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Who would you have back in the squad


robbo cop

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4 hours ago, Parklife said:

Charlie Adam is a proven failure. He's played 26 times for Scotland and, bar the odd good performance, has been pretty shite. He now struggles to get in an absolutely dire Stoke team. 

I'm sorry but no way in hell is he more worthy of a place in the Scotland team than John McGinn. 

Your logic remind me of when Faddy & Fletch on here argued with me that Danny Fox was better than Lee Wallace because "if Wallace was as good, he'd be playing with Celtic and not Hearts". Deeply, deeply flawed "logic". 

Totally agree on this.

If you look back through recent years we have had many players at big EPL clubs who have just not cut it for us at international level. There have been players such as Adam (Liverpool), Stewart (Man. United)and now many are rounding on Ritchie (Newcastle United). Probably seen as our most influential stand-out players in recent years have been players who have broken into the side whilst in the SPL and spent the majority of their careers in the SPL with those being McFadden, Brown and Ferguson.

Just because a player hasn't been snaffled up by an EPL club means nothing. There are big reasons for that. Those clubs now have BIG money to spend and now go down the global shopping route - even young English talent are being pushed out of favour. In short clubs look in different markets now for purchases but that does not mean players like McGinn, Armstrong, McGregor and Tierney etc are no good.

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33 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Totally agree on this.

If you look back through recent years we have had many players at big EPL clubs who have just not cut it for us at international level. There have been players such as Adam (Liverpool), Stewart (Man. United)and now many are rounding on Ritchie (Newcastle United). Probably seen as our most influential stand-out players in recent years have been players who have broken into the side whilst in the SPL and spent the majority of their careers in the SPL with those being McFadden, Brown and Ferguson.

Just because a player hasn't been snaffled up by an EPL club means nothing. There are big reasons for that. Those clubs now have BIG money to spend and now go down the global shopping route - even young English talent are being pushed out of favour. In short clubs look in different markets now for purchases but that does not mean players like McGinn, Armstrong, McGregor and Tierney etc are no good.

How many caps did McFadden have before he moved south or get after he came back?

If any one is bored enough to check out the stats I doubt it there has been one player playing in the SPL with a dozen caps out side of the old firm in over 20 years like it or not if you are any good you don't play for Hibs, Aberdeen or Montrose. You really are clutching at straws if you think a player any were near international class will still be playing here by the time they hit 25 unless they are prepared to give up on £100,000 to live near their mother. Should bring back testimonials to keep decent players at little clubs

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16 minutes ago, ceudmilefailte said:

How many caps did McFadden have before he moved south or get after he came back?

If any one is bored enough to check out the stats I doubt it there has been one player playing in the SPL with a dozen caps out side of the old firm in over 20 years like it or not if you are any good you don't play for Hibs, Aberdeen or Montrose. You really are clutching at straws if you think a player any were near international class will still be playing here by the time they hit 25 unless they are prepared to give up on £100,000 to live near their mother. Should bring back testimonials to keep decent players at little clubs

Not sure what point you are trying to make.

My point is Scotland team should be made up of players depending on form and have sod all to do with what club they play for. Charlie Adam was rank for us when he was at Liverpool and we've had other youngsters at Liverpool who bombed. It is no guarantee of anything just because they play in the EPL. Look at the pelters Ritchie is taking just now and he is in the EPL with Newcastle. McGinn is at Hibs and has half a dozen caps and counting and is way ahead of Charlie Adam in terms of pecking order for us. That just proves my point.

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46 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Not sure what point you are trying to make.

My point is Scotland team should be made up of players depending on form and have sod all to do with what club they play for. Charlie Adam was rank for us when he was at Liverpool and we've had other youngsters at Liverpool who bombed. It is no guarantee of anything just because they play in the EPL. Look at the pelters Ritchie is taking just now and he is in the EPL with Newcastle. McGinn is at Hibs and has half a dozen caps and counting and is way ahead of Charlie Adam in terms of pecking order for us. That just proves my point.

Not saying playing in the EPL makes you an international player, just pointing out that if no one wants you outside the SPL or at the old firm you are not that good. If McGinn is as good as some on here think he will not be at Hibs next season. If you just pick inform players Ritchie would have 50 caps, Phillips 45 Adams 50 etc etc adapting to international football isn't just about ability or being  on form no matter what league you are in.

Hope McGinn turns out great but so far he has doe he has done nothing. Has he even  played a competitive international yet?

Point is- historically you have to be play at a higher level than mid table spl and no matter what  sort form you appear to be in

 

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2 minutes ago, ceudmilefailte said:

Not saying playing in the EPL makes you an international player, just pointing out that if no one wants you outside the SPL or at the old firm you are not that good. If McGinn is as good as some on here think he will not be at Hibs next season. If you just pick inform players Ritchie would have 50 caps, Phillips 45 Adams 50 etc etc adapting to international football isn't just about ability or being  on form no matter what league you are in.

Hope McGinn turns out great but so far he has doe he has done nothing. Has he even  played a competitive international yet?

Point is- historically you have to be play at a higher level than mid table spl and no matter what  sort form you appear to be in

 

That still doesn't add up though.

I will say one name.....David Healy. Northern Ireland's record goalscorer and is even above our highest ever international goalscorer and he bummed around in the lower leagues in England for almost his entire career. 

Our most potent goalscorer in recent years......Kenny Miller. He played the majority of his career in the SPL.

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10 hours ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Lets remember though that the Portuguese league is a standard above the SPL. Sure he is still some way of a place in our squad at present. He needs regular first team football on a long-term basis and even if that is to be at his current club then he should be considered seriously.

The Portuguese league isn’t great. I would agree it’s a slightly better standard than the Scottish Premiership, particularly with Rangers being in the state they are but it’s nowhere near as good as the English, German, Spanish, Italian or even French League. 

The club he’s playing for at the moment have a ground with a capacity of 8-9 thousand and they are towards the bottom of the league so he is hardly playing for a top side.

Having said that, I notice that you did not quote the part of my post that stated he may be worth a call up if he establishes himself in the Aves team. If he starts regularly for the club he’s on loan at and plays well then I wouldn’t mind seeing him in the squad. I just don’t think he should get one if he continues to start on the bench. I am a great believer in international footballers being regular starters for their clubs. 

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1 minute ago, Texas Pete said:

The Portuguese league isn’t great. I would agree it’s a slightly better standard than the Scottish Premiership, particularly with Rangers being in the state they are but it’s nowhere near as good as the English, German, Spanish, Italian or even French League. 

The club he’s playing for at the moment have a ground with a capacity of 8-9 thousand and they are towards the bottom of the league so he is hardly playing for a top side.

Having said that, I notice that you did not quote the part of my post that stated he may be worth a call up if he establishes himself in the Aves team. If he starts regularly for the club he’s on loan at and plays well then I wouldn’t mind seeing him in the squad. I just don’t think he should get one if he continues to start on the bench. I am a great believer in international footballers being regular starters for their clubs. 

We are, in general, in agreement. Just now, where he is not getting first team football regularly then he is not a realistic call-up candidate. However, if that changes and he gets a good run of consecutive matches and puts in encouraging performances he is certainly worth a look. He is a bit like Oliver Burke as in he was identified at a young age as having talent and has shown it but not for some time so at present it is no thanks but the door remains open.

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39 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

That still doesn't add up though.

I will say one name.....David Healy. Northern Ireland's record goalscorer and is even above our highest ever international goalscorer and he bummed around in the lower leagues in England for almost his entire career. 

Our most potent goalscorer in recent years......Kenny Miller. He played the majority of his career in the SPL.

David Healy should be left out of football discussions 

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In terms of a squad, I'd have (assuming everyone is fit):

  • Goalkeepers: Gordon, Marshall
  • Defenders: Berra, Tierney, Anya (as wing back option)
  • Midfielders: Fletcher, McArthur, Snodgrass, maybe Bannan, maybe Morrison
  • Strikers: Griffiths, maybe Martin, maybe Fletcher

You need a mix of experience and youth to get through the qualifiers, I think.

In terms of a starting line-up, I'd happily take something like this:

Marshall

Tierney - McKenna - Berra - Hendry - Robertson

Armstrong - Fletcher - McGinn

Snodgrass

Griffiths

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3 hours ago, Caledonian Craig said:

We are, in general, in agreement. Just now, where he is not getting first team football regularly then he is not a realistic call-up candidate. However, if that changes and he gets a good run of consecutive matches and puts in encouraging performances he is certainly worth a look. He is a bit like Oliver Burke as in he was identified at a young age as having talent and has shown it but not for some time so at present it is no thanks but the door remains open.

I think he has had some injury problems so if he is as good as we hope he is and he stays fit he should hopefully get a run in the team and possibly a move back to Sporting or another top team. 

If that happens then he’ll definitely catch McLeish’s eye.

To be fair to the guy, he’s trying to make it out there and hasn’t fled back to British football with his tail between his legs. 

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