Barney Rubble Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 10 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said: This column by Kenny says it all:- https://www.sundaypost.com/fp/sfa-are-kidding-themselves-on-but-if-they-want-me-as-manager-ill-tell-them-not-anyone-else/ Presumably he did not apply this time either then. Ferguson could have had the job anytime he wanted. Most notably after the 1986 World Cup but he jacked it in for the United job. No doubt he could have had the job anytime he wanted it but no. Sorry but people who don't want it are worse than people that do. Good shout about Jordan. You do get it that while Kenny, SAF, Graeme Souness et al are candidates and may even have been interested in the job, it has to be on their terms? And you better bet your life that the SFA wouldn't have been willing to accept those terms. Doesn't mean they didn't want the job though. As for Joe Jordan, it is incredible given his CV as a coach at the top level, alongside his record as a Scotland player, that he has never part of the coaching staff at some point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 4 minutes ago, Toepoke said: No he went back to managing Aberdeen. The squad were barely back home from Mexico when Andy Roxburgh was appointed manager. Seemed like an odd call but what was unknown at the time was that Jock Stein had earmarked Roxy as his successor. He has already made Archie Knox co-manager at Aberdeen whilst he was Scotland boss then quit Scotland role after the World Cup exit and joined United. But point remains that the job was his anytime he wanted it but evidently not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, Barney Rubble said: You do get it that while Kenny, SAF, Graeme Souness et al are candidates and may even have been interested in the job, it has to be on their terms? And you better bet your life that the SFA wouldn't have been willing to accept those terms. Doesn't mean they didn't want the job though. As for Joe Jordan, it is incredible given his CV as a coach at the top level, alongside his record as a Scotland player, that he has never part of the coaching staff at some point. It is easy to paint any type of picture we want given the paint and brushes. By this I mean McLeish can be painted as a judas because he left the job but yet Ferguson isn't and he left it as well never to return. And the others you mention are equally culpable for not standing for the job even when they have been unemployed. Yes we all know the incompetence of the SFA and the root and the total overhaul it has needed for decades. However, that is no excuse for the likes of people seen as capable of walking on water by fans (Ferguson and Dalglish) not taking the job and using the players at their disposal to get us back to a major tournament. Vogts nearly managed it, McLeish flirted with it and Strachan at one point in the last campaign looked like he may get us to a last ditch play-off - those all at a time with the same rank rotten SFA at the helm. If they almost managed it without upsetting the SFA applecart then surely Dalglish or Ferguson could have. But they refuse to step forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bino's Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said: It is easy to paint any type of picture we want given the paint and brushes. By this I mean McLeish can be painted as a judas because he left the job but yet Ferguson isn't and he left it as well never to return. And the others you mention are equally culpable for not standing for the job even when they have been unemployed. Yes we all know the incompetence of the SFA and the root and the total overhaul it has needed for decades. However, that is no excuse for the likes of people seen as capable of walking on water by fans (Ferguson and Dalglish) not taking the job and using the players at their disposal to get us back to a major tournament. Vogts nearly managed it, McLeish flirted with it and Strachan at one point in the last campaign looked like he may get us to a last ditch play-off - those all at a time with the same rank rotten SFA at the helm. If they almost managed it without upsetting the SFA applecart then surely Dalglish or Ferguson could have. But they refuse to step forward. Is the point not that Ferguson just didn't want the job But, in part, McLeish wanted the job to raise his profile so he could get other jobs Which for any fan is very hard to take Btw, dalglish is a shite manager Edited February 16, 2018 by Bino's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 CC, it's not an OBLIGATION to take the Scotland job, which is what you seem to be making it out to be. The SFA and the rest of us have no right to expect that SAF, KD, GS will take the job just because it's available It's up to the SFA to make it ATTRACTIVE for someone to take it on. There's a reason Michael O'Neill didn't bite, and it's very likely the same one that SAF et al haven't done so either in the past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 1 minute ago, Bino's said: Is the point not that Ferguson just didn't want the job But, in part, McLeish wanted the job to raise his profile so he could get other jobs Which for any fan is very hard to take Depends how you look at it I suppose. And I am being guilty again of speaking from a fans viewpoint. In my eyes the Scotland job should be one every Scot wants but evidently to Scottish football managers that is far from the case. From my point of view I give more kudos to those that have tried and failed than those that haven't tried at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 (edited) 43 minutes ago, Barney Rubble said: Your memory is being selective. It was a good performance, but one that was full of holes. Italy did what THEY had to do in that game, ably aided by Davie Weir handing Luca Toni the initiative within a minute. After that they ran the show, and were denied a legitimate second goal from Di Natale. We got a dodgy equaliser from Ferguson, and then the supposed chance that Faddy missed which has grown arms and legs and ten years on has become a sitter. It wasn't. And let's draw a veil over the last couple of minutes, where Kris Boyd made no difference at all at any end of the park. I just watched the highlights that Caledonian Craig posted and McFadden should have buried that chance. Sitter is maybe a bit strong though. We more than held our own against the world champions for most of that game though (based on my memory of the game and not the highlights I’ve just watched). Edited February 16, 2018 by Texas Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macy37 Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 Cunts on here are hilarious. Demand root and branch change then get right behind a jobs for the boys appointment of a man who’s already failed in the position. The National side will continue to slide and no wonder with folk like them who continue to be short changed yet still believe things will magically get better. Not a chance with these blind blazered men in charge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Texas Pete said: I just watched the highlights that Caledonian Craig posted and McFadden should have buried that chance. Sitter is maybe a bit strong though. We more than held our own against the world champions for most of that game though (based on my memory of the game and not the highlights I’ve just watched). Handing a team - any team - a goal in the first minute and claiming you held your own against them and still got gubbed is stretching credibility. Using your measure, my team (Thistle) more than held our own against Celtic last Saturday from the 10th minute onwards. But we still don't feature in the next round of the cup as far as I can see. Edited February 16, 2018 by Barney Rubble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 Just now, macy37 said: Cunts on here are hilarious. Demand root and branch change then get right behind a jobs for the boys appointment of a man who’s already failed in the position. The National side will continue to slide and no wonder with folk like them who continue to be short changed yet still believe things will magically get better. Not a chance with these blind blazered men in charge. FFS everyone knows the SFA are useless. However, what are you and every Scotland supporter going to be able to do about it. Nothing, nil, nada, sod all, zilch, zero. The SFA in their incompetent guise have been in place for decades now and will be for several more unless they decide otherwise. They are like the mafia and have a vice-like grip on the game and there is nothing any of us can do about it. Booing McLeish helps nobody. It may make you feel better but it doesn't help improve things on the pitch which is what every Scotland football fan should want regardless of who is the manager. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 14 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said: Depends how you look at it I suppose. And I am being guilty again of speaking from a fans viewpoint. In my eyes the Scotland job should be one every Scot wants but evidently to Scottish football managers that is far from the case. From my point of view I give more kudos to those that have tried and failed than those that haven't tried at all. International management jobs are not as attractive as club jobs for most managers. It’s just a fact of life. Even the smaller EPL or decent championship clubs traditionally pay more than the SFA, international management is not a full time job, the Scotland job is a bit of a poisoned chalice and you need to put up with a lot of shite from the press and some ‘fans’ when we don’t qualify. I have absolutely no problem with managers that would prefer to stay in club management than take the Scotland job. All I ask is that anyone who does manage Scotland tries their best, picks on form players and not their favourites and makes sensible tactical decisions (such as playing at least one striker in every game). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceudmilefailte Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 1 hour ago, Texas Pete said: Pish. Rangers wouldn’t want him. They’ve had months to approach him. Why would they do it after 4 friendly results? He’ll only start to get job offers if he’s a success with Scotland and either gets us to Euro 2020 or gets within a baw hair of doing so. If it's still 24 teams half of Europe qualifies for the finals so that isn't even respectable, qualifying from the group stages at finals would be even that would only be last 16. As for getting us within a baw hair, if that's the best he can do he should never manage again. Forget just getting us to the finals as an achievement, get us there playing football that would at least slightly worry some of the better teams is what is required. Or are some of us getting desperate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, Barney Rubble said: Handing a team - any team - a goal in the first minute and claiming you held your own against them and still got gubbed is stretching credibility. My team (Thistle) more than held our own against Celtic last Saturday from the 10th minute onwards. But we don't feature in the next round of the cup as far as I can see. Statistics-wise suggest it wasn't a one-sided affair:- Scotland Team Statistics Italy 1 Goals 2 0 1st Half Goals 1 6 Shots on Target 9 5 Shots off Target 4 3 Blocked Shots 3 6 Corners 4 30 Fouls 21 3 Offsides 3 2 Yellow Cards 1 0 Red Cards 0 72.5 Passing Success 73.4 23 Tackles 19 73.9 Tackles Success 94.7 56.3 Possession 43.7 52 Territorial Advantage 48 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 4 minutes ago, Barney Rubble said: Handing a team - any team - a goal in the first minute and claiming you held your own against them and still got gubbed is stretching credibility. Using your measure, my team (Thistle) more than held our own against Celtic last Saturday from the 10th minute onwards. But we still don't feature in the next round of the cup as far as I can see. Your comment lost all credibility when you said we got gubbed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, Texas Pete said: International management jobs are not as attractive as club jobs for most managers. It’s just a fact of life. Even the smaller EPL or decent championship clubs traditionally pay more than the SFA, international management is not a full time job, the Scotland job is a bit of a poisoned chalice and you need to put up with a lot of shite from the press and some ‘fans’ when we don’t qualify. I have absolutely no problem with managers that would prefer to stay in club management than take the Scotland job. All I ask is that anyone who does manage Scotland tries their best, picks on form players and not their favourites and makes sensible tactical decisions (such as playing at least one striker in every game). Yes I see that and can agree with that. But how about when the likes of Ferguson and Dalglish haven't even stepped up when they have been out of management? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 I don't think that anyone has said on here that they will boo the new manager - I stand to be corrected though. Having said that, it is already evident that he has minimal, and I mean minimal, margin for error. He has to win the opening two friendlies to give him slack for the ill-considered jaunt over the Atlantic. He's toast anyway if he fails to win the home games v Albania and Israel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave78 Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, ceudmilefailte said: Or are some of us getting desperate? At this stage, aye. I'd take Martin O'Neil hoofball if it meant grinding out results and qualifying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, Texas Pete said: Your comment lost all credibility when you said we got gubbed. Whether it was 1-2 or 1-6 we lost a game we had to win. So we got gubbed - no two ways about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceudmilefailte Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, Dave78 said: At this stage, aye. I'd take Martin O'Neil hoofball if it meant grinding out results and qualifying. Think Iv'e reached the point of not caring if we don't qualify and are shit or do qualify and are shit. A shit is a shit any way you dress it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Barney Rubble said: I don't think that anyone has said on here that they will boo the new manager - I stand to be corrected though. Having said that, it is already evident that he has minimal, and I mean minimal, margin for error. He has to win the opening two friendlies to give him slack for the ill-considered jaunt over the Atlantic. He's toast anyway if he fails to win the home games v Albania and Israel. Yes I agree there is minimal margin for error as a big proportion of the fans don't want him so tolerance levels will be very low. The knives will be out ultra-quick. I've said before he wouldn't have been my choice for the job but we are where we are and we have to make the best of it. He had a 70% success rate last time around so we have to hold onto that for positivity. Negativity loses you games before a ball is kicked. Edited February 16, 2018 by Caledonian Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 12 minutes ago, ceudmilefailte said: If it's still 24 teams half of Europe qualifies for the finals so that isn't even respectable, qualifying from the group stages at finals would be even that would only be last 16. As for getting us within a baw hair, if that's the best he can do he should never manage again. Forget just getting us to the finals as an achievement, get us there playing football that would at least slightly worry some of the better teams is what is required. Or are some of us getting desperate? Aren’t we currently ranked 27th in Europe or something? If that is a genuine reflection of how good we are then qualifying for Euro 2020 would be an achievement. I didn’t actually say getting within a baw hair of qualifying would be a good achievement. I said McLeish won’t be getting any job offers unless he does at least that. Whoever I was replying to seems to think he’ll be offered the Rangers job if he gets a couple of decent results in our next 4 meaningless friendlies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macy37 Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 14 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said: FFS everyone knows the SFA are useless. However, what are you and every Scotland supporter going to be able to do about it. Nothing, nil, nada, sod all, zilch, zero. The SFA in their incompetent guise have been in place for decades now and will be for several more unless they decide otherwise. They are like the mafia and have a vice-like grip on the game and there is nothing any of us can do about it. Booing McLeish helps nobody. It may make you feel better but it doesn't help improve things on the pitch which is what every Scotland football fan should want regardless of who is the manager. Happy clapper cheerleader. And sadly there’s plenty in that camp. Dont renew, don’t go to matches. It’s not Rocket science. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daviebee Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 1 hour ago, Caledonian Craig said: Right I get the picture but at least he has taken the job in the first place like he did in 2007 so kudos to him for that. I prefer saving my angst for those that have turned their back on the Scotland job at every turn ie messrs Ferguson, Dalglish, Graham, Moyes etc etc etc. Of course he's taken the job - he was unemployed, i.e. no other fker wanted him just like in 2007! You seriously think he's doing us a favour? Ffs he was hoorin himself to Ibrox just a few short weeks ago! (I wish tae fck he'd got that gig.) While I admire your "it's done, it's time to get behind him" attitude, I'm just too fkin angry right now at these lily-livered pricks at the SFA to do the same. Yet again they've shown no ambition and no forward thinking by just going and getting the nearest available dinosaur. Fkin hell if Walter Smith had been interested HE'D have been in the job right now. THAT'S the type of fvckwits we're dealing with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 6 minutes ago, Barney Rubble said: Whether it was 1-2 or 1-6 we lost a game we had to win. So we got gubbed - no two ways about it. Only if you don’t understand the meaning of the word gubbed. It certainly doesn’t mean narrowly defeated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 (edited) 1 minute ago, macy37 said: Happy clapper cheerleader. And sadly there’s plenty in that camp. Dont renew, don’t go to matches. It’s not Rocket science. Been tried elsewhere to no effect whatsoever. And yes I will always cheer on the national side - doesn't mean I am cheering on the SFA. Edited February 16, 2018 by Caledonian Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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