthy of listening to say that immigration was to cease and thats why people voted purely on immigration.  I always understood it that immigration would be controlled better and it wouldn't be a case of anyone could come in, like it is now.  Even UKIP don't want to stop immigration, unless you can point me to where they say they will. No doubt there are some, but I haven't witnessed all the "racists" that are often talked about my members of this board.  Not you BTW.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, McDange said:

If indeed another referendum is called, it'll be at least 2 years away. By then we'll have got a better picture and the reactive feelings just now will have calmed down. And a lot can happen in that period.

The key to success is capturing the 55+ demographic. Convince them and it's won. 

That's the problem at the moment.  Far too many people, Rossy etc on this board, think its a done deal, and an indyref2 should be next Saturday.  There is a lot to go through before it will be clear what the next step should be, and if there is a 2nd ref, it should only be because of a consistent, obvious shift in no to yes.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

With William Hill it is 1/3 that Scotland will have an Independence referendum before 2024 and 9/4 that we wont.

Currently offering Evs to vote for Independence by 2024

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Ally Bongo said:

With William Hill it is 1/3 that Scotland will have an Independence referendum before 2024 and 9/4 that we wont.

Currently offering Evs to vote for Independence by 2024

Similar to the odds that Remain would win last week.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, BlueGaz said:

Similar to the odds that Remain would win last week.

Only at 2pm

At midnight remain was 1/8 and then the arse fell out of those odds

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Ally Bongo said:

Only at 2pm

At midnight remain was 1/8 and then the arse fell out of those odds

Yep, odds on until they started to get info through about what was happening.  My point being, they got it badly wrong.  Think we all did though to be fair.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×