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exile

TV licence and iPlayer etc

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So it seems that if they think you are not paying the TV licence they send you a threatening letter - that basically assumes you are already guilty and breaking the law - threatening 'enforcement', an 'investigation', a 'visit', and threatening fine and possible prosecution and court appearance.

To avoid this - even if you don't have or use a TV - you have to register with them, as if we live in a police state - but why should we agree to be on their list?

There are also threats that say that it's against the law to download or watch BBC programmes on iPlayer whether using a TV, computer, mobile phone 'or anything else'.

However,...  it's not clear who or where this applies to - does it apply to anyone at a property where a TV licence was once held?

If you have a visitor, for example, who is a TV licence holder elsewhere, can't they use iPlayer anywhere? For example if they can use the iPlayer on their laptop on the train, or on their phone walking down the street, does it mean when they arrive at your house or flat it's suddenly illegal?

 

 ;

Edited by exile

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I'm no expert but I believe the basic premise of the law is that you have to have a TV license to watch live TV - any live TV, be it BBC, ITV, Sky, etc.  The second part of this is that it's tied to premises, so for example, say you have two houses you have to have two TV licenses, you can't say that I'm only watching TV in one house at any one time.

The problem of course is that the law is way out of date and is based on a time where there was only live TV, there was no concept of catch up TV or on demand or mobile.

I understand that the law is going to be changed and to be fair it needs to be but as I understand it, there is currently no legal bar to watching iPlayer on catch up only, it's only if you use iPlayer to watch live TV that you need a license.

The situation you describe of someone who has a license turning up with his laptop at your house is an interesting one, similarly, is there a difference between someone turning up at your house who has a license and then you all watching iPlayer on your laptop, is there any difference?   I doubt these would ever get tested in court.

The BBC have tried to mitigate against lost license revenue by implementing a registration and login before using it and obviously they are going to be looking for people registered that they don't have license details for but I think the BBC basically work off an assumption of presumed guilt, that every household has a TV and they use the same strongarm tactics  and threats you've mentioned for any household that doesn't have the TV license.

FWIW, I think you should have to have a license to watch iPlayer, including catch up.  If you don't want to pay the license fee, fair enough, but don't watch the BBC either.

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Thanks. Actually I was trying to avoid getting entangled in what the system 'should be' ;) but FWIW I agree there's a logical case for saying you should have to pay for iPlayer because you're helping fund BBC content. However by the same logic you should not have to pay for watching commercial TV - I'd happily watch only non BBC TV ifby doing so I could avoid the licence fee.

In this case I think watching iPlayer legally without a licence is similar morally to listening to BBC radio - it's not parasitic but a matter of cross-subsidy paid for by people who want old-fashioned 20th Century telly.

And yes the scenario I'm on about is someone turning up who has their own licence elsewhere and registered with iPlayer, letting you watch their laptop, in a property where you personally have no licence. I think it's hard to imagine there is anything legally in place to stop that happening - it's easier to imagine the download/watch rule applying (only) to a device.

I suspect the TV licensing people are deliberately misleading us here - that's me presuming guilt in return.

 

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1 hour ago, exile said:

Thanks. Actually I was trying to avoid getting entangled in what the system 'should be' ;) but FWIW I agree there's a logical case for saying you should have to pay for iPlayer because you're helping fund BBC content. However by the same logic you should not have to pay for watching commercial TV - I'd happily watch only non BBC TV ifby doing so I could avoid the licence fee.

In this case I think watching iPlayer legally without a licence is similar morally to listening to BBC radio - it's not parasitic but a matter of cross-subsidy paid for by people who want old-fashioned 20th Century telly.

And yes the scenario I'm on about is someone turning up who has their own licence elsewhere and registered with iPlayer, letting you watch their laptop, in a property where you personally have no licence. I think it's hard to imagine there is anything legally in place to stop that happening - it's easier to imagine the download/watch rule applying (only) to a device.

I suspect the TV licensing people are deliberately misleading us here - that's me presuming guilt in return.

 

Up until 1971 you were supposed to have a separate radio license if you only had a radio.   It was scrapped presumably because if applied to so few people that the cost of operating the scheme vastly outweighed the revenue raised.

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Been licence free for a while. All correspondence is sent to The Legal Occupier. Two visits from TVL staff in the last three years. Confirmed nothing and told them to leave. It really is that simple. The letters are toothless rubbish. Don’t even open them,bin them. Don’t confirm anything to anyone at your door and never let them in your house.

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3 hours ago, BlueGaz said:

I refuse to pay it and nothing ever been done. Letters, yes, action, no. 

 

 

1 hour ago, rolaaand said:

Been licence free for a while. All correspondence is sent to The Legal Occupier. Two visits from TVL staff in the last three years. Confirmed nothing and told them to leave. It really is that simple. The letters are toothless rubbish. Don’t even open them,bin them. Don’t confirm anything to anyone at your door and never let them in your house.

Do either of you continue to watch the BBC?

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I don’t have a licence and get the letters. I’m looking forward to my Christmas letter where they tell me they won’t send anyone for a few weeks over the festive period but they'll be battering down the door from 3rd of January onward. I bought Columbo box set and due to work I watch lots of tv when I’m at my clients homes. I do watch tv at home and I may be proved wrong but I’m fairly sure I don’t watch anything on bbc channels. If David Attenborough’s new series is out on dvd someone will buy it for me at Christmas and I’ll catch up on ones I’ve missed that way. I really wish they’d find a way to block bbc so I could openly watch tv but not pay the bbc fee or just allow adverts. I listen to lots of radio and download plays from radio4, not sure how this goes licence fee wise. 

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If you said you could reduce your sky/virgin/bt package by £12 a month by ditching a couple of channels you rarely watch, most folk would bite your hand off if they hadn’t already done it.

Seems unfair and not right that you have to pay for the BBC channels whether you watch/want them or not.

If I got the option, I’d happily take BBC out my package and put the £12 towards sky sports or something I’d actually watch.

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The tv license isn’t just for the bbc channels though, if you watch any live tv you need the license. Or you could go rogue and just not pay it, the visits from the cunts are always entertaining. 

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Legally, you need the license if you watch live TV or if you access BBC iPlayer for live or on demand.

I quit paying last year cos the place i moved to can't have a satellite dish fitted for Sky, and the terrestrial aerial for Freeview is inaccessible.

I had the occupant letters along with a couple of visits when I was at work.

Deleted iPlayer from all my devices and replied back saying that I cannot view BBC stuff on any device and I don't watch live TV (which is true).

Had nothing since and I stick to the law entirely

which is a bit daft cos technically the BBC iplayer watermark is completely by-passable if you hack a wireless network

which is a piece of a piss if you have a windows machine that allows you access to cmd and has a wireless card

you just type in:

"netsh wlan show profiles"

and you get a list of all available wireless networks, then you pick a wireless network that's visible and then type in the name of a network where it says "networkname"

netsh wlan show profile "networkname" key=clear

and then you get a network key that allows you to access that network

WPA encryption is utter shyte

try it and see if you can "access" your neighbours network....

I also claimed back £200 as I forgot to cancel my license from my old address.

Took about a month. Don't follow their "we need paper replies" pish.

They're run by Indians. Just be polite and tell them you hope they don't get attacked by leopards on their commute when you email them

Edited by brant grebner

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