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Potential squad for Belgium


andyD

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While I agree that Cairney has fallen well short of what he has shown he can do at club level, in his two games so far v Canada nobody was really bursting a gut in that match (but he did have a so-so game) and v Costa Rica we were chasing shadows all night as they were just so fast.

Far to early to write him off, but I do think he does need a run of games to settle himself into the team.

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On ‎6‎/‎8‎/‎2018 at 6:29 PM, BucksburnDandy said:

For me:

Keepers: Gordon, McGregor, Marshall/Bain

Defence: Tierney, Robertson, Mulgrew, Berra, McKenna, Hendry, Paterson, Douglas.

Midfield: Armstrong, C McGregor, Forrest, Fraser, McGinn, Cairney, McArthur, Phillips, McTominay.

Strikers: Griffiths, C Martin, Burke.

I think he'll call up O'Donnell ahead of Paterson if it's one or the other.

Just the vibe I got from McLeish's post tour comments and the fact SOD played 180 min at right back, whilst Paterson didn't and doesn't play there for Cardiff.

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2 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said:

 

Hornby, sorry.

 

I think the coaching staff will be unable to resist picking him. He must be as big as Lukaku and he’s 18. Certainly any kind of first team action, maybe on loan, and i think he’ll be in. He was clearly shattered in some of the games, but his first touch and ability on the ball are sound.

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9 minutes ago, er yir macaroon said:

I think the coaching staff will be unable to resist picking him. He must be as big as Lukaku and he’s 18. Certainly any kind of first team action, maybe on loan, and i think he’ll be in. He was clearly shattered in some of the games, but his first touch and ability on the ball are sound.

He certainly plays in a position without much competition ahead of him but it would be hard to pick him now ahead of players like Martin, Cummings, Fletcher, Rhodes and McBurnie. 

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5 minutes ago, PASTA Mick said:

He certainly plays in a position without much competition ahead of him but it would be hard to pick him now ahead of players like Martin, Cummings, Fletcher, Rhodes and McBurnie. 

I like McBurnie, but I’d have Hornby in the squad to learn over the others, assuming Griffiths fit. Hornby is a nailed on top player for me, despite being leggy in Toulon at times.

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Think it's too soon for Hornby, we could do him more damage than good by putting him in right now, not to mention what it would do to the other strikers we have available.

If you're McBurnie who's just had a really good loan spell, scoring goals at championship level and will likely be the first choice striker in that league next term, and you get bombed out the squad for an 18 year old who's not scored a senior goal and only has 140 minutes of real football to his name.. how's that for a kick in the teeth? McBurnie did alright so far, was unlucky not to score, and we need a senior option in case Griffiths in unavailable (Phillips is not it for me).

Hopefully this is the season that Rhodes gets back on track, he kind of has to for his career. Either moving club or doing so at Wednesday that well he's undroppable.

McCormack is back from Australia I think, so it'll be interesting to see what he does. Probably the only player to find the net regularly over the last year. WIll be good to get him back at a decent level, even tho age is against him a bit now.

Fletch still has a few seasons in him i think, he's a better option than Phillips, but he's not going to score a lot of meaningful goals, he's shown that already in his 31 caps.

For me we stick with Griff and McBurnie, possibly with Fletch or Russell as back up. If McCormack or Rhodes can find their feet in the Championship in the coming season, so much the better.

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10 minutes ago, andyD said:

Think it's too soon for Hornby, we could do him more damage than good by putting him in right now, not to mention what it would do to the other strikers we have available.

If you're McBurnie who's just had a really good loan spell, scoring goals at championship level and will likely be the first choice striker in that league next term, and you get bombed out the squad for an 18 year old who's not scored a senior goal and only has 140 minutes of real football to his name.. how's that for a kick in the teeth? McBurnie did alright so far, was unlucky not to score, and we need a senior option in case Griffiths in unavailable (Phillips is not it for me).

Hopefully this is the season that Rhodes gets back on track, he kind of has to for his career. Either moving club or doing so at Wednesday that well he's undroppable.

McCormack is back from Australia I think, so it'll be interesting to see what he does. Probably the only player to find the net regularly over the last year. WIll be good to get him back at a decent level, even tho age is against him a bit now.

Fletch still has a few seasons in him i think, he's a better option than Phillips, but he's not going to score a lot of meaningful goals, he's shown that already in his 31 caps.

For me we stick with Griff and McBurnie, possibly with Fletch or Russell as back up. If McCormack or Rhodes can find their feet in the Championship in the coming season, so much the better.

I’d keep McBurnie. Forget about Rhodes.

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Jordan Rhodes is now 28, the last time he showed any consistent form was four years ago.

Ross McCormack will be 32 when the next season starts, he hasn't shown any form for at least three years.

Neither of these players should be anywhere near the squad.

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48 minutes ago, aaid said:

Jordan Rhodes is now 28, the last time he showed any consistent form was four years ago.

Ross McCormack will be 32 when the next season starts, he hasn't shown any form for at least three years.

Neither of these players should be anywhere near the squad.

Rhodes still has the ability to be an important player.
People tend to look at the goals column and that's it, without understanding the context.

15-16 he started out in normal scoring form for Blackburn, 9 goals in the first 15.
January saw a move to Boro to try and add to their promotion push.
That he did, scoring 5 with 2 assists in the closing 8 games, securing an extra 9 points and finishing above Bright on goal difference. Missions accomplished by Rhodes.
Up he went to the Premier League.
Unfortunately Boro continued playing 1 up and bought in Alvaro Negredo. Unsurprisingly, and without shame, he was 2nd fiddle to the Spain international. Ended up going out on loan to Sheffield Wednesday.
Sheffield Wednesday didn't suit him under Carlos Carvalhal. Fans were disgruntled by the overly defensive approach, including the manager himself admitting that in some games they just didn't try and win in the first half, often against seemingly poor opposition.
While Wednesday finished 4th, the stats speak for themselves. The top scorer had 12, the 3rd top had 6. In terms of the league, only 3 teams in the top 14 scored fewer goals than Wednesday that season. It was very negative football and was ultimately the reason that Carvalhal left.
This season just gone began under Carvalhal and Rhodes didn't feature for many of the games, often restricted to 5-10 minute sub appearances and he's evidently not good at making a difference off the bench. In games where he played a decent number of minutes tho, he tended to do well. 4 goals from the 8 games he played over a hour, which is back to his old scoring numbers.
In comes a new manager around Xmas, against a backdrop of a squad decimated by injuries, and he went full defensive, 5 at the back, to stop losing games. Wednesday scored just 2 goals in the first 5 games under him. From there Rhodes was simply kept out by the form of other strikers. Joao's pace made a difference in a defensive lineup, and Nuhiu's physicality was a good foil for him. Joao scored 7 in 11, Nuhiu finished the season with 9 in his last 8 games. Again, Rhodes on the bench despite not really doing anything wrong, you just can't argue with that kind of scoring form.

So overall, I don't think there's any honest concern over Rhodes' form. When he plays, he still scores. The problem for him is that he wasn't playing, and that needs to change this season. He's shown from the time at Boro that he'd rather be playing than sitting on the bench, taking a paycut to join Wednesday. I imagine he'll either move this summer or force his way into the starting lineup. if he doesn't he'll move in January for sure. The obstacles for him are other strikers in form. Not just Joao and Nuhiu, but Fernando Forestieri, Gary Hooper, Steven Fletcher, Sam Winnall and potentially Marco Matias. All of those are fighting for 1 or 2 striking spots, which is crazy.

Tbh I'd seriously consider taking Rhodes for Scotland, as is.
We need more threat in attack. Maybe I'm just bummed from having watched McBurnie and Phillips battle on their own, isolated up front over the last 2 games, and our 1 goal in the last 5.
Clearly Rhodes hasn't suddenly become a bad player, and witht he delivery of Andy Roberston he seems like the ideal guy to have on the end of it.

Looks a decent side to me:

Griffiths - Rhodes
Robertson - Armstrong - McGregor - McTominay - Paterson
Tierney - McKenna - Hendry
Gordon

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25 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said:

I'll repeat, i'll be amazed if he plays Paterson at right back.

1) He doesn't play there for his club

2) He never played him there against Peru/Mexico.

It'll either be Tierney there or O'Donnell IMO.

If we play a back four I could see it being McRorie, even though he doesn’t play there for his club yet. Not in a back 3/5 though. I hope it isn’t Tierney.

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11 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said:

I'm not sure McRorie is a full back.

He's not.  He's a holding midfielder who can fill in at CH if required (but only as a last resort).  He doesn't have the pace or engine to play full/wing back.

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11 minutes ago, Fairbairn said:

He's not.  He's a holding midfielder who can fill in at CH if required (but only as a last resort).  He doesn't have the pace or engine to play full/wing back.

Aye that was my view on him too, certainly not a full back.

I really don't get folks fascination with playing players in positions they've never played!

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11 minutes ago, Fairbairn said:

He's not.  He's a holding midfielder who can fill in at CH if required (but only as a last resort).  He doesn't have the pace or engine to play full/wing back.

I disagree, he has plenty of pace. If we play with a back four we need players who can head and tackle and have pace. He may find his way blocked in midfield for Scotland (by McTominay especially), but he’s too good to be omitted. 

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2 hours ago, Squirrelhumper said:

I'll repeat, i'll be amazed if he plays Paterson at right back.

1) He doesn't play there for his club

2) He never played him there against Peru/Mexico.

It'll either be Tierney there or O'Donnell IMO.

Jack Hendry is more likely surely. Right centre back or right back.

O’Donnell could be a good back up option .

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43 minutes ago, er yir macaroon said:

I disagree, he has plenty of pace. If we play with a back four we need players who can head and tackle and have pace. He may find his way blocked in midfield for Scotland (by McTominay especially), but he’s too good to be omitted. 

 

I take it you're a Rangers fan? Anytime I've seen him. pace hasn't been a big attribute of his.

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2 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said:

 

I take it you're a Rangers fan? Anytime I've seen him. pace hasn't been a big attribute of his.

Nope. He’s not lacking in pace to the extent it would rule him out at full back. He’s very highly thought of by coaches, and i think he’ll be accommodated in our weakest position.

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A formation would be a help.

Really think we need to play a back four with our best player (Robertson) in his correct position and the rest of the team in their usual positions. Which brings us back to the Tierney problem. Personally think he is a good enough player to be better than all our options at right back with the possible exception of Fraser. If not left mid or left side of central defence might be stronger with him in one of those positions .

And before any one brings it up my previous question suggestion about picking all the Celtic players in position and leaving out Robertsonwas purely hypothetical

 

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