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To stay or go?


andyD

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Last manager to get us close to a tournament was foreign, say what you want about Berti but he bled some decent young players so set up smith and mcleish (yes i remember the faeros too). I would have a lars lagerback with a scottish assistant (someone like john hughes). We have time to get some young guys in with some friendlies and this euro nations thing. 

We need fresh eyes and a new look.

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11 minutes ago, stevenmcn said:

I think the question should be why rather than why not. If finishing 4th in the Scottish league, almost 20 points off second is now a quality required for the national job then we really are in the $hit. And people wanting Moyes for the job are eejits? 

Put doon yer FIFA Playstation games and away and educate yourself about the real life part of football son.

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5 minutes ago, jamboman said:

Last manager to get us close to a tournament was foreign, say what you want about Berti but he bled some decent young players so set up smith and mcleish (yes i remember the faeros too). I would have a lars lagerback with a scottish assistant (someone like john hughes). We have time to get some young guys in with some friendlies and this euro nations thing. 

We need fresh eyes and a new look.

John Hughes should only be mentioned if the words "never in a million fkin years" are in there somewhere too.  Lagerback would've been ideal but some other underachievers got in there first.

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3 minutes ago, daviebee said:

John Hughes should only be mentioned if the words "never in a million fkin years" are in there somewhere too.  Lagerback would've been ideal but some other underachievers got in there first.

Ok maybe not yogi but you get the idea of what i mean. 

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11 minutes ago, Ormond said:

Put doon yer FIFA Playstation games and away and educate yourself about the real life part of football son.

I don't play computer games mate, so you'll have to educate me. What has Tommy Wright done to make him a candidate for the Scotland job, it's a simple question if you actually have a reason other than he manages your team. Why would he be better than someone like Davie Moyes who has managed at a way higher level?

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1 minute ago, stevenmcn said:

I don't play computer games mate, so you'll have to educate me. What has Tommy Wright done to make him a candidate for the Scotland job, it's a simple question if you actually have a reason other than he manages your team. Why would he be better than someone like Davie Moyes who has managed at a way higher level?

Tommy Wright has a track record of getting players playing to their maximum on a consistent basis. He has, over a number of years, shown that he has the ability to make a team better than the sum of it's parts. 

I don't think Tommy Wright is the best choice but looking at what he's achieved, i can see why people think that he has the attributes we should be looking for. 

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22 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

To be fair, extremely successful club managers, in terms of titles and silverware, dont often translate into successful International managers

There is no tried and tested method - Andy Roxburgh being a prime example 

 

 

That's a fair point, but if I remember correctly Roxburgh had some sort of success at youth level with Scotland, so at least had something on his CV. 

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29 minutes ago, jamboman said:

Last manager to get us close to a tournament was foreign, say what you want about Berti but he bled some decent young players so set up smith and mcleish (yes i remember the faeros too). 

McLeish got us closer to a finals.

Btw I'm not opposed to another foreign boss...

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1 minute ago, stevenmcn said:

I don't play computer games mate, so you'll have to educate me. What has Tommy Wright done to make him a candidate for the Scotland job, it's a simple question if you actually have a reason other than he manages your team. Why would he be better than someone like Davie Moyes who has managed at a way higher level?

Davie Moyes was a failure with a gazillion pounds at his disposal. Wright is a carbon copy of O’ Neill who both can clearly get the best out of very average players. Year after year after year Wright has proved this working with guys who amongst the worst paid in the league. Consistently qualifying for Europe and even our national trophy thrown in for good measure. Wright is no flash in the pan either as it’s his consistency that proves how tactically astute he is. To struggle to compete with the massive money gap between Celtic and Aberdeen respectively is nothing to be ashamed about at a club as small as Saints. The most succesful manager Scotland ever had came directly from Saints. The second manager we gave Scotland. These days with obsessive media coverage of English football all we ever hear from guys like you is Moyes, Lambert, Souness, yawn, yawn, yawn, etc. Those guys are used to working with multi-million pound players and unlike Wright have no idea how to get the best from a small pool of lads. 

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2 minutes ago, Parklife said:

Tommy Wright has a track record of getting players playing to their maximum on a consistent basis. He has, over a number of years, shown that he has the ability to make a team better than the sum of it's parts. 

I don't think Tommy Wright is the best choice but looking at what he's achieved, i can see why people think that he has the attributes we should be looking for. 

Thank you, at least that's an answer. The problem I have is that doing it in Scotland and doing it at international level are miles apart as you well know. You just have to look to St Johnstone's "European campaign" to see that, and from that matter any Scottish side.

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Just now, Toepoke said:

McLeish got us closer to a finals.

with a team berti made - mcfadden, fletcher, webster, hartley, caldwell. gordon. Without the process of giving all these guys a chance and getting rid of the deadwood we would have never had that euro 2008 and team

 

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2 minutes ago, stevenmcn said:

Thank you, at least that's an answer. The problem I have is that doing it in Scotland and doing it at international level are miles apart as you well know. You just have to look to St Johnstone's "European campaign" to see that, and from that matter any Scottish side.

I answered on the previous page. Pretty much what Parkie was saying.

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3 minutes ago, stevenmcn said:

Thank you, at least that's an answer. The problem I have is that doing it in Scotland and doing it at international level are miles apart as you well know. You just have to look to St Johnstone's "European campaign" to see that, and from that matter any Scottish side.

That doesn't make sense. Wright would have superior players if he were Scotland manager. 

You seem to suffer from the "Scottish football is shite" mentality that many people in this country, including our current manager, have. It is that very attitude that has seen us suffer Bannan, Phillips, Martin and McArthur over the last few days. We need to start actually valuing what we have in Scotland, not just saying "it's shite" and assuming everything from England is wonderful, as the last few qualifying campaigns have proven that is not the case. 

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4 minutes ago, Ormond said:

Davie Moyes was a failure with a gazillion pounds at his disposal. Wright is a carbon copy of O’ Neill who both can clearly get the best out of very average players. Year after year after year Wright has proved this working with guys who amongst the worst paid in the league. Consistently qualifying for Europe and even our national trophy thrown in for good measure. Wright is no flash in the pan either as it’s his consistency that proves how tactically astute he is. To struggle to compete with the massive money gap between Celtic and Aberdeen respectively is nothing to be ashamed about at a club as small as Saints. The most succesful manager Scotland ever had came directly from Saints. The second manager we gave Scotland. These days with obsessive media coverage of English football all we ever hear from guys like you is Moyes, Lambert, Souness, yawn, yawn, yawn, etc. Those guys are used to working with multi-million pound players and unlike Wright have no idea how to get the best from a small pool of lads. 

See, there you go, a reasonable answer without being a patronising Dik. And while I can see and respect your answer I think it would be too big a jump for him as I said above. I think people forget the job Moyes did at Everton where he had to work with a lot less money than a lot of the other clubs and he did a good job at it. He also had success at Preston before that. Now he's just associated with 6 months at Man Utd, where he didn't actually spend that much and still had a better win rate than Van Gaal. If people had been offered Moyes 4-5 years ago most on here would have jumped at it, and I don't see any reason since that changes that. As someone else mentioned he might also feel he has a point to prove now which could benefit us.

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43 minutes ago, jamboman said:

Last manager to get us close to a tournament was foreign, say what you want about Berti but he bled some decent young players so set up smith and mcleish (yes i remember the faeros too). I would have a lars lagerback with a scottish assistant (someone like john hughes). We have time to get some young guys in with some friendlies and this euro nations thing. 

We need fresh eyes and a new look.

John Hughes - Jesus Christ.

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2 minutes ago, stevenmcn said:

See, there you go, a reasonable answer without being a patronising Dik. And while I can see and respect your answer I think it would be too big a jump for him as I said above. I think people forget the job Moyes did at Everton where he had to work with a lot less money than a lot of the other clubs and he did a good job at it. He also had success at Preston before that. Now he's just associated with 6 months at Man Utd, where he didn't actually spend that much and still had a better win rate than Van Gaal. If people had been offered Moyes 4-5 years ago most on here would have jumped at it, and I don't see any reason since that changes that. As someone else mentioned he might also feel he has a point to prove now which could benefit us.

So, you can’t see how that may equate to what Wright has done at Saints? :rolleyes:

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3 minutes ago, stevenmcn said:

See, there you go, a reasonable answer without being a patronising Dik. And while I can see and respect your answer I think it would be too big a jump for him as I said above. I think people forget the job Moyes did at Everton where he had to work with a lot less money than a lot of the other clubs and he did a good job at it. He also had success at Preston before that. Now he's just associated with 6 months at Man Utd, where he didn't actually spend that much and still had a better win rate than Van Gaal. If people had been offered Moyes 4-5 years ago most on here would have jumped at it, and I don't see any reason since that changes that. As someone else mentioned he might also feel he has a point to prove now which could benefit us.

From today's BBC website:

Former Everton, Manchester United, Real Sociedad and Sunderland manager David Moyes believes he's ready for another job at an elite club. "After what happened at Sunderland, I want something that gives me a decent chance to really build something. I did that at Everton," he says.

Forget Moyes.  We'd only ever be seen as a stepping-stone by someone like him even though I think he could do a job for us.

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4 minutes ago, Parklife said:

That doesn't make sense. Wright would have superior players if he were Scotland manager. 

You seem to suffer from the "Scottish football is shite" mentality that many people in this country, including our current manager, have. It is that very attitude that has seen us suffer Bannan, Phillips, Martin and McArthur over the last few days. We need to start actually valuing what we have in Scotland, not just saying "it's shite" and assuming everything from England is wonderful, as the last few qualifying campaigns have proven that is not the case. 

Yes he would have better players, but so would the opposition. No more organising a team to stop Carlos Pena and Chris Erskine, now it's the likes of Ronaldo and Mbappe he as to worry about. Personally I have no interest in what happens in England, but it is still a higher standard than here and I think you only need to see the origin of the teams that ko our clubs out of Europe to see where our level is

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Can you imagine mature knowledgable pure football guys like Andy Roxburgh and Craig Brown, guys you listened to after a game to get their real football opinion on the game from right next to the pitch, having to stomach that @rsehole last night talking about getting men and women together to change the average fkn height of the country's human beings.

His behaviour in interviews has always been the reason he comes across as a complete fool to me and only Michael Stewart and Steven Thompson have had the balls to call it out so far while his other media cronies tip toe around him for fear of him taking the huff.

The SFA should be punting this guy immediately.

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6 minutes ago, Ormond said:

So, you can’t see how that may equate to what Wright has done at Saints? :rolleyes:

Yes I can, which is why I don't understand why you think Moyes wouldn't work but Wright would even though if your going to draw a comparison, Moyes has a better track record.

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6 minutes ago, stevenmcn said:

Yes I can, which is why I don't understand why you think Moyes wouldn't work but Wright would even though if your going to draw a comparison, Moyes has a better track record.

There’s no point trying to debate with another Sky Sports hoor.

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20 minutes ago, stevenmcn said:

See, there you go, a reasonable answer without being a patronising Dik. And while I can see and respect your answer I think it would be too big a jump for him as I said above. I think people forget the job Moyes did at Everton where he had to work with a lot less money than a lot of the other clubs and he did a good job at it. He also had success at Preston before that. Now he's just associated with 6 months at Man Utd, where he didn't actually spend that much and still had a better win rate than Van Gaal. If people had been offered Moyes 4-5 years ago most on here would have jumped at it, and I don't see any reason since that changes that. As someone else mentioned he might also feel he has a point to prove now which could benefit us.

He arrived at Man Utd with them as Champions. So comparing him with LVG is a bit silly as they had vastly different starting points... Since Man Utd Moyes has had two further jobs and been an unqualified failure in them both. He's been a disaster in everything he has done since he left Everton 4 years ago, so it's understandable that people's view on him will have changed. 

12 minutes ago, stevenmcn said:

Yes he would have better players, but so would the opposition. No more organising a team to stop Carlos Pena and Chris Erskine, now it's the likes of Ronaldo and Mbappe he as to worry about. Personally I have no interest in what happens in England, but it is still a higher standard than here and I think you only need to see the origin of the teams that ko our clubs out of Europe to see where our level is

Good comparisons there, mate. That's exactly what international football is like. Every team has a world superstar :rolleyes: 

The EPL is a higher standard of football, correct. That doesn't mean that every single player playing there is superior to what we have up here. How about we actually assess players on their performances and their ability and not which fecking league they play in? 

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