Bristolhibby Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 17 minutes ago, PapofGlencoe said: i think you are misreading him..you're both in agreement... In that case I agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debian Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 39 minutes ago, PapofGlencoe said: lol completely at it. I got some bites Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobby Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 19 hours ago, Debian said: I got some bites Silly season has begun with a new twist. Apparently if Catalonia goes independent Barcelona can play in the English Premier league dont shoot the messenger ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 26 minutes ago, Nobby said: Silly season has begun with a new twist. Apparently if Catalonia goes independent Barcelona can play in the English Premier league dont shoot the messenger ! They are certainly one institution that could suffer if Catalonia becomes independent... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParisInAKilt Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 34 minutes ago, Nobby said: Silly season has begun with a new twist. Apparently if Catalonia goes independent Barcelona can play in the English Premier league dont shoot the messenger ! But Messi can’t do it on a cold wet Wednesday night in Stoke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobby Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 2 hours ago, ParisInAKilt said: But Messi doesnt want to do it on a cold wet Wednesday night in Stoke fixed that ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoonTheSlope Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 2 hours ago, ParisInAKilt said: But Messi can’t do it on a cold wet Wednesday night in Stoke Ronaldo could Just saying likes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumnio Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-41493014 The King of Spain criticises the Catalans for organising the vote, however no comment about police brutality and the systematic beating of his 'subjects'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristolhibby Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 29 minutes ago, kumnio said: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-41493014 The King of Spain criticises the Catalans for organising the vote, however no comment about police brutality and the systematic beating of his 'subjects'. Good of his Maj to remain politically impartial. J Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grim Jim Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 I was disappointed by EU coolness to Scottish independence, though not surprised. Am hacked off by 'our' attitude to this though, and wee Craig is (in diplo speak) astonished... https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2017/10/obliged-reconsider-support-european-union/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumnio Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 Catalonia to declare independence within days says Carles Puigdemont. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ally Bongo Posted October 3, 2017 Author Share Posted October 3, 2017 (edited) 37 minutes ago, Grim Jim said: I was disappointed by EU coolness to Scottish independence, though not surprised. Am hacked off by 'our' attitude to this though, and wee Craig is (in diplo speak) astonished... https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2017/10/obliged-reconsider-support-european-union/ Have stuck by the EU's stance right up to the last 24 hours and have been getting tore into a few Yessers on twitter who were giving them pelters on Sunday The bottom line is that the EU is a trading organisation and does not interfere in the domestic issues of it's members no matter what UKIP and the Tories tell us Thats not to say that they could threaten Spain's EU membership for it's actions once the dust had settled considering the articles of membership that it has breached However Juncker and co made me eat my words with their statements and i too have reversed my opinion Edited October 3, 2017 by Ally Bongo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mox Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 2 hours ago, kumnio said: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-41493014 The King of Spain criticises the Catalans for organising the vote, however no comment about police brutality and the systematic beating of his 'subjects'. That is incredible, utterly incredible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alibi Posted October 4, 2017 Share Posted October 4, 2017 The king of Spain is in essence a successor to Franco, is he not? Ironic to hear an unelected monarch complaining about a referendum being "undemocratic". The EU stance is pretty much the same as their attitude to our indyref. Their default position is that "unity" trumps everything. Never mind the violence and the distortion of democracy. I voted to remain in the EU and I probably still would, but they really need to think a bit harder about the statements they put out. The EU appears to be supporting the bad guys. Instinctively, that looks very wrong to me. The Catalans seem to value peace, otherwise they would probably have been getting stuck right into the Spanish police. Right at this moment, the only thing preventing an impending civil war looks like the fact that the Catalan independence movement, like the Scottish one, is a peaceful democratic movement. Things might change if Spain elects for military action once indy is declared, but the situation is on a knife edge. As usual, the UK government has taken the side of the baddies too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flora MaDonald Posted October 4, 2017 Share Posted October 4, 2017 They say the King called the army off in the 1981 military coup, which is a complete and utter lie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParisInAKilt Posted October 4, 2017 Share Posted October 4, 2017 http://www.gearoidocolmain.org/catalan-independence-tool-capital-labour/ Different perceptive Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alibi Posted October 4, 2017 Share Posted October 4, 2017 1 hour ago, ParisInAKilt said: http://www.gearoidocolmain.org/catalan-independence-tool-capital-labour/ Different perceptive Fell asleep reading that. Got to the bit where he claimed that less than 40% of the population voted and deduced that he had an agenda. If you can precis it in less than 100 words, let me know... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParisInAKilt Posted October 4, 2017 Share Posted October 4, 2017 6 minutes ago, Alibi said: Fell asleep reading that. Got to the bit where he claimed that less than 40% of the population voted and deduced that he had an agenda. If you can precis it in less than 100 words, let me know... Don’t we all have an agenda? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaid Posted October 4, 2017 Share Posted October 4, 2017 This is a general point, but I think nowadays people view impartiality by the media towards any given subject by allowing both sides of an argument to outline their own partial views. There's nothing wrong with that but it's not exactly what impartial reporting should be. That is someone who is impartial outlining both sides of the argument and outlining both the strong points and the flaws in both sides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave78 Posted October 4, 2017 Share Posted October 4, 2017 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Alibi said: Fell asleep reading that. Got to the bit where he claimed that less than 40% of the population voted and deduced that he had an agenda. If you can precis it in less than 100 words, let me know... Basically this Catalan thing is all part of a Masonic conspiracy led by one-percenters like George Soros to create a neoliberal European superstate with them in charge. Skip to the last paragraph: " Now, Soros and co want to ‘change things’ a little more. It is time to divide the Spanish proletariat by turning Spain’s nationalities into fake ‘nations’ fully under the control of a corporate European super-state. After Catalonia, more will follow. The European Union is quietly watching as Spain is torn apart.Europe will go through a period of crisis and chaos. It is a necessary step towards the messianic ordo ab chao to come. " Edited October 4, 2017 by Dave78 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParisInAKilt Posted October 4, 2017 Share Posted October 4, 2017 2 minutes ago, Dave78 said: Basically this Catalan thing is all part of a Masonic conspiracy led by one-percenters like George Soros to create a neoliberal European superstate with them in charge. Skip to the last paragraph: " Now, Soros and co want to ‘change things’ a little more. It is time to divide the Spanish proletariat by turning Spain’s nationalities into fake ‘nations’ fully under the control of a corporate European super-state. After Catalonia, more will follow. The European Union is quietly watching as Spain is torn apart.Europe will go through a period of crisis and chaos. It is a necessary step towards the messianic ordo ab chao to come. " Doesn’t sound that far fetched. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PapofGlencoe Posted October 4, 2017 Share Posted October 4, 2017 (edited) The Catalans have been called too poor to be independent, too rich and selfish, nazis, anti sistemas..pretty much everything. Glad to see new world order conspiracy is in there now too. I can only speak for what I know. The people I know there are decent, hospitable people just wanting to vote. None of these extremes. Sure they're probably independent supporters of some variation (never really asked them) but they are no radicals. Many non-independence supporters want a legal vote too. A huge majority (probably more now) in all opinion polls shows this. Just shouting it's illegal doesn't help anybody. No analysis of the reasons why it is illegal or any dialogue to allow them a legal vote. Just a brick wall. It's very disappointing the great powers just line up behind the status quo for their own reasons. The catalans have been asking for a vote peacefully for years - what more can they do? Isn't this what Europe tells people to do. Vote democratically? Not every group has a right to decide their future but Catalunya has all the basic competencies. You'll never finish this until they have a vote now anyway. The events of Sunday means it's inevitable. See some folk on my facebook comparing Catalonia to a mere region like Cornwall. Must have missed the leader of Cornwall getting shot for proclaiming a republic not even 80 years ago. They've struggled more than Scotland has in 50 years but because of some vagary of history they're told they have no right. Or rather, you have a right as long as the state agrees. When the state violently or even legally tells you, you're not allowed an opinion it doesn't solve the problem. This will run and run. ps watch Carles Puigdemont's interview with Ajazeera. They just want a vote. If it's free and fair they'll respect the result. This is no coup. It's democracy. Edited October 4, 2017 by PapofGlencoe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ally Bongo Posted October 4, 2017 Author Share Posted October 4, 2017 In lieu of Catalonia's UDI in the next few days the Spanish military is starting to arrive there in large numbers. This really has the potential for another Spanish civil war All it would have taken was for the EU to quickly point out to Spain that any more article breaches could result in their membership being reviewed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckielugger Posted October 4, 2017 Share Posted October 4, 2017 Anyone know if there are any Catalan military forces? ie like Scotland has regiments etc....and if there are any, wonder if any personnel in them would back the new state against the ruling Spanish forces, should the situation end up in a military conflict (and the way Spain is behaving so far, that IS a possibility) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ally Bongo Posted October 4, 2017 Author Share Posted October 4, 2017 (edited) 14 minutes ago, buckielugger said: Anyone know if there are any Catalan military forces? ie like Scotland has regiments etc....and if there are any, wonder if any personnel in them would back the new state against the ruling Spanish forces, should the situation end up in a military conflict (and the way Spain is behaving so far, that IS a possibility) It doesnt It has it's own Police force which replaced both the Spanish Civil Guard (military wing) and Spanish National Police Corps in the early 90s The rub is that the new Police force is completely civilian The Catalan Police refused to shut down polling stations which is why the Civil Guard was sent in by Madrid to disrupt the referendum Edited October 4, 2017 by Ally Bongo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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